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You Know What I Hate MK I

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  • Originally posted by Heavy Arms View Post
    Um... because all of the reasons people have been protesting the US's broken policing system?
    But why was it not fixed before? Why now?

    Why wasn't it built correctly in the first place? why didn't anyone say 'this is fucked up'. The first time a police shot someone and used qualified immunity to escape jusice?

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    • Are you seriously asking, or just venting? It's really hard to tell.

      Originally posted by Accelerator View Post
      The first time a police shot someone and used qualified immunity to escape jusice?
      That's not how qualified immunity works. Qualified immunity only applies to civil lawsuits against agents of the state. It's just rubbing salt in the wounds of injustice after all the ways the police can avoid criminal penalties for violating your rights, so that you can't even sue them for doing it.

      While I'm not familiar with the specific instance cited, I'd imagine civil forfeiture abuse is the more prominent loophole to address when it comes to the police seizing property.

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      • The value of all property taken by civil asset forfeiture in the United States, in dollars, is greater than all reported thefts put together.

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        • Originally posted by Accelerator View Post
          Why wasn't it built correctly in the first place?
          Because as an institution, modern-style policing was established in the first place to keep the people with fewer rights in check. It was adapted from a network of slave-catching patrols, and so for all of the "Protect and Serve" decals they slap on their gear, the police have never been there to protect you.

          In fact, the courts know it. They got a chance to weigh in on the matter after Joseph Lozito was stabbed seven times, mostly in the head fighting off a serial killer while police looked on in the very next subway car. The cops only came in after he had subdued the killer, and then didn't even so much as call an ambulance, let alone give him the credit for nabbing Maksim Gelman. The courts ruled that the police were under no obligation to step in and protect Lozito.

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          • Originally posted by Heavy Arms View Post
            Are you seriously asking, or just venting? It's really hard to tell.



            That's not how qualified immunity works. Qualified immunity only applies to civil lawsuits against agents of the state. It's just rubbing salt in the wounds of injustice after all the ways the police can avoid criminal penalties for violating your rights, so that you can't even sue them for doing it.

            While I'm not familiar with the specific instance cited, I'd imagine civil forfeiture abuse is the more prominent loophole to address when it comes to the police seizing property.
            Venting. It seems remarkably and incredibly fucked up that your own law enforcement is so.... well, your enemy. Maybe I'm just biased or immersed in propaganda, but Singapore police didn't seem to have this problem.

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            • Originally posted by Accelerator View Post
              Venting. It seems remarkably and incredibly fucked up that your own law enforcement is so.... well, your enemy. Maybe I'm just biased or immersed in propaganda, but Singapore police didn't seem to have this problem.

              I dunno about Singapore, but Les Miserables would suggest it's at least been an issue in Europe at some points.


              A god is just a monster you kneel to. - ArcaneArts, Quoting "Fall of Gods"

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              • Originally posted by Accelerator View Post
                Venting. It seems remarkably and incredibly fucked up that your own law enforcement is so.... well, your enemy. Maybe I'm just biased or immersed in propaganda, but Singapore police didn't seem to have this problem.
                Well, there's two big things.

                1) Singapore has a very nasty reputation among international human rights organization because it hides issues of abuse of power by refusing to account for its massive resident alien/migrant workforce in statistics. Citizens of Singapore report high rates of satisfaction with the police (unless you're a gay man, or don't like caning as a legal form of punishment), which heavily skews things when it ignores how all the non-citizen workers in Singapore feel (which is generally not so good). This is particularly notable when that means 20%-25% of the people living in Singapore are effectively ignored by the government for measuring how the people living there actually feel about things.

                2) Singapore is comparatively a very young country, that had a lot of lessons to take from British Common Law and local traditions when constructing it's law enforcement structures. When Singapore became an independent country, "police" was already a thing that the founders could account for. The USA isn't exactly an old country, but it's old enough that like most of Europe (like the above Les Mis reference) when it was founded, the modern concept of police wasn't a thing. Policing is something that evolved over time from different previous ideas of law enforcement.

                This is part of the reason the US system is so screwed up. It wasn't "designed" or "constructed." It's a mash up of centuries of alterations to what law enforcement is, what responsibilities it has, what powers it has, and what controls there are on it.
                Last edited by Heavy Arms; 06-22-2020, 08:23 PM.

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                • Man, I was just in the process of loving Terese Nielsen’s art for the hot men but then found out about all the crazy things she believes like Alex Jones and al-right celebs.


                  The no.1 fan of Demetheus. I also draw Exalted things and is looking for commission works ~

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                  • Originally posted by Jen View Post
                    Man, I was just in the process of loving Terese Nielsen’s art for the hot men but then found out about all the crazy things she believes like Alex Jones and al-right celebs.
                    Ah, alex jones.

                    Know what I hate? Realizing that in a country somewhere, someone is probably picking up a gun and preparing to shoot a school.

                    And that there are these little ghouls here to shout that it's all fake actors.

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                    • Apparently Nazi occultists are actually a real thing in 2020 and not pretend Delta Green antagonists.


                      You've been playing around the magic that is black
                      But all the powerful magical mysteries never gave a single thing back

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                      • Originally posted by Dwight View Post
                        Apparently Nazi occultists are actually a real thing in 2020 and not pretend Delta Green antagonists.
                        I do really wish I could still enjoy Delta Green. It turns out "armed vigilantes with no oversight" is a fantasy that's really soured with age, and an old Facebook argument where one of the devs refused to accept that the Tcho-Tcho are a racist as hell bit of writing.


                        Remi. she/her. game designer.

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                        • Originally posted by atamajakki View Post

                          I do really wish I could still enjoy Delta Green. It turns out "armed vigilantes with no oversight" is a fantasy that's really soured with age, and an old Facebook argument where one of the devs refused to accept that the Tcho-Tcho are a racist as hell bit of writing.
                          The most recent edition split the conspiracy so you have the "armed vigilantes" camp called the Outlaws and the "Deep State" type shadow government group called "The Program."


                          You've been playing around the magic that is black
                          But all the powerful magical mysteries never gave a single thing back

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                          • Originally posted by Dwight View Post

                            The most recent edition split the conspiracy so you have the "armed vigilantes" camp called the Outlaws and the "Deep State" type shadow government group called "The Program."
                            I'm well aware. It doesn't make either of them read any less like a conservative power fantasy.


                            Remi. she/her. game designer.

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                            • The whole 'fight the man!' part of the old mage the ascension handbook is now really cringy.

                              What with the 'nwo', vaccines. And everything.

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                              • Originally posted by Accelerator View Post
                                The whole 'fight the man!' part of the old mage the ascension handbook is now really cringy.

                                What with the 'nwo', vaccines. And everything.
                                Worry not,the most recent publications fix that.

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