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  • What happens when world views crash?

    So in the world of Scion all myths are true right? How does this affect gameplay itself at moments of the story when myths must cross paths?

    One example:
    Three characters must go to Antarctica.
    Character A comes from a religion that says that Antarctica really is a wall of ice and beyond it is another dimension where horrible monsters lurk.
    Character B belongs to a religion that says the earth is really flat and Antarctica is just a wall of ice and beyond it lies space itself.
    Character C believes in the science religion that says Antarctica is just an icy continent in the very south of the world and crossing the South Pole doesn't really lead to anything special.

    So what happens when these characters cross the South Pole?

    Bear in mind that I do not wish to critique the game, I'm just genuinely curious how this is supposed to work.

  • #2
    Originally posted by Aristarkos View Post
    So in the world of Scion all myths are true right? How does this affect gameplay itself at moments of the story when myths must cross paths?

    One example:
    Three characters must go to Antarctica.
    Character A comes from a religion that says that Antarctica really is a wall of ice and beyond it is another dimension where horrible monsters lurk.
    Character B belongs to a religion that says the earth is really flat and Antarctica is just a wall of ice and beyond it lies space itself.
    Character C believes in the science religion that says Antarctica is just an icy continent in the very south of the world and crossing the South Pole doesn't really lead to anything special.

    So what happens when these characters cross the South Pole?

    Bear in mind that I do not wish to critique the game, I'm just genuinely curious how this is supposed to work.
    Whichever one serves the plot.

    All things being equal, the scientific reality is the most likely neutral outcome, but Fate means all things are not going to be equal and they’ll encounter whatever Fate (the plot) indicates.
    Last edited by glamourweaver; 05-18-2019, 01:38 AM.


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    • #3
      In general assume Mundane, not Fatebound, mortals are going to find the earthly reality we know regardless of their personal beliefs. Scions and the Fatebound favor whatever cosmology they’re connected to, while with cross pantheon groups Fate/plot rules.


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      • #4
        Originally posted by glamourweaver View Post
        In general assume Mundane, not Fatebound, mortals are going to find the earthly reality we know regardless of their personal beliefs. Scions and the Fatebound favor whatever cosmology they’re connected to, while with cross pantheon groups Fate/plot rules.
        Mm... Based on the examples in the books, what mortals will find when they go looking depends, but it doesn't depend on their beliefs - see Camelot.


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        • #5
          Originally posted by Aristarkos View Post
          Character C believes in the science religion that says Antarctica is just an icy continent in the very south of the world and crossing the South Pole doesn't really lead to anything special.
          ... Science religion. I really don't like when people try to claim "Oh Science is just another religion".

          REGARDLESS!

          Picture, if you will, A, B, and C travel to Antarctica. And... It looks like a flat plane of ice. A and B are a bit disappointed.

          But when they set up camp near the South Pole, the sky has gotten dark...

          In the night, we have B out... And for a moment, they look up at the sky. And they see Empty Space. Here, at the end of the world, as a biting winter wind blows over them. And they understand.

          A, meanwhile, goes out later... And upon looking up at the sky, they see an incoming storm. One that roars, bringing with it a frozen wall of ice, rushing towards them. One that sends them running, running to escape the monster storm that's coming in. And they understand.

          I'm assuming you're talking about a bunch of mortals, thus Origin Tier. If they were Heroes, they may find a more literal ice wall and see more massive prowling monsters behind.


          Disclaimer: I'll huff, grump, and defend my position, but if you're having fun I'll never say you're doing it wrong.

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          • #6
            Alternatively each of them might be simultaneously true as terra incognita.


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            • #7
              Also... all myths being true doesn't mean all myths are equally powerful, and that everything you can imagine is true. A myth is more than just something some people believe.

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              • #8
                And this is why I think about simple house rule that each creature with Legend can force it's Panthon's Myths on reality by rolling their Legend. ( Probably costing Momentum) Other Panthons can counter it by their Legend roll.


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                • #9
                  Heavy Arms is right that just imaging something isn't enough for it to work as actual mythical beliefs from human culture. All myths may be true, but conspiracy theories and such aren't myths.

                  Originally posted by wyrdhamster View Post
                  And this is why I think about simple house rule that each creature with Legend can force it's Panthon's Myths on reality by rolling their Legend. ( Probably costing Momentum) Other Panthons can counter it by their Legend roll.
                  But that would make the myths just fake ideas imposed on the world. Which completely goes against all myths being true.


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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by marin View Post

                    Mm... Based on the examples in the books, what mortals will find when they go looking depends, but it doesn't depend on their beliefs - see Camelot.
                    I should have clarified that - mortals can stumble upon mythic truths too, even without being Fatebound. But encountering the scientific reality we’re familiar with is more common - hence the mythic being numinous and “other”.


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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by milo v3 View Post
                      But that would make the myths just fake ideas imposed on the world. Which completely goes against all myths being true.
                      Loathe as I am to say Wyrdhamster has anything approaching a decent idea, but Mythic Bleed where certain figures drag in their Reality with their mere presence isn't a terrible one. When you have two Mythic Figures trying to determine whose cosmology is applying in this case... Well, I personally would factor in the following.
                      • Location. Cultural beliefs have some weight to them, and Fate can favor certain stories more depending on location. This also opens the door for various beings trying to go to new lands to escape the trappings of their Fate. Example, a Yuki-Onna moving from Japan to, say, Norway, in order to try and have an actually happy-ish life without freezing someone she loves.
                      • The ones dragging the Mythic up. A stronger Fateful Aura will probably have more mythic weight behind it, so a Teotl Scion could find themselves playing by the rules of the Deva if Kali herself manifests in front of them.
                      • In the case of relatively neutral territory and equal tiers, then a roll-off could come up. An example I've seen Watcher come up with: Let's say you have a Netjer Scion trying to pry the True Name (ren) out of a Tuatha Scion, when the Tuatha may have picked up dozens of names from their Pantheon. This could trigger something akin to the Clash of Wills rule in the books. If the Netjer wins, they manage to assert their Heku mastery over the Tuatha and gets the Enhancement due to knowing their Ren. If the Tuatha wins, they get to grin cockily and say "You have a name, but I have so many of those. Now piss off."
                      Last edited by Kyman201; 05-18-2019, 05:26 PM.


                      Disclaimer: I'll huff, grump, and defend my position, but if you're having fun I'll never say you're doing it wrong.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Kyman201 View Post
                        Loathe as I am to say Wyrdhamster has anything approaching a decent idea, but Mythic Bleed where certain figures drag in their Reality with their mere presence isn't a terrible one. When you have two Mythic Figures trying to determine whose cosmology is applying in this case... Well, I personally would factor in the following.
                        • Location. Cultural beliefs have some weight to them, and Fate can favor certain stories more depending on location. This also opens the door for various beings trying to go to new lands to escape the trappings of their Fate. Example, a Yuki-Onna moving from Japan to, say, Norway, in order to try and have an actually happy-ish life without freezing someone she loves.
                        • The ones dragging the Mythic up. A stronger Fateful Aura will probably have more mythic weight behind it, so a Teotl Scion could find themselves playing by the rules of the Deva if Kali herself manifests in front of them.
                        • In the case of relatively neutral territory and equal tiers, then a roll-off could come up. An example I've seen Watcher come up with: Let's say you have a Netjer Scion trying to pry the True Name (ren) out of a Tuatha Scion, when the Tuatha may have picked up dozens of names from their Pantheon. This could trigger something akin to the Clash of Wills rule in the books. If the Netjer wins, they manage to assert their Heku mastery over the Tuatha and gets the Enhancement due to knowing their Ren. If the Tuatha wins, they get to grin cockily and say "You have a name, but I have so many of those. Now piss off."
                        That is very very different from what Wyrdhamster was describing. What your describing seems to be purely a tool for decide which pantheon you're giving priority to at the time based on the circumstances which eventually if you can't figureout a great answer to compare legend rolls as a tie breaker, while Wyrdhamster was describing a character initiated power of imposing your myths on existence that can be resisted by other characters.


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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by milo v3 View Post
                          That is very very different from what Wyrdhamster was describing. What your describing seems to be purely a tool for decide which pantheon you're giving priority to at the time based on the circumstances which eventually if you can't figureout a great answer to compare legend rolls as a tie breaker, while Wyrdhamster was describing a character initiated power of imposing your myths on existence that can be resisted by other characters.
                          Well yeah, I never said Wyrdhamster had an ENTIRELY good idea. :P


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                          • #14
                            Don't do that please.Apologizing to Wyrdhamster probably wouldn't be a bad idea either.


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                            • #15
                              [QUOTE=Kyman201;n1312903]
                              ... Science religion. I really don't like when people try to claim "Oh Science is just another religion".

                              In our mundane reality I agree with you. But in the World of Scion I have a hard time believing science would be more than just another world view that is always secondary to whatever myths are currently active in the area.

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