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[2E Setting Hack] Gods in Hiding and new Mythic Age

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  • Kyman201
    replied
    Originally posted by wyrdhamster View Post
    ‘Those creatures can sense in this disguise each other by spending 1 Momentum and rolling contested their Legend dots pools rolls.’
    I stand corrected.

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  • wyrdhamster
    replied

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    But the mechanics assume that your players will be parting the Mists often, which will only happen at Origin tier. When they enter Hero tier, they ARE divine, and thus they would be immune to the Mist. They won't be making dice rolls to see through it. Thus, once you leave the Origin tier, the MECHANICS you proposed may as well not exist, because the PCs won't be rolling dice to see through the Mists.
    I never said that Hero are immune to Mists. I explicitly pointed that difference Legend level beings are hiding between themselves:

    ‘Those creatures can sense in this disguise each other by spending 1 Momentum and rolling contested their Legend dots pools rolls.’

    When you have Satyr checking Legend 3 Hero, Satyr rolls 1 dice ( as Denizens are treated Legend 1 begins for this ) and Hero rolls 3 dices. If Satyr win, he see divinity in Hero. If Hero wins – Satyr see only mundane.

    You can clearly see here that Heroes ( or even Demigods ) can have problems piercing Gods Legends of 9-12 dices…

    It maybe limiting to players on even higher Tiers of game – but sounds fitting for the Iron Myth Level games, I think. Even Heroes are not sure who the Gods are then.
    Last edited by wyrdhamster; 05-05-2019, 04:02 AM.

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  • Kyman201
    replied
    Originally posted by wyrdhamster View Post
    Why they won’t be doing that? Knowing who is new character in chronicle is always advantages. New guy is going for your money? Let’s part the Mists. The new CEO shows interest in PCs? Let’s part the Mists and see if he is Incarnation. I do not understand how Mists start to be irrelevant on Hero Tier of game.
    Mechanically, they're irrelevant. As a narrative tool, they work. But the mechanics assume that your players will be parting the Mists often, which will only happen at Origin tier. When they enter Hero tier, they ARE divine, and thus they would be immune to the Mist. They won't be making dice rolls to see through it. Thus, once you leave the Origin tier, the MECHANICS you proposed may as well not exist, because the PCs won't be rolling dice to see through the Mists.


    I will check those. But it could be simply argue that parting the Mists is much harder than Trivial Boons. Or even Marvels. Will check it and see power level of those to compare.
    There, uh, there's no such thing as a TRIVIAL Boon. Boons are serious effects woven of divine power. Marvels can be small and subtle, with things like blessings and curses, or they can be as big as 'Substantial effects on the environment.

    But even Boons that aren't as OUTWARDLY flashy as 'Flight' or 'Call down flame', they're usually quite major. Cloaking one's self in illusion is a Boon. Blessing someone to let their Inner Beauty (or ugliness) shine through is a Boon. Granting a frustrated artist a rush of inspiration that comes out of the blue is a Boon. Granting a family property or family line a blessing of fertility or cursing them with blight is a Boon.

    Sometimes Boons and Marvels are used against Trivial TARGETS, who are the Background Characters that don't contribute much to the plot. Using a Boon to shapeshift someone blocking your path on the street is done for free, because that was John Nobody blocking your path. It doesn't take much to work your miracles on him.

    Could you elaborate on this one? English is my second language and in this statement, I barely understand what you are writing here.
    Okay, here's how it works in Vanilla Scion 2e. Let's say that Odin wants to do some Odin Tricks, but doesn't want the mess that comes from people realizing that Odin is out and about. This is mentioned as being a real risk for the Gods, because these beliefs could form Fatebindings, which can dictate a God's personality and actions. If people saw Odin push a poor person out of the way and KNEW it was Odin because Odin was being overt, then hypothetically people could spin that as "Odin hates poor people", and since that Deed was seen, it could lead to that sticking to the identity of Odin.

    THIS is the reason why Gods in the World rarely manifest as themselves. Instead, they create a false identity that the game calls an Incarnation. So Odin does not walk the World as Odin the All-Father. He walks the World, more often than not, under a fake name. Like, say, Ulric Alspach, a man from Germany who has a PhD in Classic Literature, and lost his eye due to an unfortunate accident in his 8th year of schooling, and often goes about with a pair of pins on his suit that look like raven heads. He has the proper paperwork, most people THINK they remember Professor Alspach once he introduces himself, and he may answer some questions for some PCs, or show up and acquire a rare collectors book of ancient wisdom, all without revealing himself as Odin.

    Now, some people may be able to go "Wait a minute... One eye... Knows many things... Walking stick that looks like a spear... Raven-shaped lapel pins? Ah-HA!"

    Which, I think, is the kind of thing you want to evoke with the Parting the Mists mechanic. But the thing is, mechanically, if the player makes a roll but fails, they're going to have their suspicions anyway. You can, if they go "Wait a minute, I make an Occult check", be vague. Confirm that yes, One Eye and Two Ravens ARE INDEED signs that denote Odin. Curious, that.

    Only it’s not the whole reason of the my rule in the hack in first place. You see, Mists are also to solve all the problems with Gods interventions on day-to-day basis with general mortals population. By Scion 2E vanilla World, if Gods are using Marvels and Purviews – mortals are seeing it and remember it. Without Mists phenomena, simply whole world knows that Gods now exists. And this particular forum topic main goal is – I reminder you - Gods in Hiding – Mists nicely explain that Odin is doing his own work and Internet or newspapers are not writing about it all the time.
    As I've said, many times, the fact that you're using Mists isn't what I'm debating. I just think you're making an overly complicated mechanic for something that doesn't even need a mechanic.

    Though I'll also note in the Vanilla World, the Gods don't openly manifest for just everyone. I wager not everyone's prayers get answered. If someone prays to Sarasvati to pass their final, it COULD be that Sarasvati wove a miracle to make them better at the test... Or it could be that they studied.

    Or it could be that Sarasvati, in ways subtle and unseen, worked a bit of magic to help them study better.

    I imagine that in the World, Gods are credited to far more answered prayers than they actually answered.
    Last edited by Kyman201; 05-05-2019, 03:29 AM.

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  • wyrdhamster
    replied
    Quick answer on the post of ‘you do not need mechanics’ – I will think about it. I like to have basic rules reflecting game world for my tables to run with. To everyone as needed. But I will think if I need those as mechanics in the end.

    (Answering previous post. )
    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    That's not what I brought it up for. Basically, when the players become Heroes, the Mists cease being relevant in any way. Because THEY won't be making checks to pierce the veil, the NPCs will.
    That's why I kept noting that this mechanic feels pointless to me. It only applies to Origin games, so once you get to Hero it stops being relevant. All the dice throwing will be done by the DM in order to identify the true natures of the PCs. So if you're playing at Origin then it may have a point, but once it gets past that the players no longer engage with it. Once they get to Hero, they stop making the checks, and they can part the Mists to reveal themselves in all their glory.
    Why they won’t be doing that? Knowing who is new character in chronicle is always advantages. New guy is going for your money? Let’s part the Mists. The new CEO shows interest in PCs? Let’s part the Mists and see if he is Incarnation. I do not understand how Mists start to be irrelevant on Hero Tier of game.

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    Which honestly, I wouldn't even charge them Momentum for, as using the Scion Hero rules for Marvels, throwing Marvels and Boons at Trivial targets is completely free. No Legend, no Momentum.
    I will check those. But it could be simply argue that parting the Mists is much harder than Trivial Boons. Or even Marvels. Will check it and see power level of those to compare.

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    So you'll fudge further, be honest. You'll just go "Ugh, if it's dramatically important for the NPC to see the truth, they will" and thus this Mist Check has utterly stopped being mechanically relevant.
    You may do what you want – I like to have basic rules reflecting game world for my tables to run with. To everyone as needed.

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    They just spin up an Incarnation and walk unseen, to avoid excessive Fatebindings by showing their full glory (without stepping on the list of Questions that 'They let Humans forget that they exist' brings up).
    Could you elaborate on this one? English is my second language and in this statement, I barely understand what you are writing here.

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    The sidebar also mentions that maybe, just maybe, players will start to suspect they're interacting with a God. In THAT case... Still don't say anything until they try to make a Culture or Occult check to try and recognize some of the Omens of the God in question. Ideally, they won't suspect they were talking to Odin in disguise until he's already left.
    It’s a general good point on storytelling. I will remember it.

    Only it’s not the whole reason of the my rule in the hack in first place. You see, Mists are also to solve all the problems with Gods interventions on day-to-day basis with general mortals population. By Scion 2E vanilla World, if Gods are using Marvels and Purviews – mortals are seeing it and remember it. Without Mists phenomena, simply whole world knows that Gods now exists. And this particular forum topic main goal is – I reminder you - Gods in Hiding – Mists nicely explain that Odin is doing his own work and Internet or newspapers are not writing about it all the time.

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  • Kyman201
    replied
    Using something like the Mist is an acceptable idea.

    I don't think making it a roll-based mechanic will fit for most of the games. You note that it works fine as a purely narrative feel. So why make it a mechanic? Why put the difficulties?

    The Mist explains why people don't see the werewolf run away from the dead bodies. Maybe a player can find some grainy footage and realize (through I dunno an Occult or a Survival check) that wolves don't walk like that, that's no normal wolf.

    I'm setting aside the idea of my feelings on the whole "Gods hiding their existence" thing. Just, set that aside. We're not talking about that.

    I'm engaging purely on the standards of your proposed mechanics, which honestly feels as necessary as D&D requesting that you always make an Athletics check to climb a ladder, clumsily patching the rules for "Take Ten" in when the better solution is that you shouldn't need to make a roll to climb a ladder.

    Again, to use your strategy of unnecessary bolding, not everything needs to be a dice roll.

    Generally, you want a roll if the two things are true:
    1. The chances of the player succeeding is in doubt
    2. Failure leads to something Interesting.
    So, hypothetically, when the Mists come into play... Is the chance of players seeing through the Mist in doubt? Probably.

    If they fail to pierce the Veil, is it interesting? ... Eeeeeeeeh generally no? If they need to see through the Mists for Plot reasons, you'll fudge it to help move the Plot along.

    So why bother making it a roll? What, gameplay-wise, is engaging about constant checks? What does this add that say, the thing of "Spend Momentum to glimpse through the Mist" doesn't do better?

    What does it add that makes it an improvement over just "The Mists occasionally part for the PCs and they swear they see hooves on that guy running the gyro stand but then they blink and it's gone"?

    It doesn't. It's pointless 99% of the time, so why bother making it a mechanic? More mechanics don't always make a game better. You can just note "Hey there's a thing called the Mist that hides the Divine from mortal eyes, sometimes people who get too close to the Mythic can see through it" and boom, done.

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  • wyrdhamster
    replied
    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    What kind of enrichment comes from making this a clunky mechanic? How does this Mechanic make the game better?
    By covering existences of Mythical Beings in the setting. Lessening the dissonance of ‘everyone is afraid of Gods interventions’ in some players that want to run Iron or Heroic Myth Level games – me included. Not implying ‘every ancient religion is now somehow at least recognized in modern world because it’s ruled by active gods’. Whole Everyday life with Gods problems I pointed before. It also makes game much more as ‘American Gods’ book or TV series, which is nice bonus for us .😎 Let’s leave it here and do not dwell in this topic more on it as this discussion runs counter to topic goal.

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    What happens if, in an Origin game, you're hoping that your players follow up on the Mist gaping but the PCs don't make the throw to see through them? Through the target parting the Mist in order to keep the plot on track?
    In Origin level I try not to base plots on Mists parting. Like Origin corebook states in Storyguiding Chapter –
    ‘This concept of genre change will be explored in later Scion books, but much of Origin exists on the Iron level: the mundane daily lives of mortals with the divine relegated to nothing but signs and omens that may or may not be real. At times, however, the game verges on the Heroic level: the pinnacle of “mundane” where the supernatural is apparent to some, where the action gets intense and death-defying, where centaurs curse and throw horseshoes on paved roads, and satyrs deal MDMA in clubs.’

    You DO NOT need parting of Mists to point that people are killed, something is dealing MDMA with weird side effects, items are stolen and some feats of impossibility maybe in there. This rule only forces that setting, on general, is not talking all the time about new corporation merging from Hera and Aphrodite, players character are not assuming from start they are ‘sons of gods’ – and that finally seeing the satyr in it’s true form is an event. Generally, Mists rules moves us from baseline Scion 2E the World setting – into more one like Supernatural or American Gods TV series. What was to be attained in this topic. 😎

    However, if rules miss us and I would see on session that players are stuck – I would simple ‘slip’ the Mists this time. It was even planned from the start – that ‘slipping by Mists’ is a thing that clueless, starting Origin characters do. On the start of the road, characters do not know that Legend exists – so they need to see a glimpse of it ‘by accident’ and only there to get a hold they can see it on will, if they concentrate. First or two sessions they may get glimpses, from their own, they have mechanics for forcing parting of Mists themselves.

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    If the Mist will possibly fail when the story needs it even if the mechanics may get in the way, what's the point of making it a mechanic? Mechanics should serve the story, not potentially disrupt it. See the Tracking ability in D&D. If you fail to find the trail, then the plot is stuck in the mud. Failure isn't interesting in this case, so I'd hesitate to require a roll.
    Remark on the need to roll is maybe a good one – I will think on it. However, rules are also to ensure the setting. In this example, rule is to ensure that we deviate from baseline Scion 2E gameline. It’s like pointing that in Scion 2E you have gods you can play Scions of – mechanics are there to point that it’s not only storytelling, but fundamental fact of the game that players are to use.

    Mists are there also so players can use them to their own advantage. In a setting with Mists rule, police is not suspecting they can get in contact with son of Thor. They do not suspect you can use magic. Police is not suspecting they are after the dragon. Rule only making this a game fact.

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    And, when the Players go to Hero Tier, how do Mortal NPCs try to activate a 'See Through The Mist' check? Mortal NPCs don't have Momentum, they have Tension, but Tension is rare enough to accumulate that I wouldn't want to burn it each time someone tried to identify the true nature of the Heroes?
    So mortals in the World with Mists do not check all the time if players are Scions of Gods. Which is exactly as it should be in this setting hack. Mortal ‘hunters’ of mythical should be rare in this world. It’s just a fundamentals of the world building in it.

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    In fact, why do they have to spend a finite resource to make a check that could fail? If they fail to pierce the Mists, will they get Momentum for a failure? If the option is "Make the check or get the Momentum back" then why not just make it so they can spend Momentum to Glimpse Something's True Nature?
    On this, I will ponder. Putting hard rule of ‘you pay Momentum, you see the Truth’ is simple and elegant, I must say. But then, it would equal difficulty of seeing satyrs true form and primary gods, like Odin or Zeus, for example. I’m not sure I like this. Maybe in next revision of rules I just separate those interpretations for pointing to Iron and Heroic Myth Levels – Iron would be based on rolls, Heroic would be ‘you simply pay Momentum’. Probably will go with this, thanks.
    Last edited by wyrdhamster; 08-30-2021, 05:20 AM.

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  • Kyman201
    replied
    Originally posted by wyrdhamster View Post
    Once you know someone is Being on Legend – you simply know this. You do not forget that you band-mate is Hero like you – or that this particular con man is Odin in hiding. Yes, Mists will hide players – but it simply works for their own advantage. 8-)
    That's not what I brought it up for. Basically, when the players become Heroes, the Mists cease being relevant in any way. Because THEY won't be making checks to pierce the veil, the NPCs will.

    That's why I kept noting that this mechanic feels pointless to me. It only applies to Origin games, so once you get to Hero it stops being relevant. All the dice throwing will be done by the DM in order to identify the true natures of the PCs. So if you're playing at Origin then it may have a point, but once it gets past that the players no longer engage with it. Once they get to Hero, they stop making the checks, and they can part the Mists to reveal themselves in all their glory. Which honestly, I wouldn't even charge them Momentum for, as using the Scion Hero rules for Marvels, throwing Marvels and Boons at Trivial targets is completely free. No Legend, no Momentum.

    Really, if it were me, I wouldn't make this a mechanic at all. I'd rule that Origin players can see through the Mists if it's important to the plot that they be able to. If the players want to pierce the veil using Occult or what-not, they can try, probably at Difficulty 1-3 depending on the being that's hiding in the Mists. Once the Mists start hiding the Players, then you, the GM, would hypothetically roll for those who see through the Mist. But be honest. You, as a GM, have better things to do with your GM time than rolling for every Bill, Sally, and Chris that the Heroes run into. So you'll fudge it. You'll only roll for important moments. Hell, a lot of NPCs won't even have stats, they'll just have a couple notes on them, so what would you even roll it with?

    So you'll fudge further, be honest. You'll just go "Ugh, if it's dramatically important for the NPC to see the truth, they will" and thus this Mist Check has utterly stopped being mechanically relevant.

    It's a clumsy mechanic for the sake of having a mechanic, and a mechanic for its own sake that doesn't really make the game better is a bad mechanic. That was something that I had to learn from my D&D days. Not everything needs a mechanic or a roll.

    Also also, there's a sidebar in Origin noting on how to run players running into an Incarnation of a God. Y'know what it recommends? Not telling your players who they're interacting with. Gods in the canon World don't need Mists to hide themselves. They just spin up an Incarnation and walk unseen, to avoid excessive Fatebindings by showing their full glory (without stepping on the list of Questions that 'They let Humans forget that they exist' brings up).

    The sidebar also mentions that maybe, just maybe, players will start to suspect they're interacting with a God. In THAT case... Still don't say anything until they try to make a Culture or Occult check to try and recognize some of the Omens of the God in question. Ideally, they won't suspect they were talking to Odin in disguise until he's already left.

    I did not read Antagonists section in Origin, yet. Will need to return to this after understanding Antagonists rules.
    I find that it helps me engage in the mechanics of a game to have a decent grasp of the intent of the mechanics first. You don't have to MEMORIZE them (because lord knows I don't have the whole rulebooks memorized) but at least give them a couple looks.
    Last edited by Kyman201; 05-05-2019, 02:08 AM.

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  • wyrdhamster
    replied
    You stayed? Great. Now we will talk on the topic in good faith. I split answers too Kyman questions in two posts as they are rather long.

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    [*]What's the Difficulty?
    Good for pointing it out – I think that Difficulty based on Legend Tier of target would be okay. So:
    • Legend 1-4 is Difficulty 1
    • Legend 5-8 is Difficulty 2
    • Legend 9-12 is Difficulty 3
    I think about moving Difficulty on one higher on each Tier, but need to playtest it.

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    [*]From the way you have it written, it LOOKS like the Legend of the observed target actually subtracts from the observing mortal's dice pool. Was this intended?
    Yes. More Legend has target, harder is to be seen in true form by the Mists.

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    [*]Would one be able to possibly use Occult as a skill to look through the Mists, as they know how the Supernatural works?
    Interesting point here – yes, I think that you can use Integrity or Occult Skill for the roll, whatever you have higher. Will mark this in rules revision.

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    [*]If the players go to Hero tier, the Mists will hide THEM.
    Once you know someone is Being on Legend – you simply know this. You do not forget that you band-mate is Hero like you – or that this particular con man is Odin in hiding. Yes, Mists will hide players – but it simply works for their own advantage. 😎

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    Does every NPC make a roll with their Desperation Pool to see their true nature?
    I did not read Antagonists section in Origin, yet. Will need to return to this after understanding Antagonists rules. ( Probably few days from now. )

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    By their construction, Quick Characters and Antagonists don't have specific Skills.
    Will look for alternatives for them only.

    Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
    [*]Tangential: How does the Occult skill work in a setting where people think the divine is fake?
    The same way Occult Skill works in Chronicles of Darkness – Occult becomes ‘symbols and myths’ Skill. Most people may still think it’s hogwash, but it works as for fringe groups, like neo-pagan, mystics, mediums, anthropologists or even psychanalysts. See this topic in CoD subforum on day-to-day usage of Occult Skill and professions connected to it.
    Last edited by wyrdhamster; 08-30-2021, 05:14 AM.

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  • Purple Snit
    replied
    Fair enough - I missed the disclaimer. I'll take my comments away - no harm intended.

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  • wyrdhamster
    replied
    So, before I start discussion - Kyman201, Purple Snit - look over main disclaimer of the topic.

    Originally posted by wyrdhamster View Post
    NOTE: This topic is for those agreeing that Gods in Scion should be hidden to the most of the World - i.e. hack to basic setting of Scion 2E gameline - or at least buying into concept for this topic discussion. If you not agreeing with that premise - i.e. you support original setting - be so nice and do not spam in this topic, go somewhere else on the forum. We all talk here about alternate world to original line.
    If you are not agreeing to talk in good spirit about this hack idea - just leave this topic. You will do yourself and others favor. No need for raising bad blood and posting when you run counter to the topic goal.
    Last edited by wyrdhamster; 05-05-2019, 12:54 AM.

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  • Purple Snit
    replied
    I just don't understand why you would pick up a game that is all about modern-day gods and myths, and then go out of your way to change or hide those very things. Maybe another game system would work better for you. Because if you have to write new rules or bend the game to get what you want, maybe the game isn't what you want.

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  • Kyman201
    replied
    Leaving aside how I feel this is a mechanic that doesn't enrich the game or the setting at all (and lord do I think it's dumb) I have a few questions.

    Mortal beings can sometimes pierce the Mists, if they are really driven. By spending 1 Momentum and rolling Integrity + Resolve – Legend of observed.
    Mainly here.
    1. What's the Difficulty?
    2. From the way you have it written, it LOOKS like the Legend of the observed target actually subtracts from the observing mortal's dice pool. Was this intended?
    3. Would one be able to possibly use Occult as a skill to look through the Mists, as they know how the Supernatural works?
      1. Tangential: How does the Occult skill work in a setting where people think the divine is fake?
    4. If the players go to Hero tier, the Mists will hide THEM. Does every NPC make a roll with their Desperation Pool to see their true nature? By their construction, Quick Characters and Antagonists don't have specific Skills.
    Honestly, I have other questions. What kind of enrichment comes from making this a clunky mechanic? How does this Mechanic make the game better?

    What happens if, in an Origin game, you're hoping that your players follow up on the Mist gaping but the PCs don't make the throw to see through them? Through the target parting the Mist in order to keep the plot on track?

    If the Mist will possibly fail when the story needs it even if the mechanics may get in the way, what's the point of making it a mechanic? Mechanics should serve the story, not potentially disrupt it. See the Tracking ability in D&D. If you fail to find the trail, then the plot is stuck in the mud. Failure isn't interesting in this case, so I'd hesitate to require a roll.

    And, when the Players go to Hero Tier, how do Mortal NPCs try to activate a 'See Through The Mist' check? Mortal NPCs don't have Momentum, they have Tension, but Tension is rare enough to accumulate that I wouldn't want to burn it each time someone tried to identify the true nature of the Heroes?

    In fact, why do they have to spend a finite resource to make a check that could fail? If they fail to pierce the Mists, will they get Momentum for a failure? If the option is "Make the check or get the Momentum back" then why not just make it so they can spend Momentum to Glimpse Something's True Nature?

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  • wyrdhamster
    replied
    EDIT: Fixed Mythic Mists rules are here.

    First draft of my Mists mechanics that works sorta like Changelings Mask for mythical beings. It’s to be used in Iron and Heroic Myth Levels of play in Scion 2E games.

    Mythic Mists

    The World is hiding it’s mythical truth before mere mortals. They are covered by the normality, mundane, trying to trap everything extraordinaire so the people would forget – Mythical Mists. They makes something impossible look totally rational and mundane – until higher power is directly unveiling it before particular eyes. Mist is overlaying anything that is related to Legend – Gods, Heroes, Denizens, creatures, objects or magic. You name it. Until you are invited by particular being to see it’s true self – you just see mundane façade of it.

    Mechanics ( for Iron and Heroic Myth Levels )

    Mythical beings and phenomena are perceived by almost everyone as mundane – unless will is put to drop the Mists. Each mythical being – Gods, Denizens, even Heroes - can will the Mists so they would part – and show beings true self to mortals. Mythical phenomena are generally hidden and it’s all on the witness resolve and cunning to part them.

    Mythical beings wanting to part the Mists before his witnesses need to spend 1 Momentum to show their true form to any mortal witness. Those creatures can sense in this disguise each other by spending 1 Momentum and rolling contested their Legend dots pools rolls. Denizens are treated as having at least Legend 1 for this only purpose, even when they normally not having this trait. If defender wins, observer still sense his target as mundane.

    Mortal beings can sometimes pierce the Mists, if they are really driven. By spending 1 Momentum and rolling Integrity + Resolve – Legend of observed. Denizens are still treated here as having at least Legend 1 for this only purpose, even when they normally not having this trait. If mortal’s roll is successful, he gets a glimpsed of beings true form, not longer than few seconds. ( One turn )

    Note: So what do you think about those rules? Any comments or advice?
    Last edited by wyrdhamster; 05-31-2020, 03:50 AM.

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  • Mateus Luz
    replied
    I have been thinking about it... when I GMd Urban Arcana I went a lot about the implication of the heroes learning that they didn’t see the world as it was. In my games the character could recognise the denizens they knew as “humans”, and they could remember the world as it has even been. Like if the magic retcon the memories. That made the adaptation of the heroes go much better...
    It was more like “now it make sense”, and less WTF...

    I played a lot of CtD, and I loved the way the glamour works, but it’s the opposite of the way I understand the Mask from CtL. Mask hides the true fae form, while glamour is a layer of faerie magic above the mundane world. I never went thru the character learning about glamour and never give a second thought about this subject in the CtD games...

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  • wyrdhamster
    replied
    Originally posted by Mateus Luz View Post
    Those are the 4 options I see, and I dont see any reason to chose one as standard to Scion 2e. Actually I would list the options the same way as the Mythic level...
    You probably are right here - but I need some option for my own games, to stick with them.

    What would be implications of each option for Origin level characters?

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