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[Pirates of Pugmire] Mystic is not mystical

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  • [Pirates of Pugmire] Mystic is not mystical

    In my point of view, Mystic Calling from Pirates of Pugmire is… well, not mystical. The name Calling does not reflect the power that the group gives. Let’s look into Pirates fluff about Mystics….

    ‘Some cats are destined for the sea. Even those mystics who don’t crew with pirates feel the Acid Sea’s inexorable call; it powers their magic even as they yearn for its song. Cats who take up the mantle of mystic are as the ocean: depthless, frothing, swinging from placid calm to raging torrents at any sign of trouble. They hold deep secrets beneath their skin, and they feel more
    alive near water than anywhere on dry land.
    Other cats sometimes view mystics as strange, as many cats are at least slightly averse to water. While most pirate cats overcome their distaste to enjoy life aboard a ship, mystics fully embrace it, loving the feel of the salt in their fur and the wind at their backs. They are equally at home with beasts of land and sea, preferring their wild, natural state to being cooped up in cities or
    towns.’

    And in other races frame:

    ‘Birds can be natural mystics, though they refer to this calling as a soothsayer. Other birds may view them with suspicion, seeing the sea quite the opposite of the Sky Kingdom, but they’re also viewed as assets to crews. Lizards, however, make excellent mystics, and they are viewed as not dissimilar to alkalists, as salt and sea go paw in paw. A lizard who takes up this calling is called a magus.‘

    Sentence: ‘Even those mystics who don’t crew with pirates feel the Acid Sea’s inexorable call; it powers their magic even as they yearn for its song.’ – imply using magic by them.
    Sentence: ‘A lizard who takes up this calling is called a magus.‘´- imply really spellcasting Calling.

    And this example later on:
    ‘A bird who harnesses wind and water into everything they do, including spellcasting.’ – it directly states spellcasting of the Calling.

    So, generally, Mystic Calling is described as, de facto, ‘Sea Druid’ – when using D&D terms. However, in mechanics sections we have:
    ‘Calling knacks: Tracker or Wanderer’

    Tracker is Mau Calling that works as D&D Ranger. So it’s Secrets can work as ‘nature oriented’ part of the ‘Druid’ that Mystic are described. But Wanderer is Mau Calling that works as D&D Monk class – it’s Secrets are martial arts and imbuing fists with elemental damage. It surely not spellcasting Calling abilities.

    So I think that Mystic – to be true to it’s name and text descriptions – should have ‘Calling knacks: Tracker or Minister’ write-up. It would simply be more logical for it to fulfill role of ‘Sea Druid’. Agree with me? If not – why do you think that Wanderer works in this mix?


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  • #2
    Reminder, regardless of which Calling you turn to you can still pick up the starting Knack not chosen and any refinements thereof666, and Mystic gets the option of Beast Master or Mancy to start out. So Mystic gets the Mancer spell list already. Giving Tracker or Minister opens it up to having both Mancer and Minister, which, while not the same level of problem as it might be in an older edition of D&D is not a can of worms that the devs seem interested in opening. As an aside, taking Wanderer as your Calling doesn't just mean your Mystic can throw a punch instead of a spell. Your Mystic may just have inherent grace of mind (Still Mind) and Body (Inner Feline and/or Unarmored Defense).

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    • #3
      Originally posted by AutoDefenestrate View Post
      Reminder, regardless of which Calling you turn to you can still pick up the starting Knack not chosen and any refinements thereof666, and Mystic gets the option of Beast Master or Mancy to start out. So Mystic gets the Mancer spell list already.
      Yeah, I missed that. It's still weird you can take Mancy, but not have whole Mancer Calling Knacks list, instead of 'Tracker or Wanderer' one. Like, should not Mystic be then simply 'Tracker or Mancer' mixing?

      Originally posted by AutoDefenestrate View Post
      Giving Tracker or Minister opens it up to having both Mancer and Minister, which, while not the same level of problem as it might be in an older edition of D&D is not a can of worms that the devs seem interested in opening.
      Okay, get one from previous line I answered. I still not see why Mystic combination is simply not 'Tracker or Mancer'.

      Originally posted by AutoDefenestrate View Post
      As an aside, taking Wanderer as your Calling doesn't just mean your Mystic can throw a punch instead of a spell. Your Mystic may just have inherent grace of mind (Still Mind) and Body (Inner Feline and/or Unarmored Defense).
      It's still not proper spellcasting that Callings description in preview mention few times...


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      • #4
        Well... you can poke Eddy, or you can wait for the final PDF to see if changes, or if not suggest it as an errata as part of that process? Errors in the preview PDFs happen.

        I can see the case either way, so the worst thing? House rule it.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by wyrdhamster View Post
          It's still not proper spellcasting that Callings description in preview mention few times...
          I’m not sure I understand your issue, here. Mystics have access to Mancy, and may refine it the same way a mancer can. They’re definitely spellcasters.


          Jason Ross Inczauskis, Freelance Writer
          Currently writing: Dark Eras 2, Mummy: The Curse 2e, Pirates of Pugmire, TC In Media Res. Previous projects: DtD Night Horrors: Enemy Action; C20 Anthology of Dreams
          Masculine pronouns preferred.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by wyrdhamster View Post

            Yeah, I missed that. It's still weird you can take Mancy, but not have whole Mancer Calling Knacks list, instead of 'Tracker or Wanderer' one. Like, should not Mystic be then simply 'Tracker or Mancer' mixing?
            The point is to not have the Pirate Callings be carbon copies of other callings available. They also don't mix, once you choose a Calling to take your Knacks from you're locked in. You've got the two options for Starting Knacks and the Calling Knacks of only one other Calling. Also to be noted, for every spellcasting Calling we have only the base Knack and refinements of it are required to be a spellcaster. A level 5 Mystic who only refines Mancy is the same as a level 5 Mancer who did the same, except one's carrying a sword and the materials they use as a focus. The only other Secret from Mancer that makes them castery is Spellweaver, which allows for metamagic, and in fact they're the only ones who get anything like that, well them and and Alkalist who went down that road. A Mystic taking Wanderer Knacks is an ascetic, who channels their magic with great intuition and inward understanding. They can fire bolts of force, soothe and command animals, and perhaps strike an arrow out of the air with naught but their bare paw.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by AutoDefenestrate View Post
              They also don't mix, once you choose a Calling to take your Knacks from you're locked in.
              Wait, I understand that whole idea of 'Calling knacks: A or B’ was that on, for example, level 2 I take Knack from Calling A - and at level 3 I can take it from Calling B. I may still take Calling from A at level 3, but I have option to take from Calling B. That was my reading of the rules till yet. I read them wrong?

              Or do you mean that once chosen spellcaster Calling you are based from, your spells and magical abilities comes from only this?

              Originally posted by AutoDefenestrate View Post
              Also to be noted, for every spellcasting Calling we have only the base Knack and refinements of it are required to be a spellcaster. A level 5 Mystic who only refines Mancy is the same as a level 5 Mancer who did the same, except one's carrying a sword and the materials they use as a focus. The only other Secret from Mancer that makes them castery is Spellweaver, which allows for metamagic, and in fact they're the only ones who get anything like that, well them and and Alkalist who went down that road.
              It is somewhat convincing, mechanically...

              Originally posted by AutoDefenestrate View Post
              A Mystic taking Wanderer Knacks is an ascetic, who channels their magic with great intuition and inward understanding. They can fire bolts of force, soothe and command animals, and perhaps strike an arrow out of the air with naught but their bare paw.
              They 'wizard monk' aesthetics is a bit not what I was envision reading Mystic's description...


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              • #8
                Originally posted by wyrdhamster View Post

                Wait, I understand that whole idea of 'Calling knacks: A or B’ was that on, for example, level 2 I take Knack from Calling A - and at level 3 I can take it from Calling B. I may still take Calling from A at level 3, but I have option to take from Calling B. That was my reading of the rules till yet. I read them wrong?
                I’m fairly certain that you get one or the other, though I admit I could be wrong. Given that characters can’t take knacks from callings other than their own, it would make it somewhat unbalanced to say that trackers can take tracker knacks, wanderers can take wanderer knacks, and mystics can take tracker knacks, wanderer knacks, and Mancy.


                Jason Ross Inczauskis, Freelance Writer
                Currently writing: Dark Eras 2, Mummy: The Curse 2e, Pirates of Pugmire, TC In Media Res. Previous projects: DtD Night Horrors: Enemy Action; C20 Anthology of Dreams
                Masculine pronouns preferred.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by wyrdhamster View Post

                  Wait, I understand that whole idea of 'Calling knacks: A or B’ was that on, for example, level 2 I take Knack from Calling A - and at level 3 I can take it from Calling B. I may still take Calling from A at level 3, but I have option to take from Calling B. That was my reading of the rules till yet. I read them wrong?

                  Or do you mean that once chosen spellcaster Calling you are based from, your spells and magical abilities comes from only this?
                  Let's see...
                  Originally posted by Pirates of Pugmire Preview 1
                  Calling knacks: Which tricks or secrets the calling can draw from when using improvements, in addition to any First Knacks you haven’t taken. Once you take a trick or secret from one of the options provided, all your subsequent knacks must come from the same category. Example: If your Crusader takes a Guardian trick as a new knack, all future knacks must also be from the Guardian tricks.
                  All right there in the last sentence.

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                  • #10
                    Re-read the rules about Callings Knacks - it seems you are right, one Calling Knacks or another. Which is illogical to me a bit...

                    'Calling knacks: Which tricks or secrets the calling can draw from when using improvements, in addition to any First Knacks you haven’t taken. Once you take a trick or secret from one of the options provided, all your subsequent knacks must come from the same category. Example: If your Crusader takes a Guardian trick as a new knack, all future knacks must also be from the Guardian tricks. '

                    So, basically, Crusaders are simply Guardians or Shepards, just called differently. It's... unnecessary of making new Callings here? If I cannot have real 'Paladin' class in Crusader, why to put them in first place? We already in Pugmire have Fighters ( Guardians ) and Clerics ( Shepards ). Note: Remember that in D&D, Paladin have both the powers typical for Fighter and Clerics. With above rule - it seems that Crusaders are Guardians or Shepherds, mechanically wise.
                    Last edited by wyrdhamster; 06-28-2019, 09:51 AM.


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                    • #11
                      Hey all! I'm going to be tweaking these based on feedback, but I want to point something out: You can take both First Knacks over time, and the Calling Knacks sometimes aren't the same ones as the source of the First Knacks. For example, Trackers cannot normally get Mancy. So they definitely wont' be "simply Guardiands or Shepards, just called differently." I'll make sure to spell that out in the book. And definitely keep sending me more information in the playtest form until July 1!

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by eddyfate View Post
                        I'll make sure to spell that out in the book. And definitely keep sending me more information in the playtest form until July 1!
                        I try to send everything before July 1, but if you will hang a form a week or two longer - I may have playtest materials more. My Pirates chronicle is just organizing and so my players are finding more and more weakness in Previews versions, when they create PCs. Like right now and next few days...
                        Last edited by wyrdhamster; 06-28-2019, 09:53 AM.


                        My stuff for Scion 2E, CoD Contagion, Dark Eras, VtR 2E, WtF 2E, MtAw 2E & BtP
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                        • #13
                          What differentiates a Guardian from a Crusader(Guardian)? Healing. The Shepherd Knack, it works fundamentally differently from Inspiring Word and allows a slightly different spin for you Crusader. Also, Skill options are an entirely different collection and the fact that Birds and Lizards can take the latter. What differentiates a Shepherd from a Crusader(Shepherd)? Even more, potentially. Fighting Style, d10 Stamina dice, Heavy Armor Aptitude, along with the skill and species notes mentioned above.

                          And, if you ask me, Crusaders are the Calling that cleaves closest to their Source Callings. Maybe followed by Gundogs.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by wyrdhamster View Post

                            I try to send everything before July 1, but if you will hang a form a week or two longer - I may have playtest materials more. My Pirates chronicle is just organizing and so my players are finding more and more weakness in Previews versions, when they create PCs. Like right now and next few days...

                            Sorry, but we need to keep the book moving forward!

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by eddyfate View Post
                              Sorry, but we need to keep the book moving forward!
                              I put most crucial errata already, on my POV alone. If Form disappear I will simply not give actual playtests thoughts.

                              And as we are at Errata Forms - I found a bit problem with now version of Forms. Would be glad you point to rest of developers team to a bit expand in one section Errata Forms, for future Kickstarter's projects.
                              Last edited by wyrdhamster; 07-01-2019, 12:46 PM. Reason: Adding link to other topic


                              My stuff for Scion 2E, CoD Contagion, Dark Eras, VtR 2E, WtF 2E, MtAw 2E & BtP
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