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  • I'm really bad at this because I would consider a large part of what makes the worth of an Ally is precisely his supernatural "heritage", usually before his abilities or attributes. (I wouldn't say they do not matter but definitively less than his power and potential to grow)


    My homebrew (Leave comments if you want to help improve) : A quick recap of all the pools and stats for Quick Exalted 3E characters

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    • Originally posted by Chausse View Post
      I'm really bad at this because I would consider a large part of what makes the worth of an Ally is precisely his supernatural "heritage", usually before his abilities or attributes. (I wouldn't say they do not matter but definitively less than his power and potential to grow)
      I know, right?

      We're half a dozen sessions in and I've yet to need stats for Allies -- "God-Blooded" has been enough.

      But I'm going to need stats, and I have no idea where to peg them. (Except "lower than a Young Dynast").


      Hi, I'm JohnDoe244. My posts represent my opinions, not facts.

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      • Originally posted by JohnDoe244 View Post
        Are there stats for any canon god-blooded suitable as a 1 dot Ally?

        I was thinking of using Mist (Corebook page 502), but his stats are comparable to the Young Dynast (clearly a 3 dot ally).

        The Wyld Barbarians sidebar on page 500 suggests adding supernatural merits to a mortal template. That seems like it probably works for god blooded.

        I was also considering using the Snakefolk Merchant stats.
        Fivefold Masks and Lies?


        I run... Lunars: The Apocalypse! Exalted 3rd edition. Fimbulwinter is upon the world as an Ice Age begins, and only six young Lunar heroes have a chance of saving humanity.

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        • A thing I've been wondering. It's investigation. So let's say something happens. You investigate a murder. Someone was stabbed to death in this room. You search through. You find the droplet of blood or piece of cloth or strand of hair that lets you crack the case. You track down the perpetrator. You grab him. Case closed.

          So how about this. You're an essence 5 solar. 30 years ago, your mother was walking down this road. And then, she was stabbed, robbed, and left to die. Her body was found a week later, after the rats and the sun and the birds had a go at it. So her body was already badly decomposed. 30 years pass, and your powers grow greater and greater.

          And now, you're back at the exact same spot. The perpetrator was masked. Rains and the hot sun, and the passage of time, has literally worn the place away. The street might not even exist, having long since made way for houses or a shopping mall.

          Now what? How are you going to find the killer?

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          • Originally posted by Accelerator View Post
            A thing I've been wondering. It's investigation. So let's say something happens. You investigate a murder. Someone was stabbed to death in this room. You search through. You find the droplet of blood or piece of cloth or strand of hair that lets you crack the case. You track down the perpetrator. You grab him. Case closed.

            So how about this. You're an essence 5 solar. 30 years ago, your mother was walking down this road. And then, she was stabbed, robbed, and left to die. Her body was found a week later, after the rats and the sun and the birds had a go at it. So her body was already badly decomposed. 30 years pass, and your powers grow greater and greater.

            And now, you're back at the exact same spot. The perpetrator was masked. Rains and the hot sun, and the passage of time, has literally worn the place away. The street might not even exist, having long since made way for houses or a shopping mall.

            Now what? How are you going to find the killer?
            Well if you were at the initial crime scene then you could use Mind Manse to reconstruct the scene in your mind and maybe combo it with Unknown Wisdom Epiphany to reconstruct the events of the incident. This might enable you to piece together evidence or ideas that weren't available back then. Example you know the killer was masked, but courtesy of your enhanced powers and deductive abilities you're able to reconstruct the killer's figure and build from the time of the incident off some foot prints or impressions. You might be able to piece together if there was something unique that can be used to track the killer (the knife wasn't a normal dagger and you can track down the knife.)

            If you weren't at the initial crime scene and weren't there quickly enough to get useful evidence before the 30 year time gap then you're left with needing to use other methods. Namely going and contacting spirits or something that would have seen and possibly kept record of the incident and using that as your starting point. The other being finding entities that might be able to assist you in dredging up information (leveraging your investgativce mastery to ensure that they're trustworthy) and convincing them/trading services with them to aid you in the investigation.

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            • Originally posted by Accelerator View Post
              Now what? How are you going to find the killer?
              Well you could start with the Essence 5 charm Mind Manse Meditation, and that should give you some kind of lead somewhere to start the investigation, assuming you've done at least a bit of looking into the case before.

              If you're just starting this case totally fresh, and it's so cold that the entire street that she was killed on has been overturned, then you're going to need to try and track down people who might have been there and asking them.

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              • You just loudly announce that you're going to start investigating, then the next night there's a thunderstorm and a man in a trench-coat and fedora hands you an envelope full of clues.

                Shadows of The Ancient Past can blow the case wide open for a sorcerer.

                Mind Manse Mediation and Evidence Restoring Parana might help. Otherwise you do what RL investigators working a cold case do.

                Exhume the body. Crafty Observation Method isn't going to be much good, but it's something. You can expect to be rolling Difficulty 5 for not much evidence. Talk to the undertaker. Talk to the priest. Who found the body?

                Talk to who lives nearest now. Find out who lived there before them. Talk to those people. Repeat. Repeat again. Repeat again until the trail goes cold.

                Physically examine the scene of the crime.

                Talk to local law enforcement. Talk to retired law enforcement. Talk to local merchants and anyone with an interest in there not being murders on the loose. Anyone who might have records of suspects or of other unsolved murders.

                Talk to your family. Did mother have any enemies? Was anyone threatened? Does anyone have any clues, hints, suspicions? Listen carefully -- with Solar skill you might pick up on something they overlooked. Did your mother have any friends? And enemies?

                Talk to the local gods and ghosts. Your quest may lead you to the very Beuro of Endings.

                Talk to the local rats.

                Dress as a bat and terrorise cowardly and superstitious criminals. Sooner or later a master assassin will resurrect your mother as a liminal to use against you.

                Not many shopping malls in Creation. I imagine you could still get DNA off a body with a Charm building off Evidence Restoring Prana.
                Last edited by JohnDoe244; 11-16-2019, 09:50 AM.


                Hi, I'm JohnDoe244. My posts represent my opinions, not facts.

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                • Apologies if this has been answered previously (it most definitely has I bet), but I tried the search function and didn't get much relevant posts up sadly.

                  In any case, on to my question. I am a bit embarrassed by this, but I have been game mastering Exalted now in my current campaign for 13 sessions, and it has dawned upon me that I must have misunderstood how Clash attacks works. I don't really get it. In the Core it says that Clash attacks are attacks on the same tick, which is what I have been assuming all along. I thus viewed Clash as a novelty, something that rarely happens and is cool if it does. However, many charms seem to imply that you can reflexively clash. I don't know if I understand it correctly, I think this is explained in an outrageously bad way in the Rule Book, but I have realised that too many monsters and exalts are statted with defensive powers that have the Clash key-word, with barely any other defensive charms, which makes me suspect that Clash is the main form of defense, which makes no sense if you can only use the power during the same Initiative tick. As stated, I have assumed these can only be used in Clash, but again, these Clash powers popping up everywhere seems really to imply that I have misunderstood gravely, that you can manipulate Clash somehow and possibly reflexively use a charm with the clash keyword without being on the same initiative tick. But I don't know for sure, I feel a bit like an idiot I confess and it is a great shame if I have been doing it all so wrong.

                  So please, can someone with a good understanding of the mechanics carefully explain to me how Clash-charms works ?

                  In advance, my sincere thanks !

                  Regards, Magnus.
                  Last edited by Magnus K; 11-13-2019, 07:37 PM.

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                  • Originally posted by Magnus K View Post
                    So please, can someone with a good understanding of the mechanics carefully explain to me how Clash-charms works ?
                    The Clash keyword is as clear as mud, I agree.

                    tl;dr A Charm with the Clash keyword of type Reflexive does create a reflexive clash.

                    To be far more wordy:

                    Without Charms, there are two ways to create a clash. The first is if two characters acting on the same tick decide to attack each other. You are correct in saying that this is pretty rare.
                    The second is for a character to delay. Once a character has delayed, they may declare they're taking their action now and it's an attack on the attacker. This means two characters are attacking each other on the same tick, so it's a clash. (As a side note, this also lets the delaying character make this decision after the attacker has declared Charms. This is deadly!)

                    With Charms, there's the Clash keyword. The Clash keyword indicates a Charm that creates a clash, and if it's of type Reflexive the Charm can be used to reflexively Clash. (Though some charms may specify otherwise!) (I'm unaware of any non-Reflexive Clash keyworded Charms, but they might exist!)
                    Some Clash charms say they count as the user's combat action. This means they can't be used if you've already acted this turn and consume your action if you haven't acted this turn.
                    Some Clash charms say they count as the user's attack. This means they can't be used if you've already attacked this turn and prevent you from attacking on your turn if you haven't acted this turn. However, you can still take a non-attack action on your turn.
                    Some Clash charms say they don't count as the user's combat action. This means they can be used if you've already acted, attacked, clashed, whatever.
                    Some Clash charms don't say. This is infuriating and I can't help you in this situation.

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                    • To break this apart further, let's look at an example. Force-Rending Strike is Reflexive, has the Clash and Decisive-Only keywords and says "The Exalt glances into the aura of violence before her and knows the course of her opponent’s strike, meeting it with a greater violence of her own. This Charm allows the Solar to make a reflexive Brawl-based clash attack against an incoming decisive attack. This does not count as the Solar’s combat action."
                      The first sentence is flavor text.
                      The second sentence indicates that the Charm does indeed create a clash attack, and do so reflexively. It also stipulates that the Charm only functions against an incoming Decisive attack.
                      The third sentence indicates this is one of the Clash charms that doesn't consume any action. So a Solar who uses this before their turn to protect themselves from an enemy can do whatever they want when their turn comes around, or even use this Charm again before or after then.

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                      • Thank you so much. This is exactly what I came to suspect (the reflexive charms forcing a clash attack or counter attack etc.), but when I checked the rules for Clash, I just got the same old sentences that caused my confusion, and worse, severely wrong take on the rules. Very grateful for your write up. I can basically print screen this and hand out to my players (they have also read the rules, not one of them understood this correctly either). It was not at all obvious to us that a Clash charm forces a clash, but as I wrote above, that was the conclusion that I came to suspect given that many NPCs have only a clash charm as defensive powers etc. The layout in the Core is atrocious, but this was badly explained and it wasn't really before my players fought Octavian that I realised that something was wrong (he has clash defensive powers etc.).

                        Thank you very much for clearing this up for me. I wish I could have read it in the rules though (maybe it is there in a single sentence, but if so, I have not found it).

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                        • I think your explanation of clashes is mostly correct. There's just a couple of points I'd like to quibble about.

                          Originally posted by vwllss trnt prncss View Post
                          The second is for a character to delay. Once a character has delayed, they may declare they're taking their action now and it's an attack on the attacker. This means two characters are attacking each other on the same tick, so it's a clash. (As a side note, this also lets the delaying character make this decision after the attacker has declared Charms. This is deadly!)
                          I would actually not declare the attacker's charms before the delaying character has declared whether or not they are clashing. The attacker would have to commit to attacking, yes, but then I'd ask the delaying character if they were going to clash or not. Only once they had decided would I have the attacker declare charms. Delaying to create a clash gets a bit too powerful if the delaying character can wait until charms have been declared before deciding if they want to clash or not, and I believe there are some charms that enhance clashes without automatically creating them, and it would be unfair to the attacker if they couldn't use those charms, and had to spend motes on charms that affect the target's Defense (which don't apply in a clash) while the delayer can.


                          Originally posted by vwllss trnt prncss View Post
                          The second sentence indicates that the Charm does indeed create a clash attack, and do so reflexively. It also stipulates that the Charm only functions against an incoming Decisive attack.
                          I don't think the last part here is correct. The Decisive-Only keyword says it has to be used with a decisive attack made by the user, and doesn't have any text changing this for clashes. That says, to me, that when you use a Decisive-Only Clash charm, the attack you use to clash the attack must be Decisive. Normally, you could choose whether to make a withering or decisive clash, but in this case, it has to be decisive. This is more balanced, because you can use it against a wider variety of attacks, not just to clash decisive ones, but it means that if you hit, you'll be resetting to base initiative, leaving yourself more vulnerable.

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                          • Hmm, you know the rules are atrociously explained in Core (compared to DB and Lunars is it horribly written) when people debate this at the latter part of 2019. My sincere thanks to both of. You are helping our group a lot, because I as a Game Master knew something was wrong, I just wasn't able to explain or justify my suspicions. My players have also assumed that their charms like Solar Counter attack only works during, yes you guessed it, clash. Our Dawn is going to be happy now...

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                            • Originally posted by Magnus K View Post
                              Thank you very much for clearing this up for me. I wish I could have read it in the rules though (maybe it is there in a single sentence, but if so, I have not found it).
                              Glad I could help. The rules are horribly written and lead to a bunch of ambiguity and confusion if you don't have somebody to clear things up for you. For example, see below!

                              Originally posted by Kelly Pedersen View Post
                              I would actually not declare the attacker's charms before the delaying character has declared whether or not they are clashing. The attacker would have to commit to attacking, yes, but then I'd ask the delaying character if they were going to clash or not. Only once they had decided would I have the attacker declare charms. Delaying to create a clash gets a bit too powerful if the delaying character can wait until charms have been declared before deciding if they want to clash or not, and I believe there are some charms that enhance clashes without automatically creating them, and it would be unfair to the attacker if they couldn't use those charms, and had to spend motes on charms that affect the target's Defense (which don't apply in a clash) while the delayer can.
                              Great catch, thank you. What I mentioned is only true for clash-creating Charms, not clash-creating actions. There's no rules guidance for how to declare Charms on an action-created clash.

                              Originally posted by Kelly Pedersen View Post
                              I don't think the last part here is correct. The Decisive-Only keyword says it has to be used with a decisive attack made by the user, and doesn't have any text changing this for clashes. That says, to me, that when you use a Decisive-Only Clash charm, the attack you use to clash the attack must be Decisive. Normally, you could choose whether to make a withering or decisive clash, but in this case, it has to be decisive. This is more balanced, because you can use it against a wider variety of attacks, not just to clash decisive ones, but it means that if you hit, you'll be resetting to base initiative, leaving yourself more vulnerable.
                              In this case, it's the charm text stating "incoming decisive attack" that restricts the Charm to functioning only against decisive attacks.
                              That said, you've raised an excellent point regarding the Decisive-Only keyword. The text of that keyword is "Decisive-only: If it’s an attack Charm, the Charm can only be used with a decisive attack. If it is a defensive Charm, it can only be used to defend against a decisive attack." Is a Clash Charm an attack Charm, a defensive Charm, or both? Following from that, does the keyword mean the created clash attack has to be decisive, mean the clashed attack has to be decisive, or both? I don't have an answer.


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                              • Originally posted by Magnus K View Post
                                My players have also assumed that their charms like Solar Counter attack only works during, yes you guessed it, clash. Our Dawn is going to be happy now...
                                That's almost the reverse of how it's supposed to work, in fact - Counterattack charms specifically can't be used in response to charms with the Counterattack or Clash keywords. The point of Counterattack charms is that they let you attack out of turn and interrupt the opponent's attack. Unlike clashes, which change the attack into a contest of combat skill against combat skill, counterattacks still target the opponent's defense. Even though, technically, both attacks in a counterattack situation are happening on the same tick, they're not a clash.

                                Basically, clashes happen when two fighters strike at the same instant, and the question of who hits whom boils down to pure offensive skill. They can be done by mortals. Counterattacks, on the other hand, are only created by charms and similar magic, and represent a character being attacked, and reacting to that so quickly that their response hits in the same moment that their foe's blow lands.

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