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Essence KS 27th May '21

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  • Originally posted by Blaque View Post

    We know for a fact the next KS is Squeaks of the Deep for Pugmire. I think that there's also slated to be Trinity Continuum: Anima after that. Which would take up July through like, August/September. And this is assuming either launches like, next week.

    That said, I believe Exigents is appraoching ready to be Kickstarted and they said in a recent stream that they do want to do Sidereals next year. So I woudln't be surprised of Exigents were the last KS of this year or one of the first next year from OPP.
    James is going on holiday next week, so... I'd expect them holding off on a new KS until he gets back.

    Eyeballing the Editing list in the Monday Meeting notes, the only other potential KSes I can see are They Came From [Classified]! and Once and Future, and I'm a bit dubious about [Classified] what with it already having a jumpstart. So... fair chance at Exigents this year, I think.


    Scion 2E: What We Know - A wiki compiling info on second edition Scion.

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    • Originally posted by Blaque View Post

      We know for a fact the next KS is Squeaks of the Deep for Pugmire. I think that there's also slated to be Trinity Continuum: Anima after that. Which would take up July through like, August/September. And this is assuming either launches like, next week.

      That said, I believe Exigents is appraoching ready to be Kickstarted and they said in a recent stream that they do want to do Sidereals next year. So I woudln't be surprised of Exigents were the last KS of this year or one of the first next year from OPP.

      If you're interested, this is the current upcomign products form the game thougH:
      • Pre-Drafting Stages: Essence Stretchgoal stuff.
      • First Draft: Exalted Essay Collection
      • Redlines: Dragon-Blooded Novella #2
      • Development: Adversaries of the Righteous
      • Post-Approval Development: Exigents: Out of the Ashes, Many-Faced Strangers
      • Editing: Exalted Essence, Crucible of Legends, Across the Eight Directions, Lunar Novella #1
      • Art Direction: Exalted Essence Edition, Hundred Devils Night Parade
      • Backer Preview: Heirs to the Shogunate

      The tenative release schedule for Exalt Kickstarters, as a note is:
      • Exigents (Next)
      • Sidereals
      • Abyssals
      • Infernals
      • Alchemicals

      With Getimians and Liminals getting their own, non-Kickstarter books along with Sidereals and Abyssals respectively.

      I fling my sour grapes at the people who are more interested in sidereal martial arts then necromancy, lol. In retrospect necromancy should have just been in the corebook since its at least available up to the first circle for pretty much everyone and solars can get up to second. Maybe cheap out on word space by not putting in any 3rd circle spells just like they didn't put in any sidereal martial arts to still leave some stuff to put in the abyssal book for abyssal necromancers to look forward to. Of course that thing is already a behemoth whose physical collectors edition I could use as a deadly weapon so not much room to squeeze in even two circles of spells.


      Exalted Whose Name is Carved in Leaves of Jade

      Senator of the Greater Chamber

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      • Somebody else noticed the advantage of crafting ventures in the manuscript? There is one that talks about 'increasing the traits' of the object, and I'm thinking... does that means that you can create some pseudo-artifact weapons with a high enough roll?

        After all, the Artifact Tag gives +2 Overwhelming, and either +1 to Damage or Accuracy. But if I'm reading the advantage, right, you can increase a weapon Overwhelming by 2, which means that you just miss the +1 Damage/Accuracy to have the Artifact tag.

        And then the Artifact advantage gives +3... does that means you can have some truly outrageous weapons, like +6 Accuracy light weapons or +6 Damage heavy weapons?

        Seems a little extreme, but I cannot think about what other 'traits' the advantage could me talk about...

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        • According to Chapter 8, items have "statistics" and "tags".
          Clearly, referring to "traits" is a versioning error.

          I expect it will be quietly deleted.

          ****


          That said, Accuracy and Damage are still hit by the 5 success cap (and overwhelming is capped at 4).

          But you could make a weapon...
          Long Range
          +4 Accuracy
          +2/4 Damage
          4 Overwhelming.

          Start with the Light Ranged Weapon profile (Long Range, +3 Accuracy, +0 Damage, 1 Overwhelming).
          Craft it (+1 Accuracy, +1 Damage)
          Balanced tag (+1 Overwhelming)
          Powerful tag (+2 Damage, NB: close range only)
          Artifact (+1 Damage, +2 Overwhelming)

          A 4/4/4 weapon is pretty much nightmare fuel already. Let's make it worse.

          Throw on a Soulsteel Caste at Iconic with a 5 in Force and Ranged Combat and...

          At Close Range:
          You roll 10 dice with 10 automatic (cap breaking) successes to hit.
          You gain a minimum of 4 Initiative on Withering attacks, even if you miss.
          You get +9 levels of Decisive Damage on your attacks. Levels. Not dice. (And this is cap breaking.)

          (At Short and Medium Range you drop to just +7 Damage Levels, and at Long Range you are down to only +9 Successes To Hit.)

          You automatically hit 3CDs, and hit Deathlords with at least +5 Threshold successes (PLUS rolled successes).

          This costs 0 motes.

          You can 1m Excellency for another 5 dice on your attack roll, I guess. You could also add another +1 Damage from Charms if you have it... maybe something that adds the Flame tag to your attacks?

          On your starting character.

          But, sure, this has been extensively playtested and isn't broken.

          ****

          [Edit for tone]

          I like Essence. I do. It's clearly a labor of love, and at it's core, there's a good game here.

          But the PR around this game has been shockingly bad. Writers with great emotional investment in their work have reacted personally to criticism of everything from marketing (which they have nothing to do with) to mechanics (which is their personal work).

          I have great sympathy.

          And Scion 2E had a lot of cleanup between KS Manuscript and release. We've got a proven team of dedicated professionals here.

          I don't want people to take my criticism, or my snark, as an attack.

          But as examples like the above show, there are GAPING holes in this Beta that need to be fixed. This might be a 95% finished game, but that last 5% needs fixing.

          That's not snark. There's 15(?) types of venture, with 5 different characteristics, so of the 75 elements for ventures, there's a game-warping problem with 2 of them. That means the Venture System is 97% done. I think 97% of the Venture System is perfect. Great work! Getting 97% of the way there from your closed Beta is insanely good. Help us help you to get that last 3%.

          And this is an easy fix: delete the line about adding traits from the venture section. Done.
          Last edited by JohnDoe244; 06-27-2021, 06:09 AM.


          Hi, I'm JohnDoe244. My posts represent my opinions, not facts.

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          • I think deleting is excessive, but the options need to either be more costly or less numerous. Or both.

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            • Originally posted by Mizu View Post


              I fling my sour grapes at the people who are more interested in sidereal martial arts then necromancy, lol. In retrospect necromancy should have just been in the corebook since its at least available up to the first circle for pretty much everyone and solars can get up to second. Maybe cheap out on word space by not putting in any 3rd circle spells just like they didn't put in any sidereal martial arts to still leave some stuff to put in the abyssal book for abyssal necromancers to look forward to. Of course that thing is already a behemoth whose physical collectors edition I could use as a deadly weapon so not much room to squeeze in even two circles of spells.
              Personally, I'm more excited about SMA than Necromancy because I feel like sorcery does a very good job of being necromancy - I can already have a character who stalks through soporific mist hunting their foes with a whip made of blood, who draws power by sacrificing to their own ghost and sends people nightmares to bedevil their sleep. The only things I really need for a necromancer are calling ghosts and raising zombies.
              More spooky initiations and spells would be nice, but treating Necromancy as the Underworld-Themed parts of Sorcery works quite well (and fixes the problem where Necromancy is all Underworld-Themed but Sorcery contains themes of Creation, Malfeas, Yu-Shan and also the Wyld, so Sorcery is much more versatile than Necromancy)

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              • Originally posted by autXautY View Post
                I can already have a character who stalks through soporific mist hunting their foes with a whip made of blood, who draws power by sacrificing to their own ghost and sends people nightmares to bedevil their sleep. The only things I really need for a necromancer are calling ghosts and raising zombies.
                This.
                Necromancy is a completely vestigial game and setting element, and 3e should have merged it and sorcery together.

                In the meantime, there's a ghost-summoning spell in one of the Adversaries entries, and either a spell or Charm (which can be retooled into a spell) for raising zombie battle groups.

                Take those, retool the Mara fuckmurder ritual into more traditional human sacrifice, and boom: necromancer.

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                • Originally posted by autXautY View Post

                  Personally, I'm more excited about SMA than Necromancy because I feel like sorcery does a very good job of being necromancy - I can already have a character who stalks through soporific mist hunting their foes with a whip made of blood, who draws power by sacrificing to their own ghost and sends people nightmares to bedevil their sleep. The only things I really need for a necromancer are calling ghosts and raising zombies.
                  More spooky initiations and spells would be nice, but treating Necromancy as the Underworld-Themed parts of Sorcery works quite well (and fixes the problem where Necromancy is all Underworld-Themed but Sorcery contains themes of Creation, Malfeas, Yu-Shan and also the Wyld, so Sorcery is much more versatile than Necromancy)

                  I mean, by that logic whats the point of SMA when we already have weird stuff like dreaming pearl courtesan in regular supernatural martial arts? If something has to be as broadly useful and applicable as sorcery to be valid then nothing but sorcery is valid <_<

                  Edit: Heck, sorcery can make you better at punching people in weird ways like giving you a body of bronze so why have martial arts? Just roll it into sorcery >_>
                  Last edited by Mizu; 06-27-2021, 10:34 AM.


                  Exalted Whose Name is Carved in Leaves of Jade

                  Senator of the Greater Chamber

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                  • Oh and one thing: I assume this is just because it's a preview of the real thing, but I do kinda miss each charm having a cool as hell 1-2 sentence summation of its themes at the beginning of its text. Stuff like God-King's Shrike's "Sage-emperors returned from their long slumber, the Solars’ great beards have shattered their stone tables. In their great and terrible throes, they may call upon the forces of doom in order to save their world" for instance is so damn cool to me. I really hope that's not gone.

                    Originally posted by Mizu View Post


                    I mean, by that logic whats the point of SMA when we already have weird stuff like dreaming pearl courtesan in regular supernatural martial arts? If something has to be as broadly useful and applicable as sorcery to be valid then nothing but sorcery is valid <_<

                    Edit: Heck, sorcery can make you better at punching people in weird ways like giving you a body of bronze so why have martial arts? Just roll it into sorcery >_>
                    Well the point of SMA is that it is barely martial arts at that point and is more wild fate-manipulation shit. Also DPCS is explicitly mentioned as being dangerously close to SMA to the point that its capstone charm can insta-kill the character using it (actually, does that effect apply to Sidereal users of it? I'm going to guess that it cannot).
                    Last edited by Frostav; 06-27-2021, 04:10 PM.

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                    • I agree, I was pointing out how silly their logic for why necromancy might as well not even be a thing is. Especially since necromancy isn't even actually released yet so that we can even compare it to sorcery and make a judgement on how it compares. I don't actually think we should scrap SMA to just have regular martial arts with some of them being weird trippy stuff or that martial arts should just be rolled into being sorcery that helps you punch things.


                      Exalted Whose Name is Carved in Leaves of Jade

                      Senator of the Greater Chamber

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                      • Originally posted by JohnDoe244 View Post
                        I like Essence. I do. It's clearly a labor of love, and at it's core, there's a good game here.

                        But the PR around this game has been shockingly bad. Writers with great emotional investment in their work have reacted personally to criticism of everything from marketing (which they have nothing to do with) to mechanics (which is their personal work).

                        I have great sympathy.

                        And Scion 2E had a lot of cleanup between KS Manuscript and release. We've got a proven team of dedicated professionals here.

                        I don't want people to take my criticism, or my snark, as an attack.

                        But as examples like the above show, there are GAPING holes in this Beta that need to be fixed. This might be a 95% finished game, but that last 5% needs fixing.
                        This is basically my opinion. In some ways, it reminds me of the original Ex3 game. There's interesting new ideas, some are great, some need more work (and some are good but too complex). There's sacred cows that have been slain from previous editions, but there's a few that are still stuck around and are awkward. There are new ideas and mechanics brought in to solve problems from previous editions, which do that, but have their own issues. And it needs a good hard edit.

                        Unlike the 3rd ed Core, I think it might actually get a good edit. And they did say that they would consider altering stuff if people found ways to break the game.
                        The other stuff, not sure.
                        I can't really judge it until the final version though. I would like to be able to judge it now, but some of the stuff (withering attacks, milestones) is beset with versioning issues that makes it too awkward to judge.*

                        *I could run it, I think, as the writers did explain sort of how it's supposed to be on Discord, but it wasn't 100% clear and that's no good for people who don't read the Exalted Discord.

                        Tbh, I was very excited by Essence, but it just isn't what I wanted. I would have cancelled my pledge but didn't get round to in time.
                        If I run Exalted again (and I'm not sure I will, but I might run an Essence 1 DB game some time or maybe a short game to let people play their old, beloved characters again), I'll probably stick with the Core rules. They're a bit more complex, but they've had more errata, and we know them, which makes them simpler for our game than learning Essence.
                        Last edited by The Wizard of Oz; 06-28-2021, 08:30 AM.


                        STing Bronze Age Exalted

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                        • Originally posted by Mizu View Post


                          I fling my sour grapes at the people who are more interested in sidereal martial arts then necromancy, lol. In retrospect necromancy should have just been in the corebook since its at least available up to the first circle for pretty much everyone and solars can get up to second. Maybe cheap out on word space by not putting in any 3rd circle spells just like they didn't put in any sidereal martial arts to still leave some stuff to put in the abyssal book for abyssal necromancers to look forward to. Of course that thing is already a behemoth whose physical collectors edition I could use as a deadly weapon so not much room to squeeze in even two circles of spells.
                          Actually, if I am reading EE right we have one Necromancy tradition/initiation in E3 already. It 'retcons' the Wanasaan Exorcist tradition from WFHW as necromancy.
                          So it seems like there is a great deal of equivilancy between the two, so I imagine Workings will get more guidelines when Abyssals drops, (even if it is just in the form of "Here is a list of things Necromancy can do that Sorcery shouldn't").


                          Thoughts ripple out, birthing others

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                          • Originally posted by JohnDoe244 View Post

                            Throw on a Soulsteel Caste at Iconic with a 5 in Force and Ranged Combat and...
                            I just noticed that one of my players is a Soulsteel and read his Iconic anima bonus. This seems a little bit over the top. 4-5 Automatic successes, who don't break the cap, on every Attack and Damage roll, I just don't get it.


                            My homebrew (Leave comments if you want to help improve) : A quick recap of all the pools and stats for Quick Exalted 3E characters

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                            • Originally posted by Chausse View Post

                              I just noticed that one of my players is a Soulsteel and read his Iconic anima bonus. This seems a little bit over the top. 4-5 Automatic successes, who don't break the cap, on every Attack and Damage roll, I just don't get it.
                              Based on my reading of the manuscript and listening to interviews and such of the devs, actually hitting that 10th Anima to trigger your iconic is pretty tricky to do in a useful time frame so the iconic powers are intentionally kinda gonzo.


                              Exalted Behind a Screen of Jade, Savant of the Immaculate Texts, No Moon Scholar, Good Sitting Dog, Best Lurking Cat with Bones, Pioneer Pooch, Corsair, Director, Keeper of the Karstein Manor, Scion with Shield of Knowledge, Erymanthian Boar, Seeking Awakened, Cloaked Changeling, Family Head, Kindred, Agent, Poltergeist, Disciple of the Antler Crown, Wraith, Conspiracy Theorist, First Time Traveler

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                              • Originally posted by SamuraiMujuru View Post

                                Based on my reading of the manuscript and listening to interviews and such of the devs, actually hitting that 10th Anima to trigger your iconic is pretty tricky to do in a useful time frame so the iconic powers are intentionally kinda gonzo.
                                Interesting it's true than in 3e it's excessively easy and the dynamic might not be the same in Essence


                                My homebrew (Leave comments if you want to help improve) : A quick recap of all the pools and stats for Quick Exalted 3E characters

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