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  • #76
    Originally posted by Isator Levi View Post
    I checked the blurbs of both books, and the one for The Realm is the one that says "a large part of this book will be devoted to detailing the houses of the Dynasty, updating and enlivening with intention of making the houses as tantalizing as Kindred Clans in terms of iconicism and player association and appeal".

    So that is the answer to my question, and the underlying one of whether or not What Fire Has Wrought would need to balance a large Charms chapter with an especially large collection of setting details.
    I guess that doesn't mean the Houses won't be talked about at all in the DB book, but it does sound like it'll probably be less.

    Which is maybe fine, as they can talk a bit more about some different Outcaste groups.

    Am I remembering correctly that Vance said he thought the best thing to do with education, rather than the old system of extra ability dots but compulsory stuff, was some specialties? Like you get some free specialties if you're a Dynast, some different ones if you're from Lookshy.
    Because that would make me wonder if you'd get specialties from which Dynastic school you went to (as that was part of DB character gen before), and if so, I wonder if they'd talk about the schools in the DB book like they did before (I mean, that's only about 1 page).
    Last edited by The Wizard of Oz; 06-25-2017, 04:36 AM.


    "Wizard of Oz, you really are a wizard!"

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    • #77
      Originally posted by The Wizard of Oz View Post
      Am I remembering correctly that Vance said he thought the best thing to do with education, rather than the old system of extra ability dots but compulsory stuff, was some specialties? Like you get some free specialties if you're a Dynast, some different ones if you're from Lookshy.
      Which could mean that instead of 35 Ability dots to distribute, you could only have the same 28 available to Solar Exalted.

      Which would further pinch Dragon-Blooded character creation.


      Formerly Inugami, formerly Tornado Wolf.

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      • #78
        Originally posted by Sunder the Gold View Post
        Which could mean that instead of 35 Ability dots to distribute, you could only have the same 28 available to Solar Exalted.

        Which would further pinch Dragon-Blooded character creation.
        Personally, I am in favor of everyone getting the same number of Ability dots. If Solars and probably Lunars get the same number of dots no matter their amount of implied-by-backstory training and education, why should DBs get more? One of the things I didn't like about 2e was how Outcastes got less dots than Realm/Lookshy DBs and Ronin Sidereals got less than Heaven-employed ones.
        Why should some of the splats get "optimize your backstory for more dots" as a thing?

        "I'm Prince Diamond, a scion of warrior nobility that ruled my land of origin. My incredibly rich family has hired the best teachers money can buy to educate me in a wide variety of subjects. Since then, I have also become a far-rider, traveling far and wide and experiencing a myriad of cultures". 28 dots

        "Hey, I'm 6º Daughter, I was a simple mud-farming child in a poor village in the middle of nowhere. When I couldn't stand father beating mom anymore, I was ready to die to protect her, but instead the Sun chose to smile upon a poor kid like me that day". Also 28 dots

        "My Name is, or was, Mnemon Karagi. I have been considered something of a prodigy and have learned the ways of Sorcery while still a young mortal. As such, there was much expectation that I would be chosen by the Dragons, and my family kept investing in me even when that turned unreasonable. I was past my 25th year when they accepted that Exaltation was not in my destiny. Or so they thought. The mark of Twilight now shines in my brow. That dotting family of mine now sees me as a monster, a final failure of their once promising prodigy, but I know otherwise." 28 dots as well.

        If playing a Solar character you must portray "expensively educated, well-traveled warrior nobility" as well as "mud-farming, bully-stopping child who has never seen beyond the hill closest to the village" and "prodigious Dynastic scion with all the education, training and expectations that implies", using the same amount of Ability dots, what is the justification for any splat getting more? I doubt it would be mechanical balance, since some extra Ability dots are unlikely to put a DB and, say, a Lunar, on equal footing.


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        • #79
          I have a certain attachment to the older systems of Dragon Blooded character creation, but it's an insignificant hill to die on.


          I have approximate knowledge of many things.
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          • #80
            Originally posted by Isator Levi View Post
            ​...I can't recall, did they say that the Houses would be in the Realm book, or the Exalted one?
            The Great Houses are discussed in detail in Dragon-Blooded, since detailed information on the Houses is important to designing and playing Dragon-Blooded PCs and NPCs. The Realm just has a basic outline of the houses and their situation, so you have context if you're using the book without also owning Dragon-Blooded (such as for a mortals game set on the Blessed Isle, or a Solar game set in a satrapy).


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            • #81
              reversal of what was stated in blurbs. fine


              I have approximate knowledge of many things.
              Watch me play Dark Souls III (completed)
              https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLDtbr08HW8RW4jOHN881YA3yRZBV4lpYw Watch me play Breath of the Wild (updated 12/03)

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              • #82
                Originally posted by danelsan View Post
                Personally, I am in favor of everyone getting the same number of Ability dots.
                Me, too.

                Didn't mean to convey that I wasn't. I would sooner give Dragon-Blooded a bit more flexibility with their Aspect Abilities than give them more dots.


                Formerly Inugami, formerly Tornado Wolf.

                My RWBY Blog on Tumblr: Semblances, Kingdoms, Grimm, and more!

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                • #83
                  Originally posted by danelsan View Post
                  If playing a Solar character you must portray "expensively educated, well-traveled warrior nobility" as well as "mud-farming, bully-stopping child who has never seen beyond the hill closest to the village" and "prodigious Dynastic scion with all the education, training and expectations that implies", using the same amount of Ability dots, what is the justification for any splat getting more? I doubt it would be mechanical balance, since some extra Ability dots are unlikely to put a DB and, say, a Lunar, on equal footing.
                  Not between splat balance, but well, it's intra-Solar player balance within group, between people who wish to play twelve year old boy, and those that wish to play Admiral Sand. The idea here, I would guess, being that someone who wants to play a Solar with a simple background should not be disadvantaged to another player in their group who picks a fancy background.

                  Not an issue with Dragonblooded Dynast games, where they come from a shared cultural context and PCs are assumed to Exalt around the same age, so the assumed level of dots can be placed higher.

                  If 28 dots is enough for young Dynasts to be as skilled as they are supposed to play as, then no problem with setting it that way. But if not, I wouldn't really see the point of restricting their chargen and providing a qualitatively worse Dynast experience in order to for feels of symmetry with some distant convention that exists to make Solar games fairer between players.

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                  • #84
                    Originally posted by danelsan View Post

                    Personally, I am in favor of everyone getting the same number of Ability dots. If Solars and probably Lunars get the same number of dots no matter their amount of implied-by-backstory training and education, why should DBs get more? One of the things I didn't like about 2e was how Outcastes got less dots than Realm/Lookshy DBs and Ronin Sidereals got less than Heaven-employed ones.
                    Why should some of the splats get "optimize your backstory for more dots" as a thing?
                    I'm happy for DBs to have the same amount of ability dots as Solars, if they also have the same amount of attributes.

                    I wouldn't mind them having more merits, but with 10, it's not really necessary.

                    I'm not really sure vis-a-vis charms though. Maybe they ought to have the same as Solars (ie 15) because they don't get free excellencies anyway.


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                    • #85
                      Originally posted by The Wizard of Oz View Post

                      I'm happy for DBs to have the same amount of ability dots as Solars, if they also have the same amount of attributes.

                      I wouldn't mind them having more merits, but with 10, it's not really necessary.

                      I'm not really sure vis-a-vis charms though. Maybe they ought to have the same as Solars (ie 15) because they don't get free excellencies anyway.
                      Actually I think 10 might be cutting it close. If you want to build an average dynast you have veeeery little wiggle room there once you get your resources and stuff sorted out.

                      Without free excellencies they might want more charms than you would think, but I heard their excellency replacements are interesting enough to warrant a purchase.

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                      • #86
                        Originally posted by DrLoveMonkey View Post

                        Actually I think 10 might be cutting it close. If you want to build an average dynast you have veeeery little wiggle room there once you get your resources and stuff sorted out.
                        Dynasts should not need to have the Resources Merit by default.

                        ​You can easily play somebody with the lifestyle of a Dynast who either lives off of social association with others, earns money without consistency and spends it immediately, or is perpetually in debt.

                        ​That's something that has been common to a subset of rich people throughout history; they don't necessarily go broke the way that poor people do.

                        ​(I think most people probably don't want to play an average Dynast, because an average Dynast is about a century old, and has job and family commitments. I think most people want to play a Dynast who is younger than about sixty, who is still alternately working on all of the interesting things necessary to establish a firm base and be eligible as a marriage prospect, and going out to have fun adventures.)


                        I have approximate knowledge of many things.
                        Watch me play Dark Souls III (completed)
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                        • #87
                          Yeah, PCs are understood to be exceptional by the standards of whatever they are. For example, the book says most exalts never hit essence 5, but a PC is totally expected to. They are the movers and shakers of Creation.

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                          • #88
                            Originally posted by Isator Levi View Post

                            Dynasts should not need to have the Resources Merit by default.

                            ​You can easily play somebody with the lifestyle of a Dynast who either lives off of social association with others, earns money without consistency and spends it immediately, or is perpetually in debt.

                            ​That's something that has been common to a subset of rich people throughout history; they don't necessarily go broke the way that poor people do.

                            ​(I think most people probably don't want to play an average Dynast, because an average Dynast is about a century old, and has job and family commitments. I think most people want to play a Dynast who is younger than about sixty, who is still alternately working on all of the interesting things necessary to establish a firm base and be eligible as a marriage prospect, and going out to have fun adventures.)
                            That's very true indeed, but a dynast with no breeding, contacts, influence, reputation, resources, artifacts, command, backing etc. starts to make less sense. You can totally do it, and that's a legitimate character, I mean I'm playing a Dawn with only one dot of combat ability and it's not even in his supernal, but even for your average PC dynast I think it's a bit strange.

                            Those other merits are how one lives it up while being in crushing debt, and I think it's a good thing if DB character gen makes that easier to accomplish. It's also a great way to give you the feeling of absolutely enormous privilege that being a scion of the most bloody, oppressive and grand empire in the world affords you. Like if you personally feel like you can just take a dot or two of retainers on a whim, that's what being a dynast feels like.

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                            • #89
                              *finally got around to reading the preview*

                              God dammit. I knew a Fire DB Sorceress (Pact with an Ifrit Lord) was gonna be powerful and I felt like maybe I was pushing it a bit. But this? You can't expect me to withold Wildfire-Taming Technique from her.

                              My players are so screwed. I love it.


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                              • #90
                                Originally posted by DrLoveMonkey View Post

                                That's very true indeed, but a dynast with no breeding, contacts, influence, reputation, resources, artifacts, command, backing etc. starts to make less sense.
                                ​I think that between how many dots there are at character creation and what is offered by most of the Merits that are not any of those, that one doesn't need to worry too much about somebody struggling between a Dynast who makes sense and the ambidextrous, fleet-footed danger-senser with the unbendable stomach that their heart was set on.

                                ​...Actually, scratch that facetiousness; somebody with those qualities seems perfectly cromulent as an expression on a Dynast who places far more emphasis on adventures in the Threshold than high society.

                                ​(Also, all but one of those Merits can be acquired in the course of the story, so one way or another it doesn't need to be a shortcoming that lasts for very long)


                                I have approximate knowledge of many things.
                                Watch me play Dark Souls III (completed)
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