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How would you like to see combat balance between exalt types?

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  • How would you like to see combat balance between exalt types?

    We've been told that tiers aren't explicitly a thing in third edition and that the different exalt types will be closer to one another in terms of power. We've been told that Lunars were equivalent to Infernals in terms of combat t one point during development.

    What would you like to see in terms of balance in the specific area of combat between the different exalt types?

    For instance as a starting point (and I haven't really dwelt on the issue much) my preferences are , If I have a Lunar exalted who has spent x amount of experience and and build points into areas directly related to beating things up. I think that in my preferred game I'd,betting wise, put even odds on a fight between the lunar and any of the following.

    A solar with 0.8x points expended in the acquisition of charms, artifacts, and so on directly related to beating things up
    An abyssal with 0.8 x points (perhaps a solar might have the edge against an abyssal but this won't matter in a scruff with a lunar)
    A sidereal with no time to prepare with 1.3x points
    A sidereal with time to prepare with 0.8x points
    A dragon blooded with 2.5 x points
    Three dragonblooded with 0.6 x points

    There is of course a lot to say about weaknesses and strengths of a any particular character and I'm not sure how "tippy" I'd like things to be (as in how much does an abyssal with 3x experience points in combat prowess have to be concerned if she comes to blows with a dragonblooded with only X experience points, in a sort of "on any given Sunday" manner)

    What sort of a balance in the area of combat would you like to see. I suppose I'd like to hear about other areas too but they don't lend themselves to comparison as easily
    Last edited by Apromor; 11-07-2013, 03:28 PM.


    I want to play this as a starting character, I don't even care what game.

  • #2
    Just to start with worthless pedantry, you've skipped a whole edition there!

    About the actual balance, honestly it's hard for me to say without knowing how the combat engine works. The old "Sidereals prepare where and how they fight" is possibly relevant, but that's probably just an extension of a core ambush mechanic rather than something they have specifically?

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    • #3
      In a classless game such I think it's very hard to make any meaningful statements about how good you should be with 80% xp. However all else being equal I think that something like this is expected:
      *All the Solaroids are will win a fair fight against a non-Solaroid.
      *Lunars will beat Sidereals in a fair fight, Sidereals will win a fight they prepared
      *A group of Dragonblooded will generally be able to defeat any kind of Exalt.

      However those things are not all that interesting in my opinion, that stuff is all very abstract and has little meaning for actual play. I'd like to see Dragonblooded be able to make awesome contributions even if the rest of the party are Solars or Lunars. I'd like to see Sidereals be able to join circles without it being super-awkward. I'd like to see characters not specialised in combat still feel like they're being useful.

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      • #4
        I corrected the edition, whoops.

        You say that you can't answer but I'm not asking you how you think things will be, I'm asking you what do you think that you'd like?

        Or are you trying not to form an opinion in order to make it easier to love whatever we get?


        I want to play this as a starting character, I don't even care what game.

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        • #5
          I'd like to see combat balance between Exalt types be entirely situational, and only evaluated through a situational lens.


          Incentive is not permission or justification.

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          • #6
            I'd like to see combat decided between *every* entity as the result of a vote between ACE with a inverse square fall off as distance.

            So when, e.g. a mortal and a third circle demon fight, all ACE get polled to see who should win. One twice as far away as the nearest only has one quarter the voting power though, and so on.

            I think this nicely allows for upset victories while still preserving ACE at the top of the heap. Though as an ACE, better hope you don't piss off your fellows or they'll vote you to death.

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            • #7
              Buried in one of the books somewhere, quite probably the 1e core book, there's some quote alone the lines of "When the Exalted clash, the outcome is never certain."

              I'd like it to be that.

              Edit: Also, I like how the OP acknowledges that the tiers of Exalts aren't really a thing anymore, than asks people to sort the Exalts into tiers.


              Have you ever read a Coik post before, man? lol
              -Holden

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              • #8
                I don't want specific tiers but DB's and Solars shouldn't even approach the same level of combat. Exalted has never been about fairness or there is a clear divide in terms of who's good at what. That level of parity should still exist.

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                • #9
                  A combat-specced Solar fighting a combat-specced Dragonblood should stomp the dragon into the ground nine out of ten times, but a circle of five dragons fighting a circle of five Solars should be an even match.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Ars Fan View Post
                    We've been told that Lunars were equivalent to Infernals in terms of combat t one point during development.
                    If you were told that, it was not by anyone working on EX3.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Holden View Post

                      If you were told that, it was not by anyone working on EX3.
                      Q: Out of the deluge of questions...I really have one about Exalted 3e that's burning for me. My selfish one What is changing about the Lunars, even if only in rough, how are you improving them? (Mostlyjoe)
                      A: They are going to be devastatingly badass in a fight. I am lining them up to be able to take on Infernals. I want a Lunar swordsman who is just as capable in a fight as a Lunar going full-time DBT. Lunar thematics will be more tightly focused on the dualism of a "good" person who has a monster inside, or a monster who has a good person inside. Rage, transformation, and shapeshifting will be much more strongly evinced in their narrative and their mechanics. (John Mørke)
                      Damn it, Holden, stop embarrassing yourself. That's Vance's job.


                      [Ex3] Why Gods Need the Exigence - Plot hooks for Exigent characters of various gods.
                      [Ex3] Homebrew Solar Charms - I can see the future, and it is glorious.
                      [Ex3] The Glass Library - My Exalted Third Edition Blog (Updated 24/04/2016)

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                      • #12
                        Answering the thread question: for White Room combat what you have presented is quite nice. But...

                        I see a a prepared sid would have the same chances as a combat specked solar. Is that a combat specked sid? is he bringing back up like celestial lions? Just want to know what prepared means. I hope is some kind of traps and debuffs being setup.

                        Now I think that saying X xp is bit dangerous because there substantial difference how you can combat optimize between 4 xp, 40 xp, 80 xp etc etc.

                        but if this at least holds true until ca 75 xp that would be a major improvement, but properly not enough to make me cry hurra over the new engine past a five sessions of awarding xp. Not as a ST at least.

                        just for fun but also because they are important antagonist how to fair folk and demons scale on that list (maybe even ghost, elementals)... but most important of all. Where does the Tyrant Lizard fit :P?

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                        • #13
                          Able to take on =/= equivalent to.

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                          • #14
                            I'm sorry, I can't help but wonder what the fact that Infernals were the ones specifically mentioned means about Infernal/Solar combat level difference. Or Lunar/Solar really.

                            I kind of imagine E3 Infernals as being bad in the Evocation department and compensating with Shintai...

                            Idle thought, idle thought. Carry on.


                            Bits and pieces of Exalted setting.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Zironic View Post
                              However those things are not all that interesting in my opinion, that stuff is all very abstract and has little meaning for actual play. I'd like to see Dragonblooded be able to make awesome contributions even if the rest of the party are Solars or Lunars. I'd like to see Sidereals be able to join circles without it being super-awkward. I'd like to see characters not specialised in combat still feel like they're being useful.
                              Bah, everyone wants that. There's no room in there for disagreement without being ridiculous. that hardly rates as more interesting. My question was what sort of balance in combat and only in combat between the different types of exalted put in the context of how you would set odds for a fight. It is a subject that can be debated precisely because it is so very abstract. It obliquely relates to how people think about the different types of characters without actually having them think about it directly.

                              This is the internet dear fellow you can't come here expecting to only confront what is useful and relevant.


                              I want to play this as a starting character, I don't even care what game.

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