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Taking the human Ego down a notch

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  • Taking the human Ego down a notch

    Is anyone else a little bothered how human or earth-centric WOD stories seem to be?

    In vampire kindred stick to the shadows in fear of discovery(despite having the power to control literally the entire world via blood bonds, dominate, presence, and other powers), In werewolf the garou think the entire universe is going to end if the endangered animals die out, In changeling human dreams are the only things keeping the former dreaming gods alive(and human banality is the same thing killing them), and mage takes it to a comepletely new level by trying to say all reality is determined by human belief via consensus.

    I don't mean to say that humanity isn't important(on earth) and can't be a viable threat to any supernatural faction(we have nukes for a reason), but it feels a little bit like being at an independence day party with that friend who's a little TOO patriotic. It's a lot like the the mage concept of huberis, each faction thinking that they, their kind or the kind they once were are the center of the comos. I feel this should be taken down a notch to a degree.

    Like a werewolf meeting a high umbral or even beyond umbral spirit that seemed perfectly apathetic to gaia dying or the apocolypse, seeing it as but a small meaningless event. The mage finding reality exactly the same with tech nology working fine even in a reality zone that accepts magic and is adverse to science. Haveing characters face situations that confict or outrigth disprove parts of their worldview and self-importance.

    What is a good way to make a character feel small, insignificant, and questioning their own perceptions. Not just morally, but philosophically forcing them to acknowledge the world and whether or not their fight really matters.

  • #2
    I started a thread on this issue with a name some people didnt care for.

    http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/m...l-minds-wanted

    theirs a word for "Too patriotic" "Jingoistic"

    It often implies militarism, but anyone with an unhealthy degree of nationalism or patriotism, can be accused of jingoism.

    So, most nations in the world wars.

    As for my favored way to deal with it.

    Im giftwrapping some SAD Agents for my PC's in a WTA game Im running right now... Thought id let them "Stick it to the man"

    Speaking of SAD, the group "The Minutemen" From them, are wonderfully suited for a role as punching bags, if thats what your looking for, And are also Jingoistic.
    (Project Twilight, Page 30)

    some more ideas

    Impress on one of the r are few that has enough Willpower, to see a garou, rip someone apart, that they cant report anything they do to the police, FBI Etc.

    or rather they CAN but will be "Ignored" or labeled in need of psychiatric treatment.


    Can imagine how frustrating that will be

    "These wounds, are OBVIOUSLY, the result of some deranged serial killer wearing prosthetic...

    "Do you not understand, I SAW him shapeshift right in front of me!!!?

    "Oh I get it, in a stressful situation, we often imagine, absurd or impossible things"

    Finding anyone willing to give them a unprejudiced ear, should be tear i nducing event and come at the end of a lot condenscension, and ridicule.

    And finding that one of the people who is willing to hear you out, is a kinfolk, luring you someplace isolated to "Dispose of" you... is not that bad an idea.

    Last edited by Prince of the Night; 01-28-2017, 02:40 AM.


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    • #3
      Originally posted by Prometheas View Post
      Is anyone else a little bothered how human or earth-centric WOD stories seem to be?
      Not really. There are other games and other stories. I'd rather the WoD stay focused on its core premise than lose itself in exploring endless side tangents that have nothing to do with the premise of the games.

      In vampire kindred stick to the shadows in fear of discovery(despite having the power to control literally the entire world via blood bonds, dominate, presence, and other powers)
      It also doesn't help make your case when you make these sorts of sweeping generalizations that aren't true to the spirit (or rules) of the game.

      mage takes it to a comepletely new level by trying to say all reality is determined by human belief via consensus.
      Also not true. Considering Consensus stops at the Umbra, clearly other things are determining reality once you get past the physical realm.

      each faction thinking that they, their kind or the kind they once were are the center of the comos. I feel this should be taken down a notch to a degree.
      Besides all the factions that don't think that way, what's wrong with it in general? Esp. since most of them might think this, but are fairly explicitly wrong for doing so.

      Like a werewolf meeting a high umbral or even beyond umbral spirit that seemed perfectly apathetic to gaia dying or the apocolypse, seeing it as but a small meaningless event.
      OK. What does that do? What's interesting about this story? "You went through all this trouble to travel all this way, and contacted this entity, and it shrugged, didn't care, and wondered off." Sure it's got a specific narrative strength to it, but who would find that an enjoyable ending to a story they're playing the characters in? "So, we just played for a year, going through all this stuff, and the pay off is that it was a giant waste of time, when we could have been off doing something productive?" "Yeah, awesome, right?" "No, that's just lame. No more STing for you."

      The mage finding reality exactly the same with tech nology working fine even in a reality zone that accepts magic and is adverse to science.
      That doesn't even make sense (how do you have the same technology but not science at all?). But there are examples of similar things in the game in the shared Tradition Umbral Realms where humans brought to live there can have relatively modern lives, while mages do magic/Science! and the Technocracy isn't wanted. Being able to create such places is one of the primary justifications that the Traditions' ideal of a unified diverse Consensus that's free from the control of the Union is possible; if they can make a viable diversity accepting Reality Zone in the Umbra, they should be able to recreate it on Earth if they can keep the Technocracy (and others) from stopping them.

      Haveing characters face situations that confict or outrigth disprove parts of their worldview and self-importance.
      There's plenty of this in the games as written without having to introduce the kind of elements you're talking about. Camarilla vampires can learn how much their Sect has lied/suppressed/etc about the truth of their condition/history. Garou can run into Fera that can do plenty to take them down a peg. Mage is about the conflicts of different worldviews as a core premise. The recent history of Changeling establishes a direct conflict as the Space Race created one of the greatest outpourings of Glamour ever, but came out of the banal workings of countless uninspiring technological and scientific works (even if the game does shit to explore this). Wraith and Hunter pretty much have, "whatever you think is true is probably wrong," as a default state. Etc.

      You don't need to have entities from different solar systems coming in to do this. The games are all set up for stories where the player character groups can be forced to faced facts that don't mesh with what they believe while staying in the scope of the games.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Prometheas View Post

        Like a werewolf meeting a high umbral or even beyond umbral spirit that seemed perfectly apathetic to gaia dying or the apocolypse, seeing it as but a small meaningless event.
        It would be meaningless, though; plenty of Astral spirits are mostly in tune with humanity, and would come across as intensely up their own (admittedly likely to be nonexistent) asses. The High Umbra isn't exactly a place of complete perspectives, since it's focused so intently on ideals and thoughts.

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        • #5
          Honestly i couldn't disagree more with OP. It is so easy to make your players feel insignificant and especially spirits are great to do so, as you described yourself. For example i used death itself ( i upgraded him from the Mage description) and my players felt eerie. One of them even privately messaged me, if death would be a reoccurring character in the story, because he was worried about the spirit.

          There are tons of beings/creatures that you can use for that and more than enough plothooks if you want them.

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          • #6
            I just consider everything to be local to an expanded Sol System. The Triat of the expanded Sol System are just the System avatars of a Galactic Triat (which are the Galactic avatars of the Universal Triat). Gaia is just the System avatar of the Milky Way, which is just a Galactic avatar of the Universe.

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