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Best Control Spells?

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  • Corwyn_Ulhar
    started a topic Best Control Spells?

    Best Control Spells?

    What do you think is the best choice of Control Spell for the Terrestrial, Celestial, and Solar Circles of Sorcery? I'm looking for what you think is the best choice to pick as your initial spell in each Circle based on how useful, powerful, or just plain cool the Control Spell bonus effect is, though the utility/power of the base spell itself is of course quite important too. For this purpose, just ignore or set aside Demon of the First/Second/Third Circle and Summon Elemental, as those don't have Control Spell effects.

    For my own picks, I'm undecided for the Terrestrial and Solar Circles, but lean toward Travel without Distance for Celestial Circle, as that can easily let you teleport your entire group with you, which can be a life-saver when your back is to the wall.

  • Beast of Bitter Oblivion
    replied
    Originally posted by Synapse View Post
    I really, really enjoyed Flight of Separation's control effect. I can see characters taking it for the control effect and not for the basic effect, even.
    After all, who wouldn't like to have a little bird tell you when something interesting happens?

    Oh, Torrential Cascade Control is also very powerful, if niche. If you don't let it reach long range, it stays on indefinitely. Get yourself a bodyguard and this is all but guaranteed to rout every battle group ever.
    I am now imagining the sorcerer on top of a low-altitude cirrus skiff, protected by a powerful demon, rushing along the Cascade and cackling maniacally.
    I thought you were going to say a maniacally cackling sorceror on a surf board lol.

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  • Synapse
    replied
    I really, really enjoyed Flight of Separation's control effect. I can see characters taking it for the control effect and not for the basic effect, even.
    After all, who wouldn't like to have a little bird tell you when something interesting happens?

    Oh, Torrential Cascade Control is also very powerful, if niche. If you don't let it reach long range, it stays on indefinitely. Get yourself a bodyguard and this is all but guaranteed to rout every battle group ever.
    I am now imagining the sorcerer on top of a low-altitude cirrus skiff, protected by a powerful demon, rushing along the Cascade and cackling maniacally.
    Last edited by Synapse; 09-16-2019, 06:53 AM.

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  • Aquillion
    replied
    Originally posted by nalak42 View Post
    Yeah, its down to just making the person fall asleep and gaining control of their dreams and being able to control their actions while sleeping. What was the plume again?
    In an earlier version you could also exhale a plume of the mist (with all those effects) reflexively, for free, 1/scene. On top of everything else.

    It was... overpowered.

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  • The Wizard of Oz
    replied
    Rain of Doom's control effect is useful actually. It takes hours for the spell to form, by which time those who recognise it have probably fled. But with the control effect you can chase them around with it.

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  • Sith_Happens
    replied
    Terrestrial: Mists of Eventide, no contest but still an honorable mention for Corrupted Words.

    Celestial: GTFO buttons are great and all but an ever-growing library of freely replayable documentary holograms is just too useful to pass up and much harder to duplicate the uses of by other means.

    Solar: Benediction’s the only one whose control bonus does all that much of anything in the first place.

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  • nalak42
    replied
    Originally posted by Aquillion View Post
    Mists of Eventide, no question. It just does way too much compared to everything else - either the mind-control aspect or the plume would be strong on their own; together they're stronger than most charms. It can be used for utility to reflexively mind-control a weak target, or just to drop a debuff on stronger opponents in a fight (and if they do crash, it can swing entire fights.) Since it's reflexive, costs nothing, and can be used 1/scene, there's pretty much no reason not to use it constantly.

    ...wait, the plume was removed from the final version, right?
    Yeah, its down to just making the person fall asleep and gaining control of their dreams and being able to control their actions while sleeping. What was the plume again?


    Also, in a more socially oriented campaign corrupted words has a very useful control effect seeing how it makes it a pain in the neck for anyone to notice that you used the spell until they hit the effect and even then the text says it tends to make it hard for the victims to know who the source of their affliction is. (I assume this only from the physical seeing the sign part, not many suspects needed if they find themselves unable to talk about witnessing you murder a person.)

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  • Aquillion
    replied
    Mists of Eventide, no question. It just does way too much compared to everything else - either the mind-control aspect or the plume would be strong on their own; together they're stronger than most charms. It can be used for utility to reflexively mind-control a weak target, or just to drop a debuff on stronger opponents in a fight (and if they do crash, it can swing entire fights.) Since it's reflexive, costs nothing, and can be used 1/scene, there's pretty much no reason not to use it constantly.

    ...wait, the plume was removed from the final version, right?
    Last edited by Aquillion; 09-14-2019, 08:42 PM.

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  • Beast of Bitter Oblivion
    replied
    I have it as my control spell and I personally think it’s a badly written spell it , it should let you take people with you by default and control effect should reduce how tired you are after it or distance travelled maybe .

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  • The Wizard of Oz
    replied
    Yeah, it massively transforms the utility of the spell.

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  • Jefepato
    replied
    I'm definitely on Team Travel Without Distance. The marginal benefit of its control effect just seems so much greater than almost any other spell.

    Leave a comment:


  • nalak42
    replied
    Keel Cleaves the Clouds is pretty useful since it enables a sorcerer to walk on mist or fog while constantly surrounding them in fog they can disperse with ease. Extra mobility not a useless thing.

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  • Ellis
    replied
    I have nothing to contribute except the suggestion that everyone imagine this conversation taking place in character in the Heptagram dining hall.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kelly Pedersen
    replied
    Originally posted by The Wizard of Oz View Post
    In practice, they irritate me. A)You don't actually get any benefit from the control spell besides being able to buy things, which will be balanced against their 10xp cost anyway, and B)There's no rules for them, and being told "yeah, you can totally make your own rules!" is not why I pay money for professionally-produced rule books which (I assume) have been playtested and balanced.
    To address the first point, I'd probably make the first evocation be a "you learn this for free" one, so that you do get an immediate bonus for taking the spell as a control. For the second, I'm not sure how many evocations could reasonably be provided without basically locking down the feel of them for the spell and making every character who took the spell having the same evocations. I'd guess it's the same reason that Glorious Solar Saber doesn't have any suggested evocations - they're always going to be even more personalized than most evocations, so even suggesting one or two pins people down too much.

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  • The Wizard of Oz
    replied
    In practice, they irritate me. A)You don't actually get any benefit from the control spell besides being able to buy things, which will be balanced against their 10xp cost anyway, and B)There's no rules for them, and being told "yeah, you can totally make your own rules!" is not why I pay money for professionally-produced rule books which (I assume) have been playtested and balanced.

    I like the idea though. Your signature spell is one that you can do all sorts of things with that others can't? And one that (since you've invested more xp into it) you probably use a lot (alway fighting with Wood Dragon Claw, always travelling on a Floral Ferry, etc).
    I think that makes perfect sense.

    I guess that a lot of evocation trees give some small bonus without spending any xp: an extra dice on something or other, a free weak charm if you're Resonant, etc. So you could give that bonus to the spell.

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