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  • Transgender as an adjective is acceptable, like "A Transgender woman". Using as "Transgendered" is incorrect and offensive, be it as an adjective or verb. As a noun is it not acceptable, just like Male and Female are not.

    So "A Transgender woman" is correct.
    "A Transgendered woman" is incorrect.
    "A Transgender" or "Some Transgenders" is incorrect.
    "A Transgender Female" is incorrect, though "A transgender female human" is correct.

    Does this help? I realize it can be confusing.

    ETA: And it is all confusing. "Gay" tends to be an adjective ("A Gay Man" is correct but "A Gay" is not, really, but Lesbian can easily be a noun or adjective "A lesbian" or "A lesbian woman" is correct. Bisexual or Homosexual can be either, but sound better as adjectives, they can be offensive as nouns.

    This may be helpful as well, though it gets into terms even unknown to me.
    Last edited by Baroness Nerak; 12-04-2017, 06:16 AM.


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    • I haven't said much in this discussion because there's many people who have explained much better than I could, and I don't want to try to talk over any trans people here about trans issues, but I can interject and confirm that I'd be quite uncomfortable if people were to use bisexual as a noun. I wouldn't assume it's used as a slur, but it feels dehumanizing to be reduced to one attribute.


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      • Originally posted by Baroness Nerak View Post
        Does this help? I realize it can be confusing.
        No okay, it cleared things up a bit, thank you.
        Only a question: would "transgender people" be fine or still feel too broad and considering people for a single episode?

        ETA: And it is all confusing. "Gay" tends to be an adjective ("A Gay Man" is correct but "A Gay" is not, really, but Lesbian can easily be a noun or adjective "A lesbian" or "A lesbian woman" is correct. Bisexual or Homosexual can be either, but sound better as adjectives, they can be offensive as nouns.
        In my country all these words are both used as nouns and adjectives; also, our language allows in many circumstances to omit the subject when it's obvious so most of the times we just use them that way. Weirdly, but maybe not so much, the only ones used as slurs are the ones referred to males: I've heard several times "homosexual" used to insult a man (even for things unrelated to his own sex life, among friends it's like calling people idiots) but never to demean a woman. Culture is odd.

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        • Originally posted by Tessie View Post
          I haven't said much in this discussion because there's many people who have explained much better than I could, and I don't want to try to talk over any trans people here about trans issues, but I can interject and confirm that I'd be quite uncomfortable if people were to use bisexual as a noun. I wouldn't assume it's used as a slur, but it feels dehumanizing to be reduced to one attribute.
          Agreed, I am not crazy about being called a homosexual. Better as an adjective.


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          • Originally posted by Maris Streck View Post
            What did I say was that AMABs are kept out from the female locker rooms by the very same fear of males that keeps males out of them.
            To return to this subject (if anyone's still interested in a discussion). I think you are mistaken about cause and effect. The locker room gate keeping is a matter of transphobia. The "keep men out of women's lockers" argument is just an excuse. You'll find that there is very little overlap between the groups that want to keep trans women out of women's locker rooms and the groups that are actually serious about trying to combat sexual harassment or rape.


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            • Originally posted by Maris Streck View Post
              In my country all these words are both used as nouns and adjectives; also, our language allows in many circumstances to omit the subject when it's obvious so most of the times we just use them that way. Weirdly, but maybe not so much, the only ones used as slurs are the ones referred to males: I've heard several times "homosexual" used to insult a man (even for things unrelated to his own sex life, among friends it's like calling people idiots) but never to demean a woman. Culture is odd.
              Yeah, this is always one of the big issues with people who aren't native English speakers when they speak English. A lot of times things that might be perfectly innocent in one language come across as very rude or even outright offensive in English, and the non-native speaker has absolutely no idea that what they said made someone mad or why it made them mad. I have a lot of friends who aren't native English speakers and see they run into issues a lot, especially when dealing with really technical and highly charged language (such as language involve race, gender and sex) where if you say the wrong thing or use a word in the wrong way, even by accident, people might get very angry.

              So it's always important, when someone who isn't a native English speaker says something that might sound offensive, for the native English speaker to go, "Wait, did you realize that what you said is kind of offensive in English, here's why it's offense, and did you actually mean to be offensive?" before accusing them of being offensive and getting mad at them.
              Last edited by AnubisXy; 12-04-2017, 08:36 AM.

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              • Originally posted by Tessie View Post
                To return to this subject (if anyone's still interested in a discussion). I think you are mistaken about cause and effect. The locker room gate keeping is a matter of transphobia. The "keep men out of women's lockers" argument is just an excuse. You'll find that there is very little overlap between the groups that want to keep trans women out of women's locker rooms and the groups that are actually serious about trying to combat sexual harassment or rape.
                But we already had split locker rooms before transgender people became this common and raised the issue. For whatever reason you may find in history (protecting the family reputation, protecting the men from temptations and sin, etc...) women always had separate rooms to change in, so I highly doubt it's just an excuse. My point is that the two groups don't need to overlap at all, because even a chauvinistic white man used to sexually harass his female employees is going to demand a changing room where his lovely daughter won't be seen or touched by other men; my point is that even a respectable old lady is going to advocate how it's morally demeaning for a female to be seen half-naked by a man she's not married to. Not to mention how Sudan or Saudi Arabia won't allow any of their female athletes to ever join the Olympics if they had mixed locker rooms.

                This is why I think this issue is so hard to fix: there are a lot of interests and cultural quirks entangled together, the poor trans man just got caught in the middle. =p
                Last edited by Maris Streck; 12-04-2017, 02:56 PM.

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                • There comes a time where you have to stop worrying about what bigots think. They got used to mixed race bathrooms and locker rooms when they had to. They can get used to putting all the women in the women's locker room and the men in the men's.


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                  • As an aside, Any LGBTQ+ discussion is welcome in this thread. If you have specific questions on/for Transgender people because you are confused or not sure the word to use or anything like that, there is a thread here that is specifically for answering questions from people who are honestly not sure about one thing or the other. While rude or trolling behavior will be moderated like anywhere else, there is a little more room there if you are not sure what to say or how to ask a question. That thread is not a place for news or general discussion of trans folks and our rights, that goes here or other LGBTQ+ threads. But if you have a question and are not sure how to ask? That thread is a good place, and you my find your answer reviewing it. If not, m̶a̶s̶o̶c̶h̶i̶s̶t̶i̶c̶ helpful trans folks will answer best we can.


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                    • So coming back to the LGBT+ activism... I just made semi-official that my Lublin local fantastic ( and RPGs ) club 'Cytadela Syriusza' ( eng. 'Sirius Citadel' ) - that I go on popular science lectures and I run my CoD chronicles - is LGBT+ friendly. Unofficially, I know it for years now - about at least year before my Coming Out, because I talked then about my orientation with previous chairman that is also open gay, and there are few other nonhetero people working in it - but today it become semi-official because...

                      I gave 'Cytadela Syriusza' educational package 'Orientuj Się' ( eng. 'Orient Yourself' ) about LGBT+ people from our Marriage Equality foundation 'Miłość Nie Wyklucza' ( eng. 'Love Does not Exclude' ) I put my tax money into from last half decade. Orientuj Się is 6 brochures summing up now knowledge about various LGBT+ topics for teenagers - like 'Is it cureable?' ( Yes, it still need to be said from time to time in Poland ), 'What are all those letters?', 'Who are Trans people?', 'When to Come Out?', 'How to help LGBT+ people?', 'What are Rainbow Families?', etc. - and small Handbook about Marriage Equality and Rainbow Families. I must say I found Handbook somehow fascinating, as some terms and norms have changed in last 5-6 years when I dwelled in to topic of LGBT+ movement and started to convince people to it first chance on passing Civil Union law in Poland in 2012 year - and some stories shown in Handbook are very moving. Some are also very sad, as many times they ended with 'we needed to migrate to other country' or 'our homeland do not respect our laws to marriage or family'. None the less, I gave Orientuj Się package to Cytadela - and my friendly librarian from there put brochures and Handbook on the counter - so when you rent books from club, you see them and can make quick look. Cytadela did not putted poster of action on their doors, but it's because that club headquarter is in the poorer district of Lublin, with many far right or violent people in the nearby. Still, my RPG club is finally promotes reliable knowledge about LGBT+ topics in general public!

                      I was last Saturday on the meeting with local LGBT+ organization ( 'Tęczowy Lublln' - eng. Rainbow Lublin ) on this very topic of Orientuj Się action, where I get the package and made some connection in local community OUTSIDE of my day to day nonhetero from fantasists and hobbyists crowd. We also talked about possibility of some proLGBT+ actions in Lublin. One of possible options was to organize showing of documentary movie about Marriage (In)Equality in Poland called 'Artykuł 18' ( eng. Article 18 ) - it's title is reference to infamous 18th point of Poland's Constitution stating ( in English ):

                      'Marriage, being a union of a man and a woman, as well as the family, motherhood and parenthood, shall be placed under the protection and care of the Republic of Poland.'

                      And this very Article is most often used as legal standing for NOT giving law regulations on the same sex couples in Poland. ( Even if this law is clearly not banning everything outside hetero marriage. ) Documentary movie is showing real life and legal implications of this law in our Constitution.

                      You can watch this movie here ( with English subtitles ) and we have English trailer below.

                      Last edited by wyrdhamster; 12-04-2017, 11:29 PM.


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                      • 'stralia baby woo!


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