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  • #31
    Originally posted by Watcher View Post

    Like, honestly, totally. I spent a while sitting around trying to think of a good historical setting for Ireland, and just nothing works brilliantly. The problem is both that a lot of those wounds are still totally fresh as you mention, and also that the Tuatha have a general apathy leaning 'desire to overthrow' relationship with the mortals of Ireland. They're hard to write into a story that doesn't end with them bursting out of the Sidhe mounds with iron chains for the descendants of Mil.
    Why not run that idea to the hilt then and focus on the Irish immigration to the US in the 1800s and 1900s where a lot of them did enter into an exceedingly shitty social place? The Tuatha might see revenge happen again and again and again and then kind of begin to wonder at what point this stopped being funny.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by Watcher View Post
      The French Revolution might be an interesting period to look at a clash between the Theoi aspects and Nemetondevos aspects. The overthrow of the Crown due to famine, bad rulership, and inhospitality is entirely legitimate in the Gaulish system as much as we can reconstruct it. Even things being whipped up to a frenzy of executions can tie into the Gauls and the Head Cult. But then there is conflict with the Theoi as classical thought starts to take over the Revolution and it moves away from a Celtic 'Bres-Situation' to a classical philosophy situation of 'The True State'.
      That would be pretty interesting. I think you could also work in some sort of Loa angle to such a setting.

      I fear a lot of potential historical settings are going to run into the "Ireland problem". It's one of the reasons I have such a hard time thinking up a good "modern" setting for the Persians, and why I wanted to avoid WW2 with the Norse and Japanese pantheons, or do anything with the Haitian revolution for the Loa.

      That said, it was why I considered the possibility of having the "modern" settings be ones in which the PCs could potentially shift the corse of history into something subjectively "better", either by modern perspectives or from the values of the Pantheon. Say, a group of Chinese Scions in the period between the Opium War and Boxer Uprising managing to revitalize (or replace) the Qing Dynasty with something that clearly holds the mandate of heaven and takes its place among the world powers, or Norse Scions defeating the Norman invasion of Britain to ultimately build a North Atlantic spanning Nordic civilization.


      What is tolerance? It is the consequence of humanity. We are all formed of frailty and error; let us pardon reciprocally each other's folly. That is the first law of nature.
      Voltaire, "Tolerance" (1764)

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      • #33
        Originally posted by Alpharius View Post
        Why not run that idea to the hilt then and focus on the Irish immigration to the US in the 1800s and 1900s where a lot of them did enter into an exceedingly shitty social place? The Tuatha might see revenge happen again and again and again and then kind of begin to wonder at what point this stopped being funny.
        I would totally run that game, I should probably be running the historic horrific luck that has plagued the Irish as some sort of lingering curse thrown on the descendants of Mil before the tribes withdrew beneath the hills. I don't think the Tuatha would ever find it as 'too much,' however. The big thing to always remember with the Tuatha is they are colonizing invaders who either a) exterminated or b) regulated to a small geographic area, the native population they found upon arrival. They are mono-focused on Ireland, the rest of the world is a pale shadow of it in their mind. All they want is Ireland, and they're not always super friendly with the mortals that took it from them by force of arms. I can see an interesting story behind someone getting the Tuatha to intervene by making a Crossroads Pact with one of them in for relief from some horrific event in return for giving up a section of the surface.

        I think that in a Historic game, the Tuatha would make awesome antagonists however. They have been shamed, and embarrassed by the events of the Lebor Gabála Érenn. They could very much be the source of any number of horrific twists of luck that has derailed Irish history. Heroes, the profession not the tier of play, have a function of something of intermediaries between the Otherworld and the Mortal world, so a Band of Scions trying to deal with their parents and the mortals being at each other's throats could be a great basis for any number of historic settings in Ireland.

        Originally posted by No One of Consequence View Post
        That would be pretty interesting. I think you could also work in some sort of Loa angle to such a setting.

        I fear a lot of potential historical settings are going to run into the "Ireland problem". It's one of the reasons I have such a hard time thinking up a good "modern" setting for the Persians, and why I wanted to avoid WW2 with the Norse and Japanese pantheons, or do anything with the Haitian revolution for the Loa.

        That said, it was why I considered the possibility of having the "modern" settings be ones in which the PCs could potentially shift the corse of history into something subjectively "better", either by modern perspectives or from the values of the Pantheon. Say, a group of Chinese Scions in the period between the Opium War and Boxer Uprising managing to revitalize (or replace) the Qing Dynasty with something that clearly holds the mandate of heaven and takes its place among the world powers, or Norse Scions defeating the Norman invasion of Britain to ultimately build a North Atlantic spanning Nordic civilization.
        Yeah, there's.... yeah. Modern History is a series of increasingly dangerous pitfalls for any official publication in my mind. Lots of ways to get bad headlines. The benefit of a lot of historic stuff is the wounds have faded. No one's going to mind (or honestly, notice probably) that the native Brythonic-British population are still under the Anglo-Saxon boot in a Anglo-Saxon v. Norwegian v. Norman game centered around 1066.

        Modern settings inevitably are touching still-fresh wounds, where Historical Settings have the benefit of getting to deal with things that are... less touchy subjects. There are still touchy things like dealing with Alexander the Great since, like, that gets into the whole Greek v. Macedonian mess, but it is leaps and bounds safer to play with. Also historic events tend to be less well documented which makes it easier to convert them into games essentially. More empty space on the page to work with without erasing anything.
        Last edited by Watcher; 11-24-2017, 08:42 PM.

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        • #34
          Speaking of really old events that people are still touchy about i wonder if we can do anything with the burning of the library of Alexandria?

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          • #35
            Originally posted by ahather View Post
            Speaking of really old events that people are still touchy about i wonder if we can do anything with the burning of the library of Alexandria?
            Which one?

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            • #36
              the great one

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              • #37
                Originally posted by ahather View Post
                the great one
                ​I'm not an expert on the subject, but I think Crying is referring to the fact that there are technically three separate incidents in which the Library at Alexandria was burned. It wasn't just one big incident with one single culprit to blame.


                "We have done the impossible, and that makes us mighty."
                Captain Malcolm Reynolds

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                • #38
                  Some of these are taken straight from other people's suggestions.

                  Aesir:
                  • Classic: 8th and 9th century AD, perhaps with a special focus on exploring the edges of the world, including Vineland.
                  • Crossover: The British Isles in the late 9th-early 10th centuries. Mix up the Welsh, Irish, and Norse gods.
                  • Modern: Not touching WW2 with a ten foot pole. Scandinavia during the Swedish Empire 1611-1721 would probably be the best time. Would involve a lot of crossover with the Slavic gods if no one else.
                  Devas:
                  • Classic: The Later Vedic Period (1100-500BC).
                  • Modern: The British conquest of India in the late 18th-early 19th centuries.
                  Kami:
                  • Classic: The later Kamakura Period (13th century), maybe including the failed Kenmu Restoration
                  • Modern: Again, not touching WW2 with a ten foot pole. However, the Taisho Democracy period just before that has potential.
                  • Alternate: The late 1980s during the Bubble Economy.
                  Manitou:
                  • Classic: The Iroquois or Huron confederations in the late 1500s. First contact with the French seems to have been in the very early 1600s.
                  • Modern: Another awkward one, I don't really want to touch heavily on our (American and Canadian) treatment of the first nations but there aren't many ways of avoiding that. Possibly a Seven Years War setting, trying to put the tribes in the best possible position to deal with the winners after the war.
                  Netjer:
                  • Classic: The Third Dynasty of the Old Kingdom, under Djoser, with his court wunderkind Imhotep.
                  • Crossover: Ptolemaic dynasty, mixing in the Theoi in both Greek and Roman forms.
                  • Modern: The 1920s, after the discover of King Tut's Tomb.
                  • Alternate: Victorian Era, with a focus on ritual magic societies and mysticism.
                  Orisha:
                  • Classic: The Oyo Empire c.1400. Shango has been ascended for about a century at this point and the Oyo kingdom is transforming into an empire.
                  • Alternate: The Golden Age of Piracy in the late 17th century. The Loa are in the process of forming as a sub-pantheon.
                  • Modern: Yorubaland around 1960 when the British granted independence to the various states.
                  Shen:
                  • Classic: The Three Kingdoms period seems to be the obvious choice. Guan Yu may or may not be a god yet depending on the precise date.
                  • Modern: The Qing dynasty in the period between the Opium Wars and the Boxer Uprising.
                  Teotl:
                  • Classic: The Aztec Empire at the end of the 15th century.
                  • Modern: The Second Mexican Empire (1863-1867) or the Mexican Revolution (1910-1920)
                  Theoi:
                  • Classic: The Greek Heroic Age, when all the famous Heroes had their adventures. Spans about six generations from the founding of the city-states until the Trojan War.
                  • Modern: The Romantic Period, with a special focus on Lord Byron and the Greek War of Independence.
                  Tuatha:
                  • Classic: Ireland around the 1st century (AD or BC, either one)
                  • Modern: Again, sensitive time and place. I really don't know that there's a good way to do a setting in Ireland given that the wounds are still raw in places. Doing one in the US during prohibition might be an interesting 'god-lite' crossover with the Roman Theoi as scions get involved with the mob and the mafia.
                  Yazatas:
                  • Classic: The Kayanian Dynasty, which is the setting of both the Avesta (the sacred text of Zoroastrianism) and the Shahnahmeh (Iran's national epic)
                  • Alternataive: The Sassanid Empire during the reign of Khusrau Anushirvan.
                  • Modern: Another tough one. Maybe the Safavid Dynasty.

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                  • #39
                    For both Yazata and Deva it might be interesting to take a look at the time period of the Arab conquest of Iran, only focusing the story not in Iran but in India, where groups of Zoroastrian refugees from Iran took refuge... from what I can gather the only records of the time were not composed until centuries afterwards, and a lot of debate goes both within and without the Parsi community as to the exact nature of events, so there's a lot of ambiguous history for storyteller's to play with and players to leave a mark on, as well the potential for the ways the Deva and Yazatra might be dealing with each other as this is going on.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by The Insaniac View Post
                      Some of these are taken straight from other people's suggestions.[/LIST]Manitou:
                      • Classic: The Iroquois or Huron confederations in the late 1500s. First contact with the French seems to have been in the very early 1600s.
                      • Modern: Another awkward one, I don't really want to touch heavily on our (American and Canadian) treatment of the first nations but there aren't many ways of avoiding that. Possibly a Seven Years War setting, trying to put the tribes in the best possible position to deal with the winners after the war.
                      Hmm. I'd suggest the Beaver Wars in the 17th century, but that may not be far enough removed from the classic.

                      If you were going with the idea of having a setting in which PC Scions of that pantheon can change history to their pantheon's benefit, then maybe the American Revolution, either getting the entire Confederacy to remain completely neutral or get the Mohawk, Seneca, Onondaga and Cayuga to remain neutral or join the Tuscarora and Oneida in siding with the Colonists, in order to head off the Sullivan Campaign and keep the Confederacy intact as a regional power to be recognized by the new United States, or going out and winning the war for the British (at the battle of Saratoga, maybe, as in Robert Sobel's For Want of a Nail) so that the Confederacy is a powerful and respected British ally/client state that is a buffer between the New England and New York colonies and Quebec/Canada.




                      What is tolerance? It is the consequence of humanity. We are all formed of frailty and error; let us pardon reciprocally each other's folly. That is the first law of nature.
                      Voltaire, "Tolerance" (1764)

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                      • #41
                        War of the Roses with the Aesir backing York, and the Plant Don rallying for the Tudors when the Red Dragon is unfurled.


                        Check out my expansion to the Realm of Brass and Shadow

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                        • #42
                          I'm pondering the idea of some sort of space opera setting in which each pantheon has settled it's own planet and the Scions are the divine champions of their world(s). Something influenced by Stargate, the Thor movies, the Voodoo hackers in Mona Lisa Overdrive, and any Japanese anime showing stylized mixes of classic architecture with ultra-hightech structures. I admit that this is mostly just because the idea of space vikings with laser axes and falcon-headed cosmic space barges fighting giant samurai mecha and Cyberknights of the Round Table strikes me as ludicrously fun.


                          What is tolerance? It is the consequence of humanity. We are all formed of frailty and error; let us pardon reciprocally each other's folly. That is the first law of nature.
                          Voltaire, "Tolerance" (1764)

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                          • #43
                            no no i would play the fuck out of that

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                            • #44
                              I'm sort of imagining such a set up as each Pantheon having it's own system, such as the Norse having the Yggdrasil System, with nine planets, of course, named after the Nine Worlds, with Asgard, Midgard/Mannheim, and Vanaheim being Earth-like worlds, Ljoalfheim and Svartalfheim as twin worlds sharing an orbit, Hel as a dark prison planet, Jotenheim as a gas giant, Muspelheim as the closest to the sun, and Niflheim as the furthest. Valhalla and Folkvangr as moons of Asgard. Jormungandr as an astroid belt. Bifrost as a interplanetary stargate/transportation system. Other Pantheon's systems would follow a similar pattern.


                              What is tolerance? It is the consequence of humanity. We are all formed of frailty and error; let us pardon reciprocally each other's folly. That is the first law of nature.
                              Voltaire, "Tolerance" (1764)

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                              • #45
                                yeah that sounds really cool although tbh i dont know enough about the cosmologies of other mythologies to comment on what sort of system i would give them. on a similar (but non scion note) how familiar are you with the mechanisms if not listen to their latest album (concept album) 'the Bifrost Incident' here,

                                Does anyone have any ideas for divine systems?

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