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What are the most and least popular supernal abilities?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Chausse View Post

    So I did a Night with 0 stealth and full Athletics and I played very Dawny. Yeah I agree that with the marketing of the Castes you have to be a bit inventive, that's why I appreciate the existence of the Castes for the lore and feeling, but I find them a bit poorly "designed" into what they build mechanically.
    Remade my 2e Night caste in 3e and he's an Athletics Supernal invested heavily in Resistance and Brawl. He bought only the meat and potatoes Stealth charms because, honestly, if you knew he was there it was because he had already TAP'd or secured a grapple and virtually no one is prepared for DYNAMIC ENTRY instagibs.


    ..."But I've bought a big bat, I'm all ready you see. Now my troubles are going to have troubles with me"

    Message me for Japanese translations.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by vwllss trnt prncss View Post

      Were you able to get Role XP reliably?
      Hmmmm. We never did the detail of the Solar XP explicitly, as long as everyone played in a respectful way towards each other and promoted interactions between the characters and the story, everyone got the Solar Experience. But given my memories of the game, and the description of the Night Role XP, I guess the answer should be "No".


      My homebrew (Leave comments if you want to help improve) : A quick recap of all the pools and stats for Quick Exalted 3E characters

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Chausse View Post

        Hmmmm. We never did the detail of the Solar XP explicitly, as long as everyone played in a respectful way towards each other and promoted interactions between the characters and the story, everyone got the Solar Experience. But given my memories of the game, and the description of the Night Role XP, I guess the answer should be "No".
        I figured as much, and that's the thing that irks me about the Castes. They're very broad conceptually via their Ability spreads, but then Anima powers and Role XP locks you into pretty narrow styles.

        Like, I knew from the moment I started that my first writeup was going to be a Performance-centric character built around "Wandering collector and teller of stories". Only Caste to get Performance is Zenith. Cool, they also get Lore and Survival, this seems good. Then I realized that all the Anima powers were wildly out of concept and Role XP was "haha maybe?" due to the character not having a "MY OPINIONS > YOUR OPINIONS" mindset.

        Solars really feel to me like if your character isn't built Caste-first you're gonna have a terrible time. Which is a shame, because all the other Exalt types so far don't have that flaw. (Dirty secret, I've said "Good, finished this Lunar" twice only to realize I never picked a Caste.)

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        • #19
          Originally posted by vwllss trnt prncss View Post

          I figured as much, and that's the thing that irks me about the Castes. They're very broad conceptually via their Ability spreads, but then Anima powers and Role XP locks you into pretty narrow styles.

          Like, I knew from the moment I started that my first writeup was going to be a Performance-centric character built around "Wandering collector and teller of stories". Only Caste to get Performance is Zenith. Cool, they also get Lore and Survival, this seems good. Then I realized that all the Anima powers were wildly out of concept and Role XP was "haha maybe?" due to the character not having a "MY OPINIONS > YOUR OPINIONS" mindset.

          Solars really feel to me like if your character isn't built Caste-first you're gonna have a terrible time. Which is a shame, because all the other Exalt types so far don't have that flaw. (Dirty secret, I've said "Good, finished this Lunar" twice only to realize I never picked a Caste.)
          Ahah. Yeah, I think that depending on the people you are playing with, my best go-to for Castes is "Go for what seems fun and give role XP for everyone if they nice enough". For Anima power, I guess having a bit more and diversified anima power for each Caste from which you must pick 3 is a good idea. I might try and come up with a few on the forum and see what people think about them.


          My homebrew (Leave comments if you want to help improve) : A quick recap of all the pools and stats for Quick Exalted 3E characters

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Chausse View Post

            Ahah. Yeah, I think that depending on the people you are playing with, my best go-to for Castes is "Go for what seems fun and give role XP for everyone if they nice enough". For Anima power, I guess having a bit more and diversified anima power for each Caste from which you must pick 3 is a good idea. I might try and come up with a few on the forum and see what people think about them.
            That would be a wonderful thing to see.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by vwllss trnt prncss View Post

              I figured as much, and that's the thing that irks me about the Castes. They're very broad conceptually via their Ability spreads, but then Anima powers and Role XP locks you into pretty narrow styles.

              Like, I knew from the moment I started that my first writeup was going to be a Performance-centric character built around "Wandering collector and teller of stories". Only Caste to get Performance is Zenith. Cool, they also get Lore and Survival, this seems good. Then I realized that all the Anima powers were wildly out of concept and Role XP was "haha maybe?" due to the character not having a "MY OPINIONS > YOUR OPINIONS" mindset.

              Solars really feel to me like if your character isn't built Caste-first you're gonna have a terrible time. Which is a shame, because all the other Exalt types so far don't have that flaw. (Dirty secret, I've said "Good, finished this Lunar" twice only to realize I never picked a Caste.)
              This is somewhat true; I honestly think the best way to make a character is to not pick your Supernal ability until after you've picked your concept and Caste, because (except for combat abilities) there's a lot of Supernals that are only for one Caste, but might well fit a character who's not about what that Caste is about.
              And the Castes themselves can be a little restrictive in terms of Role XP. I understand that the point is to encourage you to do characterful stuff, but the writers didn't know what everyone's characters were supposed to be.
              You can of course go "I'll build a Zenith!" and then come up with the details of your tough priest, but this is going to lead to less interesting, more stereotypical characters. Though as you say, they will get more Role XP that way.

              One of my friends gave his players the option of getting a 2-dot merit to pick a Favoured Ability (not combat) as Supernal, to sidestep this issue. Although there was still the issue that the character who got it didn't really fit into any Caste particularly well.

              With my Lunar game, no-one cares about Supernal so they just fit the Caste that best fits their character concept. As the Castes are bigger (you physical, social or mental primary?) it's easier to fit them in. I'd say the only one who doesn't "fit" well is the Manipulation 5 Casteless who should be a Changing Moon, but maybe he will become one in future (I guess it'd be fine if he tricked people by shapeshifting a lot, but he doesn't).
              Saying this, the Changing Moon (previously Changing Moons, but one died) hardly ever seems to get her Role Bonus, but she still tends to get the Role XP because that one also has the option to get it for ceding the scene.
              (Actually, I'd say 75% of Lunar XP I hand out is for ceding the scene. The players are really good at that, which does mean that everyone gets to shine at different times.)



              I run... Lunars: The Apocalypse! Exalted 3rd edition. Fimbulwinter is upon the world as an Ice Age begins, and only six young Lunar heroes have a chance of saving humanity.

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              • #22
                In games I've run or been in here's what I've seen that I can remember.

                Melee
                Craft x 3
                Performance
                Resistance
                Linguistics x 2
                Medicine
                Larceny
                Occult x 2
                Martial Arts x 2
                Lore
                Athletics x 2
                Dodge
                Presence
                Archery
                Brawl
                Presence
                Survival

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by The Wizard of Oz View Post
                  Saying this, the Changing Moon (previously Changing Moons, but one died) hardly ever seems to get her Role Bonus,get it for ceding the scene.
                  (Actually, I'd say 75% of Lunar XP I hand out is for ceding the scene. The players are really good at that, which does mean that everyone gets to shine at different times.)
                  True I forgot that. In that case, I guess I had the role bonus most of the time. I even suggested once that the other PC's stun my character after they convinced mine to do something using a Defining Intimacy supported by Righteous Lion Defense, but then they changed their mind about it while I was still willing to do it. Seeing other players didn't want to spend time on this, I suggested "Just stun me because my character is wounded and then I'll scream a bit on you when I wake far away from here"


                  My homebrew (Leave comments if you want to help improve) : A quick recap of all the pools and stats for Quick Exalted 3E characters

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    So, Supernal abilities.

                    The game I ran (2nd ed, then converted to 3rd ed from 200xp onwards, they're about 485xp now I think, a different ST runs it):
                    The original E4 party had a a Performance-Zenith preacher, a Craft-Twilight, Occult-Eclipse, and a... Linguistics-Eclipse, I think? He was a writer, so I guess so.
                    The only one of those left now is the Performance-Zenith. There's also a Resistance-Dawn, different Occult-Eclipse, and Socialise-Eclipse.
                    There was also a Socialise-Night for like 12 sessions, but he died.

                    In the other game I play:
                    We have an Integrity-Zenith, Craft-Twilight, an Athletics-Night, and... Stealth-Night?
                    Characters who were played for shorter times were an Occult-Twilight (I assume, he was a sorcerer) and a... Larceny-Eclipse? Not sure, he should have been a Night or Dawn.

                    In my friend's game that I don't play:
                    I think there's a Melee-Dawn, Survival-Zenith, Medicine-Twilight, Stealth-Night, Socialise-Eclipse and Athletics-Eclipse (the one with the houseruled 2-dot merit).

                    So I guess that Occult and Socialise are marginally more popular than others, and Craft is reasonably common too.


                    So...
                    Originally posted by habitableexoplanet
                    Most popular: Craft (powerful and unique), Melee (most versatile combat ability)

                    Fairly popular: Archery, Brawl, Martial Arts, Thrown (all the combat abilities seem like solid choices), Performance, Presence, Socialize (same with all the social abilities), Investigation, Larceny, Occult, Stealth, War (seem like the centerpiece of cool characters)
                    So I do actually see Melee 5 and Brawl 5 loads, but not as Supernal. I guess partly because people rarely play Dawns. I never see anyone with high ratings in Thrown. As to War, actually our Dawn has every single War charm, it just happens to not be his Supernal.
                    I do see the Social ones (though not Presence). I actually haven't seen Investigation or Larceny supernal used. Larceny has a lot of good charms right at the beginning.
                    Last edited by The Wizard of Oz; 02-13-2020, 07:32 AM.


                    I run... Lunars: The Apocalypse! Exalted 3rd edition. Fimbulwinter is upon the world as an Ice Age begins, and only six young Lunar heroes have a chance of saving humanity.

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                    • #25
                      I can't imagine Supernal Integrity coming up very often. There's also a few trees like Bureaucracy and Resistance that I'd be surprised to see taken if only because they don't have many interesting Essence 3+ Charms.

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                      • #26
                        Resistance has some really powerful high-essence charms. Our Resistance-Supernal Solar is extremely tough.
                        Whereas War has (in the Core Book) no charms higher than Essence 3.

                        Integrity supernal, IIRC, lets you buy stuff with less prerequisites. I'd have to check though.


                        I run... Lunars: The Apocalypse! Exalted 3rd edition. Fimbulwinter is upon the world as an Ice Age begins, and only six young Lunar heroes have a chance of saving humanity.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Just from the data in this thread, I count:

                          Athletics 6
                          Archery 3
                          Awareness 0
                          Bureaucracy 2
                          Brawl 4
                          Craft 9
                          Dodge 2
                          Integrity 1
                          Investigation 0
                          Larceny 3
                          Linguistics 6
                          Lore 5
                          Martial Arts 2
                          Medicine 3
                          Melee 6
                          Occult 7
                          Performance 6
                          Presence 2
                          Resistance 5
                          Ride 0
                          Survival 4
                          Sail 2
                          Socialize 7
                          Stealth 7
                          Thrown 0
                          War 5

                          (This is counting DrLoveMonkey’s experience as +1 each, counting Chausse's post after this one, and counting The Wizard of Oz’s friend’s game but not the characters in their own game they weren’t sure about)

                          So it looks like the top ones are Craft followed by Occult, Socialize, and Stealth and then Athletics (!), Linguistics (!!!), Melee, and Performance. In last place we have Awareness, Investigation, Ride, and Thrown. I would certainly have guessed Thrown as the least popular combat ability but maybe not so low. This kind of makes me want to make a Thrown specialist character...

                          A very dark part of me wants to make a Thrown Supernal Dawn, Integrity Supernal Zenith, Investigation Supernal Twilight, Awareness Supernal Night, and Ride Supernal Eclipse Circle, but I know that would be a bad idea, whereas I don't actually see what's the problem with Thrown.
                          Last edited by habitableexoplanet; 02-13-2020, 10:06 AM.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by habitableexoplanet View Post
                            A very dark part of me wants to make a Thrown Supernal Dawn, Integrity Supernal Zenith, Investigation Supernal Twilight, Awareness Supernal Night, and Ride Supernal Eclipse Circle, but I know that would be a bad idea, whereas I don't actually see what's the problem with Thrown.
                            Believe me, there is nothing wrong with Investigation or Thrown; Knight Raiton is big into them even though they're not his Supernal. And if you want scary, have a Thrown Supernal character with Swarm-Culling Instinct and Stealth Charms.

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                            • #29
                              habitableexoplanet

                              If that can help you, from my memories, the other player's I've seen were :

                              - Night Stealth x2
                              - Twilight Craft (yeah again)
                              - Occult Eclipse
                              - Performance Zenith x2
                              - Lore Twilight x2
                              - Dawn Resistance
                              - Archer Dawn
                              - Socialize Eclipse
                              - Zenith Survival


                              My homebrew (Leave comments if you want to help improve) : A quick recap of all the pools and stats for Quick Exalted 3E characters

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Here is what I've seen :

                                Archery
                                Athletics
                                Awareness
                                Brawl (Martial Arts) x2
                                Integrity
                                Investigation
                                Lore
                                Medicine x2
                                Melee x3
                                Presence
                                Occult
                                Sail
                                Socialize x2
                                Stealth x3
                                Survival x2
                                War

                                Thrown Supernal is actually soft banned in our games because our group's theorycrafter concluded that you can basically one-shot anything if you Supernal in Thrown.

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