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V5 is the most-anticipated rpg of 2018 second try

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  • Originally posted by PMárk View Post
    Aside from being a side-project?
    For the only thin they're visibly doing with regular positive progress... I'm not sure that's such a thing to leave on the side. V5 is in progress, but we get very infrequent updates on that. The WtA video game isn't actually being done by WW. What the heck are the staff at WW that aren't part of the V5 development team... doing besides this exactly?

    It's also not like we're talking a lot of difficult work. The guidelines updates so far have only been to include that people can include someone that they couldn't before. The aren't producing new art of the art packs as far as I can tell, and the layout/trade dress stuff rather than page and cover art is already collected. Like I said, yeah, it's work. But ~2 months to get Victorian Vampire or Kindred of the Ebony Kingdom done? It's not that much work.

    ....I think on DM's guild without any such helps.
    I'm not sure what you mean by this.

    Because it's not finished yet? It's a mess, right now, yes, but it's under development.
    It's a beta test. Beta tests shouldn't be this much of a mess. Beta means all the primary functions are ready and the product needs to be refined and polished. If they're going to include chat rooms, or forums, or a news section... those should be there now even if not 100% ready. I shouldn't have to guess if they're going to include those features or not by now if they're beta testing.

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    • I'm rather surprised we never saw more than the hunger mechanics, I mean if they want to have the book out this year.. they probably need to have the manuscript done fairly soon.

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      • Originally posted by Heavy Arms View Post
        heir three product releases so far haven't exactly been... well... hits.
        Meh. Hits? Maybe not. But they didn't need to be.

        Do you have a link to the sales figures and cost of development for the two interactive(and pretty crappy) story games they released on Steam?

        I know they made WW money. And in the end, they were happy with the sales results--especially in terms of what it cost them to produce them.


        Last edited by Fat Larry; 02-11-2018, 12:50 PM.


        PENTEX SUCKS.

        I'm a gamer. I'm conservative. We exist.

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        • Originally posted by Beckett View Post
          As oppossed to the last one or two?

          😛

          Agreed. I think we should always judge a new company's work with an IP on previous companies uses of the IP.

          That is totally 100% fair.

          ...


          PENTEX SUCKS.

          I'm a gamer. I'm conservative. We exist.

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          • Originally posted by Fat Larry View Post
            Agreed. I think we should always judge a new company's work with an IP on previous companies uses of the IP.
            That is totally 100% fair.
            Hard to say. One could also say it is perfectly fair to look at it as a property, rather than who specifically owns it, and if the new WW is wanting to reclaim White Wolfness, doesn't that include the history of, at least Heart of Gaia, if not also WoD Online?

            Im not trying to sling s#!% at the new WW, just pointing out my original point was that there have already been many promises made, many hopes raised, and multiple attempts at cross media. How/Why, exactly, is this one any different? Anything tangable, or just more "we have big plans. Big plans and stuff. Wait and see".

            If anything, I am complaining about their production strategy. Have something notable before you start making all these promises.
            Last edited by Beckett; 02-11-2018, 01:19 PM.


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            • Originally posted by Beckett View Post

              Hard to say. One could also say it is perfectly fair to look at it as a property, rather than who specifically owns it, and if the new WW is wanting to reclaim White Wolfness, doesn't that include the history of, at least Heart of Gaia, if not also WoD Online?

              lol. Sure.

              But that also includes, arguably, one of the greatest computer rpgs of all time(Bloodlines), another damn fine one(Redemption), andTHREE very popular Hunter the Reckoning games.

              So, you can spin it however you'd like. I'm just saying I think Paradox and Cyanide deserve a bit more leeway with their new Werewolf game.

              If you disagree, that's fine too. Don't buy it.


              PENTEX SUCKS.

              I'm a gamer. I'm conservative. We exist.

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              • You caught me in the middle of editing. Sorry, deployed and using a cell phone that is not very compatable with these forums.


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                • Originally posted by Fat Larry View Post
                  Meh. Hits? Maybe not. But they didn't need to be.
                  It probably would have been better if they were though... right? A combined ~60% positive reviews on Steam for both isn't really a great execution of their first venture out into the wider world beyond the WoD fandom (and a good number of the positive reviews basically say that it's only positive for WoD fans and people just there for the IF should skip it). Both of the curator reviews are negative.

                  Do you have a link to the sales figures and cost of development for the two interactive(and pretty crappy) story games they released on Steam?
                  Why does the money side of it matter? Is that all we, as fans, care about? That it makes WW a profit? I don't want RPGs from a company who's first principle is, "what makes us the most money," because it means quality is one of the first things that'll be dropped. One thing Steam does let you see, is a graph of reviews. These things had a huge number of reviews when they game out (positive and negative). The community page for them have been dead for a year. Basically their sales were all based on people buying blind because it was relatively cheap and the WoD brand has some value. The VtM and HtR video games still have people talking about them.

                  Burning that perceived value with two "pretty crappy" products does what? Get a bunch of people to be more apprehensive about future games? Even the old "negative attention is still attention" thing doesn't justify it to a larger strategy because nobody actually cares about them. Any change to capitalize on a moment of controversy is long past with no future product to get attention towards.

                  If they made some money of it? OK. Whatever. They have Paradox's money, they don't need to pump out small products to turn a profit just to exist. Paradox seems happy to bankroll them during their first few years largely dedicated to development; and there's no way the Preludes are paying for the money WW is currently spending.

                  If they didn't need to be hits... what did they need to be? Why does it matter?

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                  • To be honest, the only folks I personally know that loved Bloodlines either had already been fans, or it was their introduction into TT RPGs WoD. Non-(TT RPG) gamers, again that I personally know, had, ... mixed reviews, much favoring against it.

                    Hell, I couldn't get a single person to try Redemption, which I loved.

                    While Im not a fan of the sort of "game" the most recent two are, the sheer amount of wankery was off putting enough for me to not even bother.
                    Last edited by Beckett; 02-12-2018, 02:24 AM.


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                    • Originally posted by Beckett View Post
                      To be honest, the only folks I personally know that loved Bloodlines either had already been fans, or it was their introduction into TT RPGs WoD. Non-(TT RPG) gamers, again that I personally know, had, ... mixed reviews, much favoring against it.

                      Hell, I couldn't get a single person to try Redemption, which I loved.

                      While Im not a fan of the sort of "game" the most recent two are, the sheer amount ou SJW wankery was off putting enough for me to not even bother.

                      Your referencing anecdotal evidence. Which...is fine. But Bloodlines is still widely regarding as an amazing RPG with technical problems. Six more months, and we may be putting it into some top 10 lists of all time(and some publications already DO).

                      Bloodlines IS my favorite video game of all time. Redemption, not far behind it. The Hunter the Reckoning games were all great fun, too.

                      And while they were my introduction into TT games(which is not a bad thing), I am a gamer first. And as someone who loves video games, I sure as fuck loved all the World of Darkness video games(save for the two interactive stories which I don't count as "games").




                      And while I do agree with you on your last point, this is certainly not the forum to state that in; and if I were you, I'd delete it.


                      PENTEX SUCKS.

                      I'm a gamer. I'm conservative. We exist.

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                      • I think you misunderstand my point. I loved both Bloodlines and Redemption. I think I like Redemption more, honestly. I also loved the HtR games. However, and yes this is anecdotal, in my experience they did very little to bring in new fans. That is not to say it didn't happen at all, only from what I have seen, and heard from others, and I believe this was even brought up with the early nWW youtube videos, it mostly attracted existing fans.

                        The HtR games are a little different, in that they largely came out with the TT game, and played very much like a genre game, (in the sense they could have been called anything and had a few names scrubbed).


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                        • There's another big game that'll end up coming out this year that might pose a threat to 2018 being the year of Vampire V: the 30th anniversary edition of West End Star Wars. You know, the d6 game. You know, the best Star Wars RPG. Okay, technically it's more of a reprint than anything, but Star Wars d6 is a big name.

                          It also relies on whether Wrath & Glory comes out this year. But given that it's supposed to replace a well-liked line of games and it throws the focus of said games out the window I don't think it's going to be much competition for Vampire V.

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                          • Originally posted by Beriorn View Post
                            There's another big game that'll end up coming out this year that might pose a threat to 2018 being the year of Vampire V: the 30th anniversary edition of West End Star Wars. You know, the d6 game. You know, the best Star Wars RPG. Okay, technically it's more of a reprint than anything, but Star Wars d6 is a big name.

                            It also relies on whether Wrath & Glory comes out this year. But given that it's supposed to replace a well-liked line of games and it throws the focus of said games out the window I don't think it's going to be much competition for Vampire V.

                            A reprint of Star Wars d6 is barely on the radar... especially in light of the fact that FFG still has the rights to Starwars. Now if someone were making a Newish edition D6 SW maybe. As for Wrath and Glory, it lets you play just about everything right from the box as intended.. while v5 won't even have sabbat or independent options off the bat. Seems like any issues Wrath and Glory might have v5 would have.

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                            • While it never pulls in big numbers, and I don't expect it to because it's an older game. Bloodlines is well received in twitch and regularly seems to get praised when it gets brought up. I am personally just fine waiting until the actual Werewolf game is out and judging it on it's own merits rather than making preconceived notions of it.


                              “As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.”

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                              • Originally posted by Lian View Post
                                A reprint of Star Wars d6 is barely on the radar... especially in light of the fact that FFG still has the rights to Starwars. Now if someone were making a Newish edition D6 SW maybe. As for Wrath and Glory, it lets you play just about everything right from the box as intended.. while v5 won't even have sabbat or independent options off the bat. Seems like any issues Wrath and Glory might have v5 would have.
                                Given that FFG is the one releasing the Star Wars d6 game that's not going to be an issue.

                                And Wrath & Glory's problem is exactly that: it lets you play everything out of the box. There's no focus, no identity the game sets out to be. It's not like a Vampire book where you can play Camarilla, Sabbat, Anarch or independent out of the box: it's like if Vampire, Changeling, Hunter, Mage and Demon were all put into a single game and you were told to make your own game out of it.

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