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The Anti-Christ

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Lian View Post
    Except is in all ways more useful as there's nothing anything but the most epic of pcs could do to fight the Beast of Revelations. But to use werewolf for example one could easily use servants of the wyrm who couch themselves in trapping of Gaia as a threat. Either explicitly or those garou so caught in power and personal desire all the while saying "FOR GAIA" and using it against their political enemies.
    That was one of the sticking points of Dark Alliance: Vancouver and the "Priest of Gaia", though it was only one option for where the ST could steer things.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Tuch View Post

      I probably shouldn't even go here, especially in this thread, but I was wondering what brought out this statement and why. If it's because you dismiss the Bible as such then then there's no point in the discussion. If this is only how you feel about the Rapture itself then we have grounds for discussion. Though probably in another thread or in PMs.

      Either way I do agree with the remainder of you post.
      I Dismiss completely and utterly the rapture has having any basis in the bible. It is a wholesale creation of 19th century American Christianity. I also don't agree with the message in the bible about antichrists is the same as the messages in Daniel and Revelations. That in focusing on a "ANTICHRIST" vs the dangers of regular antichrists the message has been completely missed.

      But to bring that back on topic. I don't think a Super Evil character really has much applicable use in a game. What can you do when fighting Damien? Do you win because you're an actual monster? I mean the Omen is scary but imagine a pack of Garou vs little Damien.. its.. a much shorter movie! Really same thing with just about any set of supernaturals. You could of course power him up make him unstoppable for the monsters but then what? Or do you have some middle ground where its just as hard for the Monsters to fight Damien as mortals?

      It doesn't seem like there's really as much there as say going with false prophets especially among the garou.

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      • #18
        Wouldn't all of the non-Reconciler Fallen be considered Antichrist?

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Lian View Post
          What can you do when fighting Damien? Do you win because you're an actual monster? I mean the Omen is scary but imagine a pack of Garou vs little Damien.. its.. a much shorter movie! Really same thing with just about any set of supernaturals. You could of course power him up make him unstoppable for the monsters but then what? Or do you have some middle ground where its just as hard for the Monsters to fight Damien as mortals?
          Going just by the movies, even werewolves would apparently need to gather the Seven Daggers of Megiddo to do lil' Damien any real harm. And would not be immune to all the "coincidental" accidents that seemed to surround him, though they'd stand much better chances of surviving some of them.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Matt the Bruins fan View Post

            Going just by the movies, even werewolves would apparently need to gather the Seven Daggers of Megiddo to do lil' Damien any real harm. And would not be immune to all the "coincidental" accidents that seemed to surround him, though they'd stand much better chances of surviving some of them.
            "Yeah, there was some hiccup with a car accident, but I managed to step sideways before it hit. Funny that this business never seems to happen in the Umbra..."

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            • #21
              If I dust off my Nostradamus there are three Anti-Christs: Napoleon, Hitler and Abbas. Abbas has yet to appear and Nostradamus also calls him the lord of the blue helmet. The blue helmet could be that of a UN peacekeeper meaning that Abbas is working as one and making contacts with military contractors and other power players even now. The blue helmet could also be the crown Yul Brynner wore in "The Ten Commandments". I think it's already established as World of Darkness lore that a number of super-naturals were brought under Hitler's influence, so there is precedence for others to fall under the sway of Abbas. If you read the conspiracy books of Jim Marrs you know that both the Russian revolution and the Nazis were financed by the Rockefeller Foundation, so look to see who in Iraq is taking money from the Rockefeller Foundation and you have a good idea of were the next Anti-Christ is going to arise.

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              • #22
                I present to you the AntiChrist of all splats, rolled in to one.

                https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Samuel_Haight

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                • #23
                  How about Saulot?

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Lian View Post

                    He is never called the Antichrist in the bible. The creatures in Revelations and Daniel have a variety of names but NEVER Antichrist. The focus on them as "THE" antichrist completely undercuts the whole message of the many antichrists that surround us constantly.
                    True, but the Bible does call him by these other epithets; The Little Horn. The Lawless One. The Man of Sin. The Son of Perdition. The Beast from the Sea...

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                    • #25
                      Don't forget; even if we assume the Bible was granted by a divine being to a Prophet and infallible originally. (I don't, but even if you do)
                      It has been imperfectly translated through countless versions by fallible humans, often with their own motives.

                      How about looking at the general pop-culture theme of an antichrist than trying to argue what a multigenerational tome created with stories between 2000 and 3000 years ago means?

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Illithid View Post
                        Don't forget; even if we assume the Bible was granted by a divine being to a Prophet and infallible originally. (I don't, but even if you do)
                        It has been imperfectly translated through countless versions by fallible humans, often with their own motives.

                        How about looking at the general pop-culture theme of an antichrist than trying to argue what a multigenerational tome created with stories between 2000 and 3000 years ago means?
                        I'm a little rusty on Demon but if I remember correctly one of the books suggested that it might have actually been Lucifer who founded Abrahamic religions in an eventually successful attempt to wrest power away from the Earthbound.

                        I also remember in one of the books they talk about the Nephilim really vaguely, so if someone were the 'Antichrist' in the sense that he's the son of Lucifer, I think it would be one of those. I have no idea how that would come about, but that's the closest thing I can imagine as the Antichrist. Maybe imagine a Mage who can make pacts and has all the innate powers that the fallen possess?

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                        • #27
                          From what I have gauged, Nephilim seem to be considered antithetical to God's design, so a good candidate as an Antichrist. (Especially if you look at Jesus being conceived of Angel and Mortal, then the Antichrist being Demon and Mortal born makes sense.

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                          • #28
                            An alternative scenario for the anti-Christ is presented by Mark Booth in "The Secret History of the World" pg. 539. "...Satan will incarnate. He will do so as a writer. His aim will be to destroy spirituality by 'explaining it away'. He will have the ability to create supernatural events, but then know how to give them a reductively scientific explanation."

                            That to me sounds like the technocracy, though you might be able to stretch it to cover Demon the Fallen.

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