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Just saw Justice League!

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  • Hand-of-Omega
    replied
    Originally posted by Second Chances View Post
    I'm curious about how Bob and Andre (who I both love) ended up with such different takeaways on Flash and Aquaman. i'm feeling like that probably contributes to their highly different opinions.

    All the more reason to see it for yourself, to find out where you stand. Bob is welcome to his opinion, but I dislike that he actively encourages people not to see it (which most of the people in the comments automatically agree not to). I allow that I could be wrong about the movie, and I'm open to modifying my opinion with time and persuasive arguments, but let people make up their own damn minds...

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  • Second Chances
    replied
    Originally posted by Hand-of-Omega View Post
    Probably not as penetratingly "deep" as MovieBob, but this review is much closer, pretty much spot on, to how I thought and felt about JL.
    I'm curious about how Bob and Andre (who I both love) ended up with such different takeaways on Flash and Aquaman. i'm feeling like that probably contributes to their highly different opinions.

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  • Hand-of-Omega
    replied
    Probably not as penetratingly "deep" as MovieBob, but this review is much closer, pretty much spot on, to how I thought and felt about JL.

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  • Hand-of-Omega
    replied
    Originally posted by Second Chances View Post
    This is a bit of a loaded question, since you and Bob clearly have a difference of opinion on this one: how would you respond to MovieBob's review of Justice League?
    Full Disclosure: I only recently got into MovieBob, so have only seen a couple of his videos, so far. I really like what I've seen of his work, and can't recommend his "Really that bad?" of Batman vs Superman enough (tho I don't agree with everything in it; he liked Snyder's take on Perry White, for example, which I loathe); I'm hoping he breaks his rule of only doing that once to also take on Transformers The Last Knight, which I honestly felt was even *worse* than BvS! However, I hadn't seen this review till you linked it, and since that was last night after getting home from work, decided to mull it over a bit so I could give a considered response.

    I think MB is how a lot of us geeks see ourselves, or at least would like to be: Very intelligent, analytical, and with appropriately high standards of taste. But as I grow older, that last bit troubles me more, especially as I interact more with the internet. Sometimes I wonder if we can have our standards ratcheted up TOO high, which is just one factor that has led to the current feeding frenzy of negativity in online reviews (this is also something I praise MB for, actively trying to promote more positivity online with his "Really That Good" series).

    MB's review is one possible example of how knowing TOO much about something might negatively influence your impressions about it. In this case, not just behind the scenes drama, but also his observations of how the movie visually looks.

    Not that he's entirely wrong in what he says! I just question the harshness of his conclusions. Does it have flaws? Yes, I though the pacing was off in spots, and some of the humor felt a little forced and fell flat (you can practically see the memos flying from WB urging them to pump up the jokes, and if you're familiar with Whedon's work, you'll definitely be able to pick out many of his lines); the pacing I attribute to the film being worked on by two different directors, as well as time mandates from the studio, so I'll give that a pass, and a lot of the humor worked for me, and the audience. His comments about the movie's visual color tone are interesting, I'll just say that I didn't notice anything off-putting with the look of the costumes, but maybe his eyes are better-trained to notice that sort of thing than mine are. There were a couple of green screens that even I noticed, so maybe they'll really stand out to others.

    I DO agree wholeheartedly with him about the villain. He's spot-on there. This guy was essentially CG Ronan the Accuser from GotG, only with an even vaguer backstory and motivation. Still, he fulfilled his purpose of being the Big Bad Threat to draw the heroes together, so perhaps it was better to have a disposable villain rather than someone really good. And you've seen the way he's finally dealt with a thousand times before...

    I think the main thing I actively take issue with is his belief that the film is nothing but scenes of jokes and dynamic action scenes. Unless he saw a different cut than I did, I clearly remember several scenes of characters just talking and bonding with no jokes or action in sight. I didn't feel at all that there was NO narrative connective tissue, and the movie flowed well, despite the odd pacing issues mentioned before. Danny Elfman's score was decent to good, the best parts being the return of classic versions of the characters' themes, such as his own Batman theme.

    I dunno, at the end of the day, all I can say is, we all enjoyed ourselves and had fun, the audience roared, and my friends and I talked about the movie and what may come after it at Dell Taco till they kicked us out. Maybe we were biased at finally getting to see the damn thing, and early, to boot. Maybe my opinion will change with repeat viewings, I'm open-minded enough to admit that. Maybe I'm just happy that the course is clearly being corrected, and don't expect them to get it all right in one go, esp as they just got rid of the guy responsible for most of those mistakes in the middle of production (Snyder has effectively been fired from the DCEU, although no one wants to say it that way). But we sure did get a charge from seeing THE most iconic superheroes, not just in DC, but in *the World*, finally up on the big screen being done right!

    Incidentally, I'm sure some of the fans of the DCEU up to this point will criticize it for being "too Marvel", which is a charge I find...odd. You know who created fun, light-hearted superhero adventures? DC! Superman and friends quite literally wrote the book on that sort of thing! MARVEL were the ones who built a rep on being more realistic, darker and grounded (for the time), and now, someone both companies have switched positions in the movies (tho not on tv, interestingly). DC films becoming lighter and more optimistic is not them copying Marvel per se, it's simply being true to the original source material.

    MB also had an interesting point about how, for all its failings, at least BvS tried to be *about* something, and this movie is basically just "gather the heroes to save the world". While we can all agree that complexity (done right) is often a good, it does NOT follow that simplicity must therefore be "bad". I think we sometimes confuse complexity and "meaningful issues" for profundity, when there is often nothing wrong with a simple, straight-forward adventure story. I don't think it's fair to penalize a movie for not trying to be something it isn't.

    I found the characters to be fairly well established and interacted, although I'm expecting something like GotG, where it will take a second movie to see them gel really well. But I'm looking forward to the ride!

    Well, I seem to be going on more than I thought I would and it's time to head back to work now (I was gonna do a small review in the Movies thread, but this is basically what I was going to say there anyway, so...), so I'm just gonna post instead of editing this as well as I normally would, so please be as tolerant of my flaws as much as I hope you are of this movies'. FWIW, I still count myself a MovieBob fan! Not sure why so many people break off with others when they disagree with them, but you CAN disagree with someone and still like them or their work! But that's a rant for another time...

    TL/DR




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  • AnubisXy
    replied
    Originally posted by Second Chances View Post
    This is a bit of a loaded question, since you and Bob clearly have a difference of opinion on this one: how would you respond to MovieBob's review of Justice League?
    I got back from watching it and find myself agreeing with MovieBob. It's a luke-warm mess. Definitely not the worst superhero movie of all time, and definitely a bit better than Batman v Superman, but I wish I had waited to see it in the dollar theater.

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  • TyrannicalRabbit
    replied
    Originally posted by Second Chances View Post
    This is a bit of a loaded question, since you and Bob clearly have a difference of opinion on this one: how would you respond to MovieBob's review of Justice League?
    Having watched that review. Yeah about what I was expecting. I look forward to the Red Letter Media skewering of it.
    Last edited by TyrannicalRabbit; 11-15-2017, 09:15 PM.

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  • Second Chances
    replied
    This is a bit of a loaded question, since you and Bob clearly have a difference of opinion on this one: how would you respond to MovieBob's review of Justice League?

    Leave a comment:


  • Hand-of-Omega
    replied
    Originally posted by Prometheus878 View Post

    Okay, next question. Do I lose out if I haven't seen Man of Steel or BvS : DoJ?
    Not really. The tone is completely different, you can clearly see the impact Joss Whedon had in the movie. Very little from those movies is present here, and only about 3 characters from them show up, and their time is limited, with Alfred getting the most screentime. Unless you've gone out of your way to avoid learning about the previous movies, you are probably already aware of the major plot points that are relevant here, and even if you're not, the movie hits you with it first thing, so I can't imagine you'd really be lost.

    Honestly, you might be more lost if you haven't seen Wonder Woman...

    BTW, stay past the end credits for a reveal that brought the house down!

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  • Prometheus878
    replied
    Originally posted by Hand-of-Omega View Post

    Yes, IMO. Very entertaining, solid character work, dynamic action, much more coherent story than BvS. Basically, DC knows where the problems are and have course-corrected. I predict that it will do *very* well at the BO.

    General consensus among my friends was that it was not as good as Avengers, but better than Avengers 2, FWTW (I liked A2, and never understood the hate it got, but whatever).
    Okay, next question. Do I lose out if I haven't seen Man of Steel or BvS : DoJ?

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  • Hand-of-Omega
    replied
    Originally posted by Prometheus878 View Post
    Well, I guess I'll ask the obvious question:

    Was it as good as Wonder Woman?
    Yes, IMO. Very entertaining, solid character work, dynamic action, much more coherent story than BvS. Basically, DC knows where the problems are and have course-corrected. I predict that it will do *very* well at the BO.

    General consensus among my friends was that it was not as good as Avengers, but better than Avengers 2, FWTW (I liked A2, and never understood the hate it got, but whatever).

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  • Prometheus878
    replied
    Well, I guess I'll ask the obvious question:

    Was it as good as Wonder Woman?

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  • Hand-of-Omega
    replied
    No questions? No one wants to know anything about it?

    Fair enough.

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