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[Dragon] Making Wyrm antagonists

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  • [Dragon] Making Wyrm antagonists

    So I want the Dragon enemy to put against my Origin-to-Hero players. ( I think defeting this Dragon will be their last step to become Heroes. ) I just cannot guess what rules to use for it - Origin Antagonists, Hero Antagonists, Dragon particular PCs rules? Make him as Heir or Lesser Wyrm? What would be your advise on this antagonists power level for 5-6 PCs of late Origin tier?

    Idea for my particular Wyrm is Joka or Lindwurm that collect art pieces in Louvre as his/her personal Treasure, under his/her guard.
    Last edited by wyrdhamster; 02-23-2021, 04:47 PM.


    My stuff for Realms of Pugmire, Scion 2E, CoD Contagion, Dark Eras, VtR 2E, WtF 2E, MtAw 2E, MtC 2E & BtP
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  • #2
    This is what happens when players use different rules from everyone else in a game.

    That said, it's Origin so you want to balanced for Origin level. Use Origin antagonists and borrow from other sources as needed to get what you want.

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    • #3
      My suggestion is to make them as a Origin Antagonist and pick some qualities related to dragons, inspired in the Repitilian Destroyers from Dragon (page 33 from the big manuscript).

      Edit: making them as a Hero antagonist will give more qualities (as far as I recall) for the same dice pool. It may be useful if you want more magical power and less brutish might.


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      • #4
        I'd go with something like a Rival from the Hero book, maybe a Nemesis if your Origin characters are fairly tough. A basilisk from the example antagonists in the Hero book might work well.

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        • #5
          I wanted this antagonist to be more 'shadow enemy behind whole Louvre' and center piece of the story - but maybe not so direct powerful as typical Monster from Origin, in the end. So maybe base him on Nemesis from Hero?

          Originally posted by Mateus Luz View Post
          (page 33 from the big manuscript).
          Forgotten there is one big compiled manuscript now - downloading both of Dragon and Masks of Mythos of mine books.
          Last edited by wyrdhamster; 02-24-2021, 01:33 PM.


          My stuff for Realms of Pugmire, Scion 2E, CoD Contagion, Dark Eras, VtR 2E, WtF 2E, MtAw 2E, MtC 2E & BtP
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          • #6
            Here is my first take on Dragon antagonists. Mateus Luz, especially your opinion I'm interested.

            Ladon, Garden of the Hesperides Dragon





            This ‘Ladon’ is the greater Heir of the legendary dragon from Garden of the Hesperides, that guarded Golden Apples of Hera in there. This Heir is now curator of one of major art museums, where he guards most of it’s collection – especially Theoi Relics he is very fond off.

            d – Material from Scion: Dragon
            o – Material from Origin book
            h – Material from Hero book
            * – See below
            Archetype: Nemesis ( Dragon Heir )
            Flight: Lindwurms ( Eastern, Greek branch )
            Quality: Mystic Arsenal h ( Relics collection ), Mother’s Child d, The Old Destroyer d, Render d, Heavily Armored o ( Hard 2, Soft 1 ), Cross-Training o ( Many Heads, many actions )
            Flairs: ?
            Drive: To protect his ‘Hoard’ ( i.e. museum collection )
            Weakness: Hesperides Guardian – When seeing any apple or apple-shaped objects, Ladon stops for one turn – and if not seeing part of his Hoard stolen – will defend 'apples'.
            Primary Pool (11): Athletics, Close Combat, Arts & Relics
            Secondary Pool (9): Dragon Magic, Dragon Intrigues, Firearms
            Desperation Pool: 6
            Speed: 15
            Health: 5 ( 7 with Hard Armor )
            Defense: 4 ( 5 with Soft Armor )
            Initiative: 9
            Attacks:
            Claws - Enhancement 2, Natural, Range: Close, Lethal, Messy, Piercing
            Jaws - Enhancement 2, Natural, Piercing, Grapple, Range: Close, Lethal, Messy, Piercing
            Desert Eagle - Enhancement 2, Natural, Range: Medium, Lethal
            Last edited by wyrdhamster; 04-24-2021, 05:26 AM.


            My stuff for Realms of Pugmire, Scion 2E, CoD Contagion, Dark Eras, VtR 2E, WtF 2E, MtAw 2E, MtC 2E & BtP
            LGBT+ through Ages
            LGBT+ in CoD games

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            • #7
              Beautiful! Great big boss to fight to get a golden apple! Could be an adversary to low legend Heroes too.

              Now, my opinion that may diverge is: Ladon was a challenge to Hercules in his demigod period, what means he should be more powerful. But it looks great as a reincarnating Ladon.


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              • #8
                Looks like this is a heir of Ladon that took the dragon's name.

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                • #9
                  Other Dragon related Antagonist idea - What could be Dragon related 'titanspawn', so to speak? Like Dinosaurs can work as 'titanspawn' category? Some 'wyrms' beings? Other ideas could you point for Dragon-related beings, but also not 'full power' as proper Dragons.


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                  • #10
                    How to stat proper Dragon-dragon-like serpentine monster for Scions to fight with? I want to stat Ryūjin, the Dragon King Incarnation for PCs to fight with. Should it be stated as Wyrm from Dragon, Titanspawn from Hero book - or other Archetype? Mateus Luz, what do you think mechanically?






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                    • #11
                      Well... most of the famous dragons were killed by or defeated Gods and Demigods, so real Wyrms, the big ones, are just too big to deal with on heroic level, at least in direct combat.

                      If you want to interact with it, maybe you should use the Goliath rules from Demigod (Demigod big manuscript page 257), much like I would do to face a god. Make it scale 6+ and define how much the dragon is trying to kill you actively (in opposition to kill you by mistake when step in a building or something with you inside).

                      This system keep the fight to last longer, even several sessions, while the characters have a chance to die, it’s not instakill. It definitely worth the reading!
                      Last edited by Mateus Luz; 05-19-2021, 10:29 AM.


                      House Rules - The Basics - House Rules for Trinity Continuum
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                      • #12
                        I'm preparing the Greater Wyrm as my mid-chronicle bigger boss, that probably will survive players and will then run away. It's 'reincarnation' of Jörmungandr - and is probably to survive 3-5 Hero PCs and run away after it, to span intrugie more in chronicle. Here are stats I prepared for it. Comments are welcome - especially from Mateus Luz - it's my first NPC made with Heirs rules from Scion Dragon book.

                        Jörmungandr Greater Wyrm ( Reincarnation )





                        Sophie is more resolute incarnation of Jörmungandr, concerned more with ruling and destruction of enemies – than collecting and traveling. She was raised in small town or suburbia – and risen in ranks of local government administration. She is own Mayor’s Assistant, true power behind the throne of local community.

                        Draconic Form




                        Name: Sophie Jensen
                        Flight: Lindwurm (Jörmungandr)
                        Inheritance: 10 ( Greater Wyrm* ) *Greater Wyrm is fan name on Inheritance 10 Heirs, that are physical ‘incarnations’ of their Patron Dragon.
                        Callings: Destroyer 4, Ruler 3, Collector 3, Nomad 1
                        Memory: Icy cold waters and crushing depths; sun warmed beaches with sea birds circling
                        overhead; the sight of the world from above, as one circles it; a low burning hatred fueled by
                        embarrassment and apathy.
                        Dragon Magic: Elemental Manipulation (Frost, Water), Flight, Understanding, Weather Control, Lindwurm
                        Paths:
                        Origin: Always Watched ( Academics, Integrity, Subterfuge ) – 3rd
                        Role: Mayor’s Assistant ( Empathy, Leadership, Persuasion ) – 1st
                        Flight: Lindwurms (Close Combat, Survival, Persuasion ) – 2nd
                        Skills: Academics 3, Athletics (Swimming) 3, Close Combat 3, Culture 1, Empathy 3, Integrity (Hiding Intentions) 3, Leadership 3, Occult 2, Persuasion 5, Subterfuge (Lies) 3, Survival 2, Technology ( Office works ) 1
                        Attributes: (Finesse Approach) Intellect 3, Cunning 4, Resolve 5, Might 3, Dexterity 5, Stamina 5, Presence 4, Manipulation 5, Composure 3
                        Calling Knacks: Infinite Pockets, Armor-Shearing Jaws, Enhanced Impact, Terrible Dragon Roar + Render of Cities, Invulnerable Master, Invoke Anger, Loyal Servant, Perfect Poise + Fearless Presence, Friends Anywhere – 11 in Sum
                        Dragon Knacks: Scent the Divine – 11 in Sum + Scent the Divine
                        Knacks of Scale - Unstoppable Force, On My Command ( calling a whole city to aid ), Insatiable Collector
                        Transformation Knacks - Bottomless Lungs, Brutal Might, Devastating Dragon’s Presence, Dragon’s Breath, Eel’s Trickery, Great Slithering Bulk, Rending Claws, Dragon’s Scales
                        Dragon Spells - 11 in Sum
                        Elemental Manipulation (Frost) - Cool Down, Flash Freeze, Rime
                        Elemental Manipulation (Water) - Flash Flood
                        Understanding - Foresight, Piercing Gaze
                        Weather Control - Alter Weather, Lethal Weather, Localized Weather, Resist Weather
                        Lindwurms - Avarice - Irresistible Craving


                        My stuff for Realms of Pugmire, Scion 2E, CoD Contagion, Dark Eras, VtR 2E, WtF 2E, MtAw 2E, MtC 2E & BtP
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                        • #13
                          I liked a lot the idea, She seams very powerful and amazing, a worth final enemy for a band of Demigods, and her size scale must be 6+ at least in her dragon form.

                          She must be a worth enemy to Thor, and I think she killed him with her poison, I am not sure how she uses it, so I guess the Dragon Breath could fit it nicely. Now, to really know if it fits as an enemy for a god, we need God, so...

                          I honestly would make her a Goliath (as I would do for any god level adversary), but it’s my personal opinion.


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                          Tomes of Inspiration - Rituals and Dark Magic in Fists of Flux

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                          • #14
                            Hmm, Demigods you say... Not something for Heroes of Legend 1 that need to run from it, seeing how powerful she is? I need PCs be forced to seek help in defeating her with Gods of Pantheons - but that she would not instant kill them... 🤔
                            Last edited by wyrdhamster; 06-14-2021, 09:33 AM.


                            My stuff for Realms of Pugmire, Scion 2E, CoD Contagion, Dark Eras, VtR 2E, WtF 2E, MtAw 2E, MtC 2E & BtP
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                            LGBT+ in CoD games

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                            • #15
                              She can kill them almost instantly if in Dragon form. Dragon form gain scale, in that case a lot is scale....


                              House Rules - The Basics - House Rules for Trinity Continuum
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                              Tomes of Inspiration - Rituals and Dark Magic in Fists of Flux

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