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September Update: Check out the Devas!

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  • September Update: Check out the Devas!

    Ok, so, short overview first : I freaking love the Deva write-up overall... there may be a few points where initial reading made me go a little 'whu?' but the more I read it the more I find I love it and find that Mendez has done an amazing job with the Hindu Pantheon

    Now, for the longer review : I love the introduction. Both for how utterly badass the second paragraph makes the Pantheon sound and also because the beginning paragraph is emulating the Nasadiya Suktam, the Vedic Hymn of Creation.

    I'm happy to see Kartikkeya included, and pretty ecstatic to see Durga (and not as an aka of Kali). Speaking of whom, I am just a tad dissapointed that Kali isn't in the core... I hope to see her in the Companion, and I'll probably put up my own homebrew write-up for her in a bit for all the potential Annie X's out there.

    As a Shakta myself, I love the references to how the Goddesses are constantly splitting and fusing with each other.

    As for the actual God writeups, I'm particularly fond of the way the introductory paragraphs manage to stuff in half a dozen origin stories in the style of a hymn. I'm particularly fond of the write-ups for Durga, Ganesha and, most of all, Sarasvati (the last of which basically makes me want to create a Scion of Her right now). Also, love the inclusion of Indra's entire menagerie and the opening line for Shiva is pretty much the most Shiva sentence ever.

    I'm also happy to see the wide variety of opinions... while the Deva are as a whole undoubtedly among the most dedicated to opposing the Titans, for every Durga and Indra we see an Agni and a Ganesha, and yet others like Parvati, Sarasvati and Lakshmi, who seem more interested in just helping people out than any war.

    Cosmology wise I love the Sixteen Planes of Existence (which I'm sure is another thing the Deva love hanging over the Aesir and their Nine Worlds)... the description of the Cow Level and the Mani Continent makes me imagine Krishna and Durga literally trying to jostle each other's realms out of top like a pair of drivers in a high octane car chase sequence in some action movie.

    I am a little iffy on Brahma being a Primordial... not that he doesn't fit the bill honestly, but it makes him feel a little out of sync with Vishnu and Shiva (which, again, to be fair, is not unfitting his actual treatment in the religion). Basically I feel there's more than one right answer to the Brahma question and I think Mendez' position is most definitely one of those right answers.

    Fun Fact : While I am a Kshatriya by caste, my specific sub-caste is Kayastha, whose traditional task has been governance and most importantly, scribe-work. The whole line is supposedly descended from Chitragupta, the scribe-scretary of Yama, so it's actually kinda funny for me to see my supposed mythical divine ancestor mentioned in the Naraka write-up.

    I am very happy that in the World the Island Kingdom of Lanka is explicitly different from the actual country of Sri Lanka... from what I gather Sri Lankans aren't very happy with being told that their country used to be ruled by Titans until an Indian Prince came and saved them, so good call I think.

    I will give Mendez seven stars for his write-up just for calling the Religion Section 'The Hinduisms' instead of Hinduism It is an excellent overview of the religions(s) and I love how it emphasizes the inherent crazy amounts of diversity in it.

    Rounding up, the Birthrights part and current political situation is very good, and I've already noted how perfectly fitting I think the Virtues of Conscience and Duty and the PSP of Yoga is.

    I think one of the best compliments I can give the Deva write up is actually something Sacredos said way back when the Shen were previewed... "All together, I think this is the most well-crafted Pantheon yet, it really gives off the feel you get from reading traditional Chinese literature."

    And truly, reading this gives me the feel of reading scripture, with the sheer reverence that went into the God profiles and the description of the World of the Deva... and the impact the Deva have upon the World... Great job!

    Also, full disclosure, I had the good fortune of being one of the Beta Readers mentioned in the update, so I've been sitting on my gushing for a while now, and I'm happy to finally see it come out to the World

  • #2
    Hey Samudra,Remember Rishis storyes you told me? This preview makes them even more awesome,since it means that Brahma,the primordial was turned into a baby by Atri and Cursed by Bhrigu,That's just Awesome in spades

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Samudra View Post
      I am a little iffy on Brahma being a Primordial... not that he doesn't fit the bill honestly, but it makes him feel a little out of sync with Vishnu and Shiva (which, again, to be fair, is not unfitting his actual treatment in the religion). Basically I feel there's more than one right answer to the Brahma question and I think Mendez' position is most definitely one of those right answers.
      One thing that I think makes it make sense (I was thinking about it because I had similar initial feelings as you), is that it's been implied that in Scion 2E a deity's exact state between Primordial, Titan, and God can shift. Vishnu and Shiva are Gods BECAUSE they chose to be more engaged with their worshipers and/or incarnate more directly into the world; while Brahma chooses to remain more distant and transcendent in identity and thus remains a Primordial.


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      • #4
        Obviously hoping to see Kali in the Scion Companion. My other top pick for a deity not on this list currently would be Chandra. She's less important today under the the paradigms of Vaishnavaism, Shaivism, and Shaktism - but in the older Vedic tradition she'd be the lunar counterpart to Surya's solar dominion, in addition to being an astrology goddess, and the goddess of soma itself (giving her a role not unlike Idunn for the Aesir).


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        • #5
          As with all the other pantheon preview before, i really like the part about the pantheons relationship with the other pantheons. And again, as with the other previews, i would've wish to see more.


          Currently running: VtR - The most serene requiem of Venice
          Currently playing: Being a dad for a 1year old daughter and a newborn son.
          Currently planning: Scion 2nd edition

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Samudra View Post
            As for the actual God writeups, I'm particularly fond of the way the introductory paragraphs manage to stuff in half a dozen origin stories in the style of a hymn.
            Both fitting the tone, AND acknowledging "Look there's like SIX different stories about where Ganesha came from"

            Edit: I also like the note in the Relic section that says "Look, the Deva have a HUGE amount of awe-inspiring superweapons"
            Last edited by Kyman201; 09-18-2017, 04:07 PM.


            Disclaimer: I'll huff, grump, and defend my position, but if you're having fun I'll never say you're doing it wrong.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post

              Edit: I also like the note in the Relic section that says "Look, the Deva have a HUGE amount of awe-inspiring superweapons"

              Interesting that supposedly no wielder of another pantheon's superweapons want to test their might against the astra - because I'd think someone suggesting that was the case would just make Thor grab Mjolnir and scream "CHALLENGE ACCEPTED!"

              I realize of course that elsewhere its states both Pantheons work to make sure Thor and Indra don't run into each other... but honestly that would just make Loki scream "CHALLENGE ACCEPTED!"


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              • #8
                So thinking about their legends - I'm assuming the Anunna are also in the hardline-Titanomachy camp with the Deva, Teotl, and the Theoi.


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                • #9
                  And that's the hook for someone's campaign.
                  Echoing all the praise so far, the only thing I could even come close to campaigning about is curiosity about why Kali wasn't in? I guess there's probably some work to do separating pop culture and original myth.


                  But sexually.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by glamourweaver View Post
                    So thinking about their legends - I'm assuming the Anunna are also in the hardline-Titanomachy camp with the Deva, Teotl, and the Theoi.
                    Y'know what Annuna related matter i'm really curious about? Their Tablet that controls fate,how does such a relic work in the Scion World i wonder

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                    • #11
                      Ah, yes the Deva. There isn't really much I can say that wasn't already said by the opening post, but I do enjoy how closely it is correlated with Vedic texts. Admittedly, I am somewhat jealous how well this reads in comparison to the previous Shen preview, although I think it is partly because some translations of Chinese texts, particularly of the local variety, just don't exist and so can't be referenced.

                      But if they can keep up this amount of quality up for the Kami preview once that becomes available, I will be quite satisfied.


                      How can I know if what I claim I know to be true is rejecting the idea that there is something I might not know? How can I know if what I claim I don't know to be true is rejecting the idea that there is something I do know?
                      -Zhuangzi

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                      • #12
                        There's also the unavoidable reality that Scion's default cosmological assumptions do emerge from an Indo-European tradition (hence the Titanomachy being the degree of "thing" it is), so even when writers do a great job with the Shen or Netjer or Orisha there's a degree to which they are crammed to fit a paradigm that the Deva (particularly the older Vedic gods) more easily slip into.

                        Without question though 2E is doing a WAY better job with it than 1E.


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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by glamourweaver View Post
                          Obviously hoping to see Kali in the Scion Companion. My other top pick for a deity not on this list currently would be Chandra. She's less important today under the the paradigms of Vaishnavaism, Shaivism, and Shaktism - but in the older Vedic tradition she'd be the lunar counterpart to Surya's solar dominion, in addition to being an astrology goddess, and the goddess of soma itself (giving her a role not unlike Idunn for the Aesir).
                          I'm hoping to put up a homebrew of Kali in a day or so actually also while I love Chandra, I've never seen him depicted as a Goddess, always a God. My other pick for inclusion in the Companion would be Ganga, Goddess of the Sacred Ganges River, who no doubt has... Words to say about the current state of said river

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by glamourweaver View Post

                            One thing that I think makes it make sense (I was thinking about it because I had similar initial feelings as you), is that it's been implied that in Scion 2E a deity's exact state between Primordial, Titan, and God can shift. Vishnu and Shiva are Gods BECAUSE they chose to be more engaged with their worshipers and/or incarnate more directly into the world; while Brahma chooses to remain more distant and transcendent in identity and thus remains a Primordial.
                            Well, depending on whom you ask, Brahma's lack of worship is a side effect of being cursed by either his wife Sarasvati or his brother-in-law Shiva... (which I guess is a God level Artistry marvel, to literally change the course of culture to the point where a God is no longer worshipped commonly) which would mean Brahma becoming (or staying, depending on how you think he started out) a Primordial is on them.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Samudra View Post

                              I'm hoping to put up a homebrew of Kali in a day or so actually also while I love Chandra, I've never seen him depicted as a Goddess, always a God. My other pick for inclusion in the Companion would be Ganga, Goddess of the Sacred Ganges River, who no doubt has... Words to say about the current state of said river
                              Oops! My mistake and apologies. I had misremembered what I was taught on the subject. I had no doubt you were correct, but checking my ow notes the error was definitely my own memory rather than my sources. So again, my mistake!

                              I think I made the mistake because all the cases I know of it being a personal name are of women.
                              Last edited by glamourweaver; 09-18-2017, 07:34 PM.


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