Reasonably detailed descriptions of Juggernaut?

[Hakkonen]

My players are on their way to Thorns, presumably with the intent of challenging the Seven-Degreed Physician of Black Maladies. Are there any really good descriptions of Juggernaut, beyond "giant animated corpse with a castle built on it?" Is it humanoid, or otherwise?

[DrLoveMonkey]

I think the most comprehensive descriptions make it out to be pretty humanoid, like it has what was described as "hands" it's on all fours, but it's also crippled so it's possible it's just on its hands and knees. It's also a rotting corpse, so I imagine a lot of decayed flesh attached to bones.

[Blackwell]

Juggernaut has been around since 1e, and has accumulated quite a bit of lore.

Yes, Juggernaut is humanoid. It can't walk or stand upright, instead dragging itself along on its belly with its arms (leaving it's back free to support the Mask's fortress).

[JohnDoe244]

3E core:

"Now a black miasma boils up around the city, obscuring the gray fields, the leafless trees, and the grotesque foot-hills that rise, bloated and repellent, outside her walls. But they are not hills. These ragged slopes are mounds of rotten flesh; that promontory an elbow, those gorges the gaps between fingers like fallen spires. Thorns is now a shadowland, its panorama dominated by the vast and terrible undead giant called Juggernaut which slumps supine outside the city gates, from between whose shoulders rises the osseous castle of the Mask of Winters. [...]

"Juggernaut was a fearsome behemoth slain in the forgotten epochs of the First Age—a terror with fists the size of hills, the bulk of its flesh like a city wrought in muscle and sinew. The Deathlord found the behemoth’s ancient corpse and enslaved it through unimaginably potent sorceries, raised his citadel upon its rotting back, then set it crawling toward the city."

1E Abyssals

There's a Chapter Fiction on page 263 that describes a massive belly filled with maggots. There aren't any stand-out passages, but it's evocative.

2E's MoEP Abyssal says:

"The great undead monstrosity would be one mile tall if it stood upright. Currently, it crawls about ponderously on its hands and knees. Its master placed towers of basalt and ebony on its back to serve as a command center."

But the gold can be found in Compass: Scavenger Lands. There's a full stat block and illustration on page 154, which is as detailed as you're going to get.

[Mockery]

IIRC in one of those descriptions it's mentioned that it doesn't have a face; it's been long-since obliterated and I want to say there's further construction inside the opened skull though that might just be my own imagination.

[Blackwell]

Likewise, I think one or more mentions implied a "big reveal" that Juggernaught isn't the corpse of a dead behemoth that the Mask animated like a zombie, but rather the gravely wounded, but slowly regenerating body of a *living* behemoth that Mask uses Necromancy to keep at the city-sized-giant-equivalent of Incapacitated so that a legion of nemessaries can possess the necrotizing muscles and coordinate its movements. I.e., the ghosts make it crawl, the Mask's "unfathomable necromancy" is what keeps it from standing up.

Or that could be headcanon I accidentally synthesized over the years.

[Grod_the_giant]

IIRC in one of those descriptions it's mentioned that it doesn't have a face; it's been long-since obliterated and I want to say there's further construction inside the opened skull though that might just be my own imagination.

Well, if you did make it up it ought to be canon, because that's rad as hell.

[JohnDoe244]

Likewise, I think one or more mentions implied a "big reveal" that Juggernaught isn't the corpse of a dead behemoth that the Mask animated like a zombie, but rather the gravely wounded, but slowly regenerating body of a *living* behemoth that Mask uses Necromancy to keep at the city-sized-giant-equivalent of Incapacitated so that a legion of nemessaries can possess the necrotizing muscles and coordinate its movements. I.e., the ghosts make it crawl, the Mask's "unfathomable necromancy" is what keeps it from standing up.

Or that could be headcanon I accidentally synthesized over the years.

No that's from Compass: Scavenger Lands with the write up.

Also, Juggernaut is humanoid. Just huge.

[Sith_Happens]

...Wait, does it really say “supine?”

...Yep, “supine.” Either someone meant “prone” or Mask’s castle is now a powder.

[JohnDoe244]

...Wait, does it really say “supine?”

...Yep, “supine.” Either someone meant “prone” or Mask’s castle is now a powder.

Yeah... so... I'm fighting a guy with a sledgehammer. They're facing me and swing the hammer into me making a smashing attack... that, somehow, knocks me prone. How? Wut? Surely it'd knock me on my ass (aka supine)? Latin is hard, apparently.

[Isator Levi]

As best I understand, Juggernaut was introduced as a relatively straightforward dead giant whose corpse was animated by the most powerful necromancy. There was also a whole thing where its real value to the Mask of Winters was the maggots being cultivated within its flesh, that when ready would burst forth to be unleashed on somebody (I think originally the rival Deathlords).

The Second Edition entry was the one that introduced the idea that Juggernaut wasn't properly dead, allowing for a prospect of functioning independently without the Mask. I recall some writers being critical of this change in a time towards Second Edition's end.

I would expect there's a good prospect of Third Edition reverting to the original, if only to trim some fat from the concept.

Heh, while I expect the description of lying supine was in error, I'm now suddenly imagining the citadel working like Tokyo-3, i.e. the buildings can rise through the flesh to stand inverted from the chest. It would be reminiscent of Mask's gimmick for turning around.

[JohnDoe244]

Heh, while I expect the description of lying supine was in error, I'm now suddenly imagining the citadel working like Tokyo-3, i.e. the buildings can rise through the flesh to stand inverted from the chest. It would be reminiscent of Mask's gimmick for turning around.

I like this so much that hitting the "like" button isn't enough. This is canon now.

As for the idea of Juggernaut being alive, Compass: Scavenger Lands says he's alive. Then Manual Abyssals, which literally references book and page number for Juggernaut's stats, turns round and says "nah, it's dead."

But yeah, the Essence harvesting maggots have been the big thing since 1E. I'd be surpised if they didn't make a return.

[Baaldam]

As best I understand, Juggernaut was introduced as a relatively straightforward dead giant whose corpse was animated by the most powerful necromancy. There was also a whole thing where its real value to the Mask of Winters was the maggots being cultivated within its flesh, that when ready would burst forth to be unleashed on somebody (I think originally the rival Deathlords).

The Second Edition entry was the one that introduced the idea that Juggernaut wasn't properly dead, allowing for a prospect of functioning independently without the Mask. I recall some writers being critical of this change in a time towards Second Edition's end.

I would expect there's a good prospect of Third Edition reverting to the original, if only to trim some fat from the concept.

Heh, while I expect the description of lying supine was in error, I'm now suddenly imagining the citadel working like Tokyo-3, i.e. the buildings can rise through the flesh to stand inverted from the chest. It would be reminiscent of Mask's gimmick for turning around.

I would suggest that any parts involved in the "Schrodinger's Juggernaut" debate and what edition actually did what should probably give a good, long read of the chapter 7 fiction in page 263 of 1e Exalted: the Abyssals, for a bit of perspective.

[JohnDoe244]

I would suggest that any parts involved in the "Schrodinger's Juggernaut" debate and what edition actually did what should probably give a good, long read of the chapter 7 fiction in page 263 of 1e Exalted: the Abyssals, for a bit of perspective.

1E presentation is hella cool nuanced take on life and death, with a cool twist. Then 2E did the 2E thing. But yeah, you can see where Compass: Scavenger Lands comes from.

1E: "Juggernaut is dead, like the Neverborn."
2E: "Juggernaut is ALIVE!"

[Baaldam]

1E presentation is hella cool nuanced take on life and death, with a cool twist. Then 2E did the 2E thing. But yeah, you can see where Compass: Scavenger Lands comes from.

1E: "Juggernaut is dead, like the Neverborn."
2E: "Juggernaut is ALIVE!"

The 2E version, tried to work on a kernel of an idea - while completely forgetting to check the source so they get it right, as 2E frequently did - simplyfing/flanderizing in the proccess.
As an aside, i think Juggernaut's stats had already been published in one of the late 1e books, but can't say for sure which one, so don't take my word for it.