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[Complete] Ex3 Solar Charm rewrite

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  • Aranfan
    replied
    You don't seem to have produced the original of Awakening Eye. Which does matter because there are stealth effects that prey on 1s.

    Edit: you also didn't produce an original version of Unswerving Eye, which I think can differ from the original charm when the GM asks for Per+Awareness rolls to notice multiple people doing multiple things.
    Last edited by Aranfan; 08-27-2016, 10:57 PM.

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  • Irked
    replied
    Another update (v2.1), in light of the (very much appreciated) comments and suggestions above.

    Changelog:
    -In places with function-changing houserules, reproduced both original version of the Charm (tagged "original") and the modification I actually use (still tagged "modified," with footnotes clarifying the difference).
    -Adjusted Perfect Mirror to fit with the suggested interpretation above.
    -Fixed the duration on Destiny-Manifesting Method.

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  • WalkingEye
    replied
    Originally posted by Irked View Post
    Or "Instant," which means no commitment, though the Charm may leave persistent effects. Most offensive combat Charms are Instant, for example, even those that (say) inflict lingering penalties.

    In this case, the Charm downgrades the incoming curse, and then terminates. It works exactly the same in that regard whether it's Reflexive/Instant or Permanent/Permanent. (The book vacillates between using those two categories to describe basically the same effects; I generally trend towards Reflexive/Instant for effects you actually decide to use, saving Permanent for effects that say "Z is now true of you," or "Whenever X, Y.")
    Ah now I understand.

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  • Irked
    replied
    Originally posted by WalkingEye View Post
    So duration usually goes.
    Set Duration(a tick a scene a month a season)
    Indefinite( as long as you commit the motes)
    Permanent( forever with no motes committed)
    Or "Instant," which means no commitment, though the Charm may leave persistent effects. Most offensive combat Charms are Instant, for example, even those that (say) inflict lingering penalties.

    In this case, the Charm downgrades the incoming curse, and then terminates. It works exactly the same in that regard whether it's Reflexive/Instant or Permanent/Permanent. (The book vacillates between using those two categories to describe basically the same effects; I generally trend towards Reflexive/Instant for effects you actually decide to use, saving Permanent for effects that say "Z is now true of you," or "Whenever X, Y.")

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  • WalkingEye
    replied
    Originally posted by AtG View Post
    Awkwardly, the official duration of a charm is there mostly to tell you how long motes stay committed, not how long the charm's actual effects last.
    So duration usually goes.
    Set Duration(a tick a scene a month a season)
    Indefinite( as long as you commit the motes)
    Permanent( forever with no motes committed)

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  • AtG
    replied
    Awkwardly, the official duration of a charm is there mostly to tell you how long motes stay committed, not how long the charm's actual effects last.

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  • WalkingEye
    replied
    Originally posted by Irked View Post
    Wouldja believe the answer is "By accident?" Duration on that should be Instant, not Indefinite.

    (Thank you!)
    shouldn't it be permanent still just like in the book since it covers the curse for the duration which can be forever?

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  • Irked
    replied
    Originally posted by WalkingEye View Post
    Why did you change Destiny- Manifesting Method making it so you must commit the motes?
    Wouldja believe the answer is "By accident?" Duration on that should be Instant, not Indefinite.

    (Thank you!)

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  • WalkingEye
    replied
    Why did you change Destiny- Manifesting Method making it so you must commit the motes?

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  • putty
    replied
    I'm pretty sure upgrade charms include all the features of their predecessor unless otherwise stated. It certainly works that way for every combat charm with an upgrade.

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  • Irked
    replied
    Originally posted by LVTHN View Post
    You can't pierce the disguise without magic like that which can pierce Flawlessly Impenetrable Disguise. Even with such magic, you need a pretty serious excuse to roll, and you suffer a severe penalty.

    Otherwise, it's substantially worse in certain ways than the Charm it's supposed to be an upgrade to. Flawlessly Impenetrable Disguise just works - mundane senses can't penetrate it, ever, even if you dance around while calling the person you're disguised as a stupid fucktard - while Perfect Mirror doesn't? Doesn't seem right.
    That's a good argument - thanks!

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  • LVTHN
    replied
    Originally posted by Irked View Post
    I think I was unclear from the way the original was written whether mundane senses could be used to pierce the disguise if you acted grossly out of character, and tagged it modified to be clear that I was imposing an interpretation.

    I'm still not sure. Here's what the Ex3 corebook says:

    So clearly if you stay in character, the disguise can't be pierced. But let's say you go way, way out of character; the "Characters are not..." sentence sounds like in that case people can notice the disguise. And then the next sentence seems to indicate that even in that case, they need magic... maybe?

    How would you read that?
    You can't pierce the disguise without magic like that which can pierce Flawlessly Impenetrable Disguise. Even with such magic, you need a pretty serious excuse to roll, and you suffer a severe penalty.

    Otherwise, it's substantially worse in certain ways than the Charm it's supposed to be an upgrade to. Flawlessly Impenetrable Disguise just works - mundane senses can't penetrate it, ever, even if you dance around while calling the person you're disguised as a stupid fucktard - while Perfect Mirror doesn't? Doesn't seem right.

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  • Irked
    replied
    Originally posted by Aranfan View Post
    So, how was Perfect Mirror modified, anyway?
    I think I was unclear from the way the original was written whether mundane senses could be used to pierce the disguise if you acted grossly out of character, and tagged it modified to be clear that I was imposing an interpretation.

    I'm still not sure. Here's what the Ex3 corebook says:
    The impersonation is perfect. It cannot be pierced by
    mundane or inhuman sensory acuity. Characters are not
    entitled to attempt to see through the disguise unless the
    Solar behaves in a grossly inaccurate way. Even so, a
    witness using Charms or other magic to penetrate the
    disguise suffer a -4 dice penalty to do so.
    So clearly if you stay in character, the disguise can't be pierced. But let's say you go way, way out of character; the "Characters are not..." sentence sounds like in that case people can notice the disguise. And then the next sentence seems to indicate that even in that case, they need magic... maybe?

    How would you read that?
    Last edited by Irked; 08-25-2016, 09:19 AM.

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  • Aranfan
    replied
    So, how was Perfect Mirror modified, anyway?

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  • Irked
    replied
    Originally posted by AtG View Post

    Ugh.

    The answer I really want to give here is "Increasing Strength Exercise is a bad Charm and I wish it didn't exist".
    Pretty sure we're on the same page there, yeah.

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