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  • I would say that "on a whim" is unlikely. Investing someone with the power of a Hero is enough effort and work that it's not done quite so lightly, even by whimsical gods.

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    • Fair enough; I was exaggerating for effect.


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      • Originally posted by MorsRattus View Post
        I would say that "on a whim" is unlikely. Investing someone with the power of a Hero is enough effort and work that it's not done quite so lightly, even by whimsical gods.
        Yeah. The actual only qualification for Choosing a Scion is that they're mythologically resonant in some manner, by nature or by deed. "This is someone who walks on my path." It can be on a whim, it just can't be to anyone on a whim.


        Neall Raemonn Price
        Beleaguered Scion Developer

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        • Hey Neal, are we going to see the text for the companion when it’s ready or will we have to wait for the complete book art and all? One of my players is of Persian descent and really wants to play a scion of the Yazata!

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          • Do you know who wrote the “iGjallar” bit in the Relics section of Scion: Hero? Would you give them a big thumbs-up from me for making me grin for like five minutes straight?

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            • Originally posted by TheCountAlucard View Post
              Do you know who wrote the “iGjallar” bit in the Relics section of Scion: Hero? Would you give them a big thumbs-up from me for making me grin for like five minutes straight?
              Also thank whoever wrote it up for 1e's Companion, since that's where it originally appeared.


              Scion 2E: What We Know - A wiki compiling info on second edition Scion.

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              • Originally posted by Neall View Post

                Yeah. The actual only qualification for Choosing a Scion is that they're mythologically resonant in some manner, by nature or by deed. "This is someone who walks on my path." It can be on a whim, it just can't be to anyone on a whim.
                Thanks Neall! This really helps, along with everyone else's ideas too! Clarity helps! Wooooo!

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                • How do Guide's Unique Knacks work?
                  • Do you need to purchase the Knack (e.g., with XP)
                  • Do you need to slot the Knack in a Calling? Do they count as "Any" knacks for this purpose?
                  Similarly, for Guide Callings:
                  • It seems clear that you must purchase the knacks (e.g., with XP)
                  • Can they be slotted into any Calling?
                  Last edited by zilaenor; 06-02-2019, 07:21 PM.

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                  • Originally posted by zilaenor View Post
                    How do Guide's Unique Knacks work?
                    • Do you need to purchase the Knack (e.g., with XP)
                    • Do you need to slot the Knack in a Calling? Do they count as "Any" knacks for this purpose?
                    Similarly, for Guide Callings:
                    • It seems clear that you must purchase the knacks (e.g., with XP)
                    • Can they be slotted into any Calling?
                    I had the same question on my first reading, and I may be wrong about it, but as I see, the knacks given by birthrights are additional to the regular calling knacks.

                    The knacks in the example character sheets are on the knacks space, but not the knacks given by the birthrights, and they seem to be counted apart.

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                    • Originally posted by zilaenor View Post
                      How do Guide's Unique Knacks work?
                      • Do you need to purchase the Knack (e.g., with XP)
                      • Do you need to slot the Knack in a Calling? Do they count as "Any" knacks for this purpose?
                      Similarly, for Guide Callings:
                      • It seems clear that you must purchase the knacks (e.g., with XP)
                      • Can they be slotted into any Calling?
                      From my understanding...

                      If a Guide is giving a unique Knack, that Knack doesn't need to be slotted. If a Guide is giving access to a Calling, you can buy Knacks from that Calling, but you have to put them in slots given by another Calling.


                      Disclaimer: I'll huff, grump, and defend my position, but if you're having fun I'll never say you're doing it wrong.

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                      • Greetings!
                        After reading through booth books I have to say, that I love the final product. For me it’s a huge step up from the first edition and I can’t wait for the new books.
                        That said I still had some questions after reading, no rule questions but more general design questions. Maybe they have been answered before, but I couldn’t find them with the help of the search function, so I hope to get my answers here:


                        1. Why is a bare fist the “best” melee weapon? No other melee weapons have an advantage over the fist, but they often have negative tags. Did I understand it correct, that the pricing tag has no value against SGC´s?

                        2. Scaling: Why is there no general scaling for beings (like normal humans have always scaling 0)? For example a Troll with scaling 1 in melee combat, a Siren in social situations or a demigod / god in most situations.

                        3. Knacks and purviews : Why are all knacks listed again in book II? Will this continue in the next books and also extended to purviews? Why are there only 3 epic attributes? Will the rest follow and will fitting gods get them as associations?


                        Thank you for your answers, and keep up the good work!

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                        • Originally posted by Talriss View Post
                          1. Why is a bare fist the “best” melee weapon? No other melee weapons have an advantage over the fist, but they often have negative tags. Did I understand it correct, that the pricing tag has no value against SGC´s?
                          Most weapons get advantages in the forms of Tags, such as Reach for spears or Versatile for non-combat Stuntwork. Most fists don't get the Reach tag, or Tripping, without Knacks. As for why there's no more intense breakdown of Numerical Stats for the weapons... Frankly, fuck those. They make more sense for a Gear-focused game like Shadowrun or D&D, but in Scion, someone with their good old honest powers of FIST should be just as viable as the lady with twin pistols, save the obvious advantage of the pistols having better range. Scion works on Movie and Narrative Logic.

                          2. Scaling: Why is there no general scaling for beings (like normal humans have always scaling 0)? For example a Troll with scaling 1 in melee combat, a Siren in social situations or a demigod / god in most situations.
                          Because sometimes the lines are a bit less clear. Prior drafts actually had more details breaking down Scale for Size, Speed, and Influence, but for some reason that was pruned slightly. Probably for wordcount?

                          3. Knacks and purviews : Why are all knacks listed again in book II? Will this continue in the next books and also extended to purviews?
                          Probably because Heroes AND Origin characters can use Knacks, so putting the Heroic Knacks in Origin made sense. I doubt in this instance we'll get all the previously-stated Knacks reprinted in Demigod and God.

                          Why are there only 3 epic attributes? Will the rest follow and will fitting gods get them as associations?
                          The non-physical Epic Attributes of 1e were boring in their implementation, and a lot of them didn't quite fit as their own specific Purview. A LOT of their tricks got folded into Callings and Purviews. For instance, Epic Manipulation can be nicely folded into Deception and Trickster. Epic Perception has a lot of its tricks in Hunter. And Epic Charisma's previous tricks fit nicely into Lover and Leader, while Epic Appearance has the Beauty Purview.


                          Disclaimer: I'll huff, grump, and defend my position, but if you're having fun I'll never say you're doing it wrong.

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                          • Originally posted by Talriss View Post
                            2. Scaling: Why is there no general scaling for beings (like normal humans have always scaling 0)? For example a Troll with scaling 1 in melee combat, a Siren in social situations or a demigod / god in most situations.
                            Check the Antagonist rules; they have some rough guidelines for adjudicating Scale. Some more will be freely available in the FAQ.

                            3. Knacks and purviews : Why are all knacks listed again in book II? Will this continue in the next books and also extended to purviews? Why are there only 3 epic attributes? Will the rest follow and will fitting gods get them as associations?
                            As Kyman said, most of the Attributes were folded into the Callings. The Scion Companion will have a 1e conversion guide, and will contain versions of (some) of the other Epic Attributes.


                            Neall Raemonn Price
                            Beleaguered Scion Developer

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                            • About Scale:

                              I don’t think the cut of the scale value of some creatures or objects was from word count, I thing it was proposital. By comparing the way scale is dealt in Scion and TC, I would say they give the creatures a flexible scale because that’s the way they work in the myths, a Gigante is so big it touches the sky and the ground at same time, how big is it? The Manticore were huge, or the size of a bear, or the size of a lion.
                              In TC the things are “science” we have the size and speed scale of every item, every vehicle and every weapon, even the size the armor gets when folded. That’s the way SciFi deal with science, using numbers to give a sense of real and avoid explaining.

                              Because of it, the TC is more fixed on numbers, while Scion is more guessing...

                              I made a comment on the Scale Post, maybe I had a better writing last time, but the idea is the same...

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                              • Originally posted by Mateus Luz View Post

                                I made a comment on the Scale Post, maybe I had a better writing last time, but the idea is the same...
                                I hope so, because what you're saying makes the opposite of sense. But I'll humor some of your comments. And I'll be partially basing some of my answers on a table in the pre-layout rough draft, which is what I was citing as 'Being removed for reasons I don't understand'.

                                a Gigante is so big it touches the sky and the ground at same time, how big is it?
                                Skyscrapers are noted as Scale 5. Scale 6 is Mountains or other landscapes. Depending on how big your Gigante is, Scale 5.

                                The Manticore were huge, or the size of a bear, or the size of a lion.
                                A bear? Scale 1, if that. The same table has Elephant as Size 1, so a Manticore wouldn't even have any scale from Size.

                                In TC the things are “science” we have the size and speed scale of every item, every vehicle and every weapon, even the size the armor gets when folded. That’s the way SciFi deal with science, using numbers to give a sense of real and avoid explaining.

                                Because of it, the TC is more fixed on numbers, while Scion is more guessing..
                                This... I'm not sure what you're even trying to say. Are you trying to say 'Lol mythic who cares?' then no. The game has a mechanic, and it had a table that helped ballpark what the mechanics were, but was cut.

                                And if TC were fixed on numbers, it'd use D&D number crunching. Scale is an abstraction in both cases. The difference is that TC has a different scale than Scion's when it comes to the benchmarks. Scale is a mechanic used to go "The comparison between these two is obscene". Scion and TC have different scale markers because the two play around with different power levels.

                                TC, for instance, notes that Baseline Human is Scale 1, a gun is Scale 2, an Anti-Tank launcher is Scale 4.

                                For Scion, a Human is Scale 0. A regular gun is just Scale 0 as well, while an Anti-Tank Rifle is Scale 1. A main battle tank is Scale 3.

                                The major difference between how TC has used Scale and how Scion has is that Scion has to account for bigger things. In Trinity's lower base power level, Human is Scale 1, and having any kind of weapon at all will improve your Scale. In Scion, you gotta account for how mythic stuff will get involved.

                                See this is what happens when you try to assume TC and Scion have the same exact rules when all they have in common is that they use a similar base system. Next you'll be trying to claim that the Scale tier in They Came From Beneath The Sea is exactly the same as it is in TC and Scion because fuck, it's Scale, innit?

                                I guess my main thing that stuck in my craw about your comment was...

                                You seem to be saying "Scion is more loosey goosey with its Scale because it's Mythic and Mythic is less exact" and that's just wrong on many levels. Scion may be Mythic but that just means it shuffles the power tiers, and you still need some kind of simplified representation of huge differences in power. That's what Scale is. There WAS an example for Speed and Size in the rough draft that the final draft seems to lack, and I was bemoaning "So why was this thing that gave more Scale examples gone? Was it Wordcount?"

                                I don't think the answer is what you say it is. :/


                                Disclaimer: I'll huff, grump, and defend my position, but if you're having fun I'll never say you're doing it wrong.

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