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  • #31
    Originally posted by Ferryman View Post
    Ex3 is the most uniquely troubled product I have ever seen and everyone associated with it should be ashamed. And also work faster.

    I know this is true because I am personally upset by it. Ipso facto.
    Trying to be ironic, ignoring stated points and using borderline ad personam in discussion? Nice. Points for you.
    Now could you contribute to the discussion and argue against my points, or, if you don't want to, stop trying to troll please?


    My homebrew/rewrites:
    2nd->3rd Edition Sorcery Spells Rewrite
    Talisman of Ten Thousand Eyes Evocations
    Solar Occult Charms for Sorcerers
    Solar Thrown Charms (with Solar Danmaku Charms)

    Comment


    • #32
      Everyone does realize that no one is working on Exalted as full time job, right?

      I work full time and when things get rough at work, I have trouble at times keeping up with my quest and my play by Post game. I could not imagine both developing and writing for a game line.


      I write things.

      Comment


      • #33
        Hi! My name is Lucy and I DO have some insight to the Development process because John and Holden are my best friends, and I also write on the line, On this project, between writers and devs, you've had:
        • babies born
        • people die
        • people ill
        • more people die
        • more illness
        • exams and study
        • EMOTIONS AND FEELS
        • more long term illness
        • oh wait more illness
        • (ALL THE FEELS)
        • oh look other job stuff
        • what another death, oh for fucks sake
        • (WELL FUCK MY FEELS)
        • and now everyone is sick?
        • what the fresh hell is this?
        • THAT'S IT, NO-ONE IS ALLOWED TO GET SICK
        • ...dammit that didn't work, people are still sick
        That's just the parts of the project I have worked on the past few years AND not even touching on the major mechanical stuff. I know it is super easy to link to wikipedia 'Project Management' triangles and chatter about management and make vague promises that 'no IRL I do know this stuff' but...each project is different. Each and every single one. And in particular rpgs are a cross section of publishing, art, creative writing, technical writing, project management, community management, PR, and personnel management. And are subject to the shortfalls of each and every one of those. While also being done around the edges of the mess that above list makes of your life.

        Telling writers to 'write faster' generally ends up with: poor material*, overwrought writers, and a lot more work for the person in charge, either managing them or fixing the work you got. Sure there are recalcitrant writers out there who need prodding, but mostly? Creative stuff takes time, and some of that time is invisible. It's research, it's playtesting, it's talking shit with friends and working out that the idea sucks so you have to scrap it. Or sending it in and finding out you managed to miss a whole damn section of the outline so now you have to write that in while sticking to wordcount (*eyedart*), but yeah, we do have word counts and I am unsure as to how one would 'make an author work faster' but...it's unlikely to be a profitable thing to do. I have ideas on how to manage this stuff but I'm rambling as it is, and I have other stuff to write, but managing the workload you give people, being aware of what is happening with them, and balancing finding new writers with keeping your workhorses is a fairly solid proposition.

        Like, the assumption we don't work on word counts suggests that any management experience or education is not relevant to the particulars of this situation and it is the particulars on which any project actually rests (contrary to those attempts to shift JIT, MRP and the like outside the context it was created).

        And "stop being such a perfectionist" doesn't mesh well with a community that is...less than forgiving about mistakes.

        *hopefully something fixed by increased levels of copy editing, rather than 'scrap and start over', but you can't always tell that until you get into it, and in the conext of this project leads directly into porting stuff from previous editions that may or may not apply to Ex3.

        (I am immensely grateful that none of my supervisors - be they Devs or the ones in my real life job - were 'write faster' style 'managers' when one of the above-mentioned deaths was my best friend. It meant that when I got back into my work, I was in a much better place than I would have been if I'd been working on it through that period, which in turn means better work and a lack of resentment towards it, or association of pain with it, which is important. That's why I put feels and emotions in there, because it does have an affect on work, usually for the worse.)


        ". ... for me, the transformative power of art is you are not above the material." -= Guillermo del Toro

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Steamfunk View Post

          Holy God, no. I've played almost every one of OPP's lines and I lurk in most of the forums here and I have to say that OPP is goddamn amazing as far as publishers go. There are certainly criticisms to be made but within the context of the TRPG industry and the massive IP troubles that Paradox heralded, OPP is a champ. Exalted is kinda the redheaded stepchild as far as project management has gone.

          I'm trying to focus on Scion personally, not just because it has a lore and concept that resonates with me more than any other OPP property, but also because it is up there with the very best run OPP game lines IMO (and all this while only in redlines). There is just something about the Ask Neall thread and the communications of the writers in general that fill me with a confidence that they have their clear goals and trajectories that they are heading for, it might not end up being a straight line, but there is a confidence that it won't circle back on itself over and over. Exalted just feels aimless and obscure to me right now, there could be MASSIVE progress happening on the game line right now, but in the absence of any sign of that happening I have to look back to the track record of the last 4 years and wonder has anything really changed?

          Comment


          • #35
            Anyone interested in the nature of the Devs and communication should keep in mind that many of the Exalted staff who dont post here are posting on RPG.net Daily. It isn't a matter of the Devs wanting to stay silent and work behind the scenes. Its a matter of them not needing to post here because everyone here has already bought in to EX3. Why would they need to talk to anyone here? The sale has been made, the demographic here all represent sales for each book as they trickle out. So time spent posting here and answering questions or fanning excitement is really a waste from an advertising perspective. If you want the staff to pay attention to you, talk to them on Twitter, RPG.net, or another platform where answering you would be public and good PR.

            Comment


            • #36
              At this point if I write anything negative about how project was managed I will be automatically huge heartless jerk, so I'm going to excuse myself from further discussion about that topic.

              However, I want to say one thing - you didn't really need to passively-aggressively discredit my opinion and knowledge about management in your post just because you didn't like what I wrote and that I didn't like to talk about my personal life on the forum in the Internet. And before you say you didn't - you did, especially with telling me that "each project is different". Of course each project is different, this is big part of definition of the project (and it's main difference between project and process) - that each one is unique. Writing something like that to someone who says he is working in/with management is like asking someone who is professional chef if he knows how long you should boil an egg.
              I would also like to point that my link wasn't for you or anyone who manages Exalted, but to someone who asked me about management after few post of discussion, so I showed him/her basic concept to avoid further misunderstanding.
              Additionally - "Like, the assumption we don't work on word counts suggests that any management experience or education is not relevant to the particulars of this situation and it is the particulars on which any project actually rests (contrary to those attempts to shift JIT, MRP and the like outside the context it was created)." - my opinion was build upon developers comments about not being constrained by word counts and being finally able to write book as long as they want, or as it was said (not exact quote): "if we want/need to make this book 600 pages long, we can". Yes, I found it strange, but when quotes like these were thrown around I decided to believe in what developers were saying.
              And on the other hand for second part of that sentence - JIT and MRP were made for flow of physical goods, but they have evolved beyond these constraints in some cases. Similar how kanban is being used in project management while starting as scheduling/tagging system in production flow. However, there are still methods for managing specifically projects. They include managing risk, work time and schedule, including delays.

              Edit: Sorry, need to answer this one post.
              Originally posted by Volver View Post
              Why would they need to talk to anyone here? The sale has been made, the demographic here all represent sales for each book as they trickle out. So time spent posting here and answering questions or fanning excitement is really a waste from an advertising perspective. If you want the staff to pay attention to you, talk to them on Twitter, RPG.net, or another platform where answering you would be public and good PR.
              Exactly because of that - that many people most invested into the line and long time users are on this forum and posting information here (don't even need to talk, they could have just find one minute to log in and post about interview given) is basic courtesy to long time fans. Who are core clients.
              Last edited by Daerian; 11-24-2016, 02:40 AM.


              My homebrew/rewrites:
              2nd->3rd Edition Sorcery Spells Rewrite
              Talisman of Ten Thousand Eyes Evocations
              Solar Occult Charms for Sorcerers
              Solar Thrown Charms (with Solar Danmaku Charms)

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Lucy Darling View Post
                Hi! My name is Lucy and I DO have some insight to the Development process because John and Holden are my best friends, and I also write on the line, On this project, between writers and devs, you've had:
                • babies born
                • people die
                • people ill
                • more people die
                • more illness
                • exams and study
                • EMOTIONS AND FEELS
                • more long term illness
                • oh wait more illness
                • (ALL THE FEELS)
                • oh look other job stuff
                • what another death, oh for fucks sake
                • (WELL FUCK MY FEELS)
                • and now everyone is sick?
                • what the fresh hell is this?
                • THAT'S IT, NO-ONE IS ALLOWED TO GET SICK
                • ...dammit that didn't work, people are still sick
                That's just the parts of the project I have worked on the past few years AND not even touching on the major mechanical stuff. I know it is super easy to link to wikipedia 'Project Management' triangles and chatter about management and make vague promises that 'no IRL I do know this stuff' but...each project is different. Each and every single one. And in particular rpgs are a cross section of publishing, art, creative writing, technical writing, project management, community management, PR, and personnel management. And are subject to the shortfalls of each and every one of those. While also being done around the edges of the mess that above list makes of your life.

                Telling writers to 'write faster' generally ends up with: poor material*, overwrought writers, and a lot more work for the person in charge, either managing them or fixing the work you got. Sure there are recalcitrant writers out there who need prodding, but mostly? Creative stuff takes time, and some of that time is invisible. It's research, it's playtesting, it's talking shit with friends and working out that the idea sucks so you have to scrap it. Or sending it in and finding out you managed to miss a whole damn section of the outline so now you have to write that in while sticking to wordcount (*eyedart*), but yeah, we do have word counts and I am unsure as to how one would 'make an author work faster' but...it's unlikely to be a profitable thing to do. I have ideas on how to manage this stuff but I'm rambling as it is, and I have other stuff to write, but managing the workload you give people, being aware of what is happening with them, and balancing finding new writers with keeping your workhorses is a fairly solid proposition.

                Like, the assumption we don't work on word counts suggests that any management experience or education is not relevant to the particulars of this situation and it is the particulars on which any project actually rests (contrary to those attempts to shift JIT, MRP and the like outside the context it was created).

                And "stop being such a perfectionist" doesn't mesh well with a community that is...less than forgiving about mistakes.

                *hopefully something fixed by increased levels of copy editing, rather than 'scrap and start over', but you can't always tell that until you get into it, and in the conext of this project leads directly into porting stuff from previous editions that may or may not apply to Ex3.

                (I am immensely grateful that none of my supervisors - be they Devs or the ones in my real life job - were 'write faster' style 'managers' when one of the above-mentioned deaths was my best friend. It meant that when I got back into my work, I was in a much better place than I would have been if I'd been working on it through that period, which in turn means better work and a lack of resentment towards it, or association of pain with it, which is important. That's why I put feels and emotions in there, because it does have an affect on work, usually for the worse.)

                I am sorry for these losses, trials, and tribulations, but I want to put something forward that is no great excuse but maybe something in the way of an explanation. It can be hard to patient and sympathetic with a Dev, intellectually I know they are people just like me deserving of understanding and sympathy, and I try to give them that. But at the end of the day I don't really know or connect with them emotionally, they are strangers. I do however have a emotional connection to this game called Exalted I have been playing my best friends for half a decade. I don't think I am alone in this fact either, its just human nature that those things close to you are easier to care and be concerned about.

                By extension it becomes very easy to view them as something separate from the game, come to a understanding or belief that Exalted doesn't or shouldn't live or die with them. It's easy to wonder if Exalted would be better off in someones else's hands, or think that someone needs to step in and crack a whip. And all these ideas are kinda petty and unkind to a Dev out there...but they aren't necessarily untrue...and I don't really know the guy...

                Basically its complicated and conflicting

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by Daerian View Post
                  However, I want to say one thing - you didn't really need to passively-aggressively discredit my opinion and knowledge about management in your post just because you didn't like what I wrote and that I didn't like to talk about my personal life on the forum in the Internet. And before you say you didn't - you did, especially with telling me that "each project is different". Of course each project is different, this is big part of definition of the project (and it's main difference between project and process) - that each one is unique. Writing something like that to someone who says he is working in/with management is like asking someone who is professional chef if he knows how long you should boil an egg.
                  You know, you're the one who said, "I refuse to give my credentials, but trust me I'm an expert."

                  I'm probably not the only person on the Internet whose response to that line is automatically, "NOPE."

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Andrew D View Post
                    You know, you're the one who said, "I refuse to give my credentials, but trust me I'm an expert."

                    I'm probably not the only person on the Internet whose response to that line is automatically, "NOPE."
                    I'm very sorry for being old timer who got used to Internet in times when anonymity was big part of it's culture and still believing in that creed. I usually don't say anything about my own education and experience, here was special case.
                    I'm also sorry for being person who usually believes when someone writes that they know something, unless I have important reasons to think otherwise. I just don't lie about my expertise (or lack of it) and I prefer to think that most civilized persons don't do it, at least not in such trivial situation.
                    Last edited by Daerian; 11-24-2016, 03:13 AM.


                    My homebrew/rewrites:
                    2nd->3rd Edition Sorcery Spells Rewrite
                    Talisman of Ten Thousand Eyes Evocations
                    Solar Occult Charms for Sorcerers
                    Solar Thrown Charms (with Solar Danmaku Charms)

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Daerian View Post
                      I'm very sorry for being old timer who got used to Internet in times when anonymity was big part of it's culture and still believing in that creed. I'm also sorry for being person who usually believes when someone writes that they know something, unless I have important reasons to think otherwise. I just don't lie about my expertise (or lack of it) and I prefer to think that most civilized persons don't do it, at least not in such trivial situation.
                      It's not that I assumed you were lying, I suppose.. it's more that I just don't care.

                      We're talking about an RPG on an RPG forum. We not working in whatever environment gives you all of your project management expertise. If you claim to have some special knowledge or insight that makes your opinions correct, well that's wonderful for you. It means absolutely nothing to me unless you want to translate it into an argument a little more substantial than, "I just know when mismanagement happens."

                      I mean, I've been responsible for tens of millions of the government's dollars in a past career, along with hundreds of human beings. I've seen more faddish corporate geometry-metaphor powerpoints and team management mnemonics than I care to remember. I have nightmares about that shit. That's got fuck-all to do with writing an RPG, though, and even if it did, I wouldn't expect any one of the strangers here to be interested in anything but the content of my posts in this thread.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Andrew D View Post
                        I mean, I've been responsible for tens of millions of the government's dollars in a past career, along with hundreds of human beings. I've seen more faddish corporate geometry-metaphor powerpoints and team management mnemonics than I care to remember. I have nightmares about that shit. That's got fuck-all to do with writing an RPG, though, and even if it did, I wouldn't expect any one of the strangers here to be interested in anything but the content of my posts in this thread.
                        I perfectly understand, as this is pretty much perversion of basic ideas.
                        I have however written point by point why I think this project was mismanaged and no one really did discuss any of my points, instead some person (not Lucy) decided to go ad hominem against me, then Lucy post happened.


                        My homebrew/rewrites:
                        2nd->3rd Edition Sorcery Spells Rewrite
                        Talisman of Ten Thousand Eyes Evocations
                        Solar Occult Charms for Sorcerers
                        Solar Thrown Charms (with Solar Danmaku Charms)

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          *sighs*

                          Fine. You can wave your unspoken qualifications all you want, but my point about the management thing was as much for the onlooker as your wiki-link, except mine was pointing out that any chef would ask 'what kind of egg and is it room temp' before claiming some kind of empirical incontrovertible timing for boiling an egg, for example.

                          And if you want me to extend good faith to you for your claims, try extending it to the Devs, Rich, and the writers. But to address your specific points about mismanagement:

                          Originally posted by Daerian View Post

                          Because:
                          - the product was at least 2,5 year late when compared to stated official publishing time (and if I remember correctly after all these years that stated time was already late when compared to starting promises);
                          - the final product has few very big quality issues (that none of lead developers except for Robert Vance comments or explains here), as we can find from discussions on this very forum;
                          - actual developers pretty much killed 2nd Edition promising fast development and start of 3rd, as we know it didn't happen;
                          - from what we know some of actual developers are responsible for driving one of the best authors from Exalted and then trying to show his beloved by many work as cancerous to the line (Infernals);
                          - community got divided and many people who have been strongly invested into Exalted have been driven out by developers, their ideas and especially their comments and ways to talk to community;
                          - I will even add that they don't feel like posting official info or interviews on official forum of product;
                          - and now we know that second big book in line is going to be late (with no idea when it will be out, I think?)

                          Seriously, tell me why shouldn't we assume there isn't any mismanagement.
                          - delays have been discussed, multiple times, and while they may not meet your criteria for 'okay' that is not an objective criteria and the devs are not entirely responsible for every single step in the process (see: Rich's comments about 'art shenanigans' in the Monday Meeting notes a few weeks past).
                          - opinion and ftr, Vance is a great writer, esp. on Charms, is not a Dev and both Devs have explained things about, say, BP/XP (*throws salt over shoulder*), counterattacks, Charm intent and so on, and have clarified a bunch of things including Holden's 'how to roll hitting someone with another someone' very recently.
                          - I am struggling to parse what you even mean here - Ink Monkeys maybe?
                          - opinion again, and I assume your comments are about someone who has gone on record to state that he left of his own accord and wishes everyone well. And we're talking Infernals, in terms of Lilun etc? Because distancing oneself from things you find abhorrent, and distancing ones work from directions you disagree with, are both totally okay choices to make, but try not to conflate the two as you read them. The Devs have chosen to do Creation differently and this doesn't have to be seen in a combative fashion BUT the more you insist they defend every creative choice the more combative the conversation will get.
                          - it's been divided since forever, and the bigger attachment you have for one iteration of a thing the more likely you are to loathe anything about another (hi Sherlock fandom!) and asking the Devs to make a product without ever making a choice that upset anyone, or anyone with strong feelings, is impossible.
                          - I touched on this in my previous post, but just how much bereavement leave for 'not posting in a space where people tell you that you're shit' should someone get in your opinion, and how many times should they have to be personally insulted before they are allowed to leave?
                          - Arms is on its way, the Devs have pulled back on setting dates because even when every single thing is going right, there will be some horrible fuck up at the last moment (see: Gencon) and people will focus in on that instead of assuming with good faith there must be a good reason.

                          Pursuant to that last bit - management includes a lot of people, and personnel management. Rich tags it in the comments about art shenanigans, but none of us are in the business of throwing people under the bus. That is what a lot of these posts ask us to do - offer up someone to blame and when the Devs don't, they take the heat. From the outside there is very little any of us can know about personnel management and it is not okay to push to try and work out who did what, just to satisfy your own curiosity.


                          ". ... for me, the transformative power of art is you are not above the material." -= Guillermo del Toro

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Just as a note though: Opinion isn't necessarily wrong, nor unwarranted - it isn't objective proof either.

                            But this thread, along with others, doesn't make for a welcoming kind of space (and I already have an aversion to forums even without this kind of thing), because the opinion is couched in terms like 'driven out' and 'trying to show...beloved...cancerous' and so on.


                            ". ... for me, the transformative power of art is you are not above the material." -= Guillermo del Toro

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Because post is specifically for me, I will respond.

                              Originally posted by Lucy Darling View Post
                              *sighs*
                              And if you want me to extend good faith to you for your claims, try extending it to the Devs,
                              I'm sorry, but I will quote myself from different topic:
                              Very helpful illustration how someone very happy for 3rd edition, someone who argued it's good idea with his friends (who were more sceptic from the start) got bitter after seeing how developers roll though the years.
                              I was one of the persons who were wholeheartedly for third edition and full of hopes after it was announced. At this point I'm sorry to say - I tried to stay positive for long period of time, but at the moment I'm really unable to anymore.

                              Originally posted by Lucy Darling View Post
                              - delays have been discussed, multiple times, and while they may not meet your criteria for 'okay' that is not an objective criteria and the devs are not entirely responsible for every single step in the process (see: Rich's comments about 'art shenanigans' in the Monday Meeting notes a few weeks past).
                              While every delay is probably justifiable by itself, at this point there is just too much of them. They add to three years of delay - at this point this isn't something that can be just shrugged off.

                              Originally posted by Lucy Darling View Post
                              - opinion and ftr, Vance is a great writer, esp. on Charms, is not a Dev and both Devs have explained things about, say, BP/XP (*throws salt over shoulder*), counterattacks, Charm intent and so on, and have clarified a bunch of things including Holden's 'how to roll hitting someone with another someone' very recently.
                              Yes, sorry, he is writer. I really like his work, but why is he pretty much only one from writing team I see here? (there was one more person and I'm sorry, but I'm bad with names and don't remember her name, but she said that she was editing, not writing for this edition). And yes, I think I saw some answers, usually in form of someone quoting one of the devs from different place in long forum topic about some problem, often wit answer not fully solving the question or causing another concerns that were not answered.

                              Originally posted by Lucy Darling View Post
                              - I am struggling to parse what you even mean here - Ink Monkeys maybe?
                              Informing people that errata will not be continued/ended, pretty much instant drop on content, informing about third edition far too early which made people drop 2nd edition.

                              Originally posted by Lucy Darling View Post
                              - opinion again, and I assume your comments are about someone who has gone on record to state that he left of his own accord and wishes everyone well. And we're talking Infernals, in terms of Lilun etc? Because distancing oneself from things you find abhorrent, and distancing ones work from directions you disagree with, are both totally okay choices to make, but try not to conflate the two as you read them. The Devs have chosen to do Creation differently and this doesn't have to be seen in a combative fashion BUT the more you insist they defend every creative choice the more combative the conversation will get.
                              Most people who leave don't really want to burn all bridges behind them. I find it kinda strange that this person left thing that he was very invested into just as development team changed to persons with different vision than his not because of these changes. And no, I'm not talking about Lilun (should I feel offended that you suggest that I consider Lilun a good part of fluff?). I'm talking about pretty much campaign against Infernal charms as toxic to game both mechanically and narrativelly, which pretty much shifted most of the community to suddenly hate on Infernals (and gave reasons to not update their Charmset).

                              Originally posted by Lucy Darling View Post
                              - it's been divided since forever, and the bigger attachment you have for one iteration of a thing the more likely you are to loathe anything about another (hi Sherlock fandom!) and asking the Devs to make a product without ever making a choice that upset anyone, or anyone with strong feelings, is impossible.
                              I'm sorry, but this is a different thing. I have problems with some of the themes that line have taken, but I can understand that this is developers vision. Problem is not in that, but in the way the communicate it - pretty much every announcement was followed by (or even made) in tone that was very condescending for everyone that didn't agree with changes, over and over again.
                              Edit: On different note, I really like original stories, old movies, Elementary and R. Downey Jr. movies, does it make me strange open-minded person (didn't check Cumberbatch's Sherlock yet, sorry) ;-)?

                              Originally posted by Lucy Darling View Post
                              - I touched on this in my previous post, but just how much bereavement leave for 'not posting in a space where people tell you that you're shit' should someone get in your opinion, and how many times should they have to be personally insulted before they are allowed to leave?
                              What I will write here will probably be not very popular, but first: very, very long, pretty much infinite number of times. It's their job and not doing it is pretty much childish, additionally leading to stagnation, because if you want to hear only praise you will never see problems. Additionally, I would say that this isn't fault of forum posters only, because as I have written paragraph above, a lot of people had right to feel provoked by constant condescending manner of speech that was used by developers. I'm sorry, but at some point I had to stop reading Holden comments because of how aggravating to me, someone who didn't share all his ideas, they were. I pretty much felt insulted as someone not intelligent enough to understand how much better his vision is than mine .

                              Originally posted by Lucy Darling View Post
                              - Arms is on its way, the Devs have pulled back on setting dates because even when every single thing is going right, there will be some horrible fuck up at the last moment (see: Gencon) and people will focus in on that instead of assuming with good faith there must be a good reason.
                              I'm going here to ask you a question - you are constantly telling me "why aren't people giving us good faith and reasonable doubt?", but... answer me please - why should they? At this point we had three years long delay, many people feel insulted by posts of one of most important developers (I think Holden is developer, not only a writer?) and none of developers feels obligated to post on official forum of their product with information such as "next big book got delayed". Nor did they spend a moment to post about big interview they just did. Both of these things I have learned from different users who found this info on their own. Additionally (and this is not opinion, but a fact) there are problems with the mechanics in the book that was just made that go unadressed or only partially explained even if people spend long time on forum of the product asking for answers.
                              To sum up - with the way developers deal with Exalted community I really don't see why that community should give them reasonable doubt and remain in good faith. Yes, I'm sure that there were big and nasty comments, but deciding to screw entire core community is throwing baby with the bathwater.
                              Last edited by Daerian; 11-24-2016, 05:44 AM.


                              My homebrew/rewrites:
                              2nd->3rd Edition Sorcery Spells Rewrite
                              Talisman of Ten Thousand Eyes Evocations
                              Solar Occult Charms for Sorcerers
                              Solar Thrown Charms (with Solar Danmaku Charms)

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Daerian maybe you should quit while you're ahead? It’s just that I've seen this scenario play out enough times and some of your comments suggest you're on the way to saying something unfortunate that will break the terms of use.


                                Onyx Path Forum Moderator
                                Please spare a thought for updating the Exalted wiki.

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