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The Sandman (Neil Gaiman) In Wod?

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  • The Sandman (Neil Gaiman) In Wod?

    I been pondering a lot about changeling and its influence from Gaiman..and i cant stop thinking on how to work out The Sandman mythos in the WoD. any suggestions?


    Forum's Official's Joker and Trickster. Pardon my bad english, aint my first language (I Speak Spanish).
    ST: DtF, HtR, WtO, MtA
    Signature Chars: Crowley (hakalu), Joe The Nuwisha (WtA)
    Changelings: be afraid of the Technocracian High Five of Doom

  • #2
    Well, it is complicated. The Endless would be probably just be very powerful spirits within the High Umbra that represent their concepts (though cWoD specifically singled out Death as being too cute in its treatment of Death spirits in WtA if I remember correctly). They would likely be more active on the Earth than many other spirits of the High Umbra and would be capable of destroying practically any of the splats that they encountered. Death would probably be interested in Kindred, KJ, and Wraiths. Delirium would probably be responsible for the creation of Marauders (the punishment given to Mages who attempted to change the world too much with True Magick). Dream would probably be interested in Changelings. It would really be up to the ST about the other four (Despair, Destruction, Destiny, and Desire).

    The Endless should be practically invulnerable, though the events surrounding Dream suggest that their are specific taboos that they cannot cross and keep their invulnerability. Whether or not the Endless would be intertwined with the Judeo-Christian mythology as suggested by Gaiman would really be up to the ST, as they could function without the existence of God. It would be an interesting twist on the mythology of both the Kindred if Death was responsible for the creation of Kindred (in the guise of Caine) and was just doing a very long and very large experiment on Humanity.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Crowley View Post
      I been pondering a lot about changeling and its influence from Gaiman..and i cant stop thinking on how to work out The Sandman mythos in the WoD. any suggestions?

      I'm a huge fan of Sandman, but I'd generally steer away from having the whole WoD Dreaming embodied/rightfully-ruled by a single being like that. Also it's important in Sandman that while Faeries and other mythic beings have a metaphysical RELATIONSHIP with the Dreaming, their realms aren't synonymous. Gods and faeries return to the Dreaming at the end of their existence, but while they and their domains are healthy they are completely separate.

      And obviously you've got the whole Cain & Abel basket of worms if you try to introduce them & their Houses in relation to Vampire the Masquerade!

      The WoD Underworld seems like something that happens if Death of the Endless ISN'T doing her job.


      Check out my expansion to the Realm of Brass and Shadow

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      • #4
        I would guess that for the Endless to exist, the actual cosmology should have to be very distinct from everything every splat think it actually is.

        Then I would make the Realms of the Endless into some higher strata of the Umbra. Morpheus' realm isn't the Dream of the Changelings, but the source of most of the Umbra and the Dreaming. Most of the others probably work as self-contained, permeating the universe through means of their own. Death would command the true destiny of the souls, beyond what anyone else knows, and maybe even beyond Oblivion.

        A chronicle with the endless would be, among other things, a game about learning that you are, truly, ignorant of this world.


        Sorry if I seem too straightforward, or if I don't get you. Autism isn't a forgiving condition.

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        • #5
          I do not know. Considering the popularity of Sandman, you could have a group of Middle Umbra spirits spontaneously manifest as the Endless. I think they would probably be equal in power to Incarna, as they each tap into thousands of years of human emotion. They would not be properly the Endless, but who could really tell the difference?

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          • #6
            If those are spirits born only from the popularity of Sandman, as much as it hurt me to say that, they wouldn't be so powerful. They would not tap into thousands of years of human emotion, but just on a couple decades of character popularity, maybe enhanced by the strength of the emotions actually associated to their aspects since they were born.


            Sorry if I seem too straightforward, or if I don't get you. Autism isn't a forgiving condition.

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            • #7
              You have new Incarna all of the time. Easy Credit popped into existence in the 90s, so it would not be impossible for the Endless to evolve as Incarna, though it might be more appropriate to say that existing Incarna would adopted the identities and personalities of the Endless to maintain their relevance. So the Incarna of Consumptive Beauty would evolve into the Incarna of Death-As-Endless, the Incarna of Androgynous Desire would evolve into the Incarna of Desire-As-Endless, the Incarna of Loving Dreams would evolve into the Incarna of Dream-As-Endless, etc.

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              • #8
                Something like this would be more probable. My problem with the first idea is that those ancient emotions would already have their own Incarna, so the Endless would only be a new group based on characters from comic books. They could certainly acquire quite a prominence as this, but not take on the roles of older spirits. Easy Credit achieved status because Credit as an element of our lives achieved prominence that quickly.

                But the Endless could easily be adopted as aspects of more powerful spirits. And them, they would have few distinctions, certainly. But still have some. The Endless are tied to a cosmology that is very distinct from the WoD. As Incarnae, they would still be far from what they are in the original. Specially Dream, since his abode is the source of myth.


                Sorry if I seem too straightforward, or if I don't get you. Autism isn't a forgiving condition.

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                • #9
                  i been reading Nevewhere to get a better understanding of Changeling.. and i been Curious. What would Mr.Croup and Mr. Vandemar exactly be? im planning in using them as my game's main antagonists


                  Forum's Official's Joker and Trickster. Pardon my bad english, aint my first language (I Speak Spanish).
                  ST: DtF, HtR, WtO, MtA
                  Signature Chars: Crowley (hakalu), Joe The Nuwisha (WtA)
                  Changelings: be afraid of the Technocracian High Five of Doom

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