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Becoming a reversed Imbued?

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  • Becoming a reversed Imbued?

    We all know that the Imbued in the Hunter: The Reckoning gameline are given supernatural powers by two Angels/Messengers (These Angels being from the Celestial Bureaucracy) still active on Earth (atleast that's what I've read from this forum months ago, correct me if I'm wrong). What about a Human who is granted supernatural powers by a Yama King to do its bidding in the mortal plane (Being a Human "Akuma)? Is this feasible? Also we know that the Fallen can make regular people Thralls, but I don't know if Thralls have comparable powerlevels to an Imbued.
    Last edited by Shakanaka; 03-08-2020, 04:52 AM. Reason: Got Messengers and Imbued mixed up

    V5 is the Gehenna everyone was raving about

  • #2
    Originally posted by Shakanaka View Post
    What about a Human who is granted supernatural powers by a Yama King to do its bidding in the mortal plane (Being a Human "Akuma)? Is this feasible?
    I haven’t found any direct answer in The 1000 Hells. But a sidebar on Page 115 may provide something:
    Namebreakers who pledge their souls to the lord of Yomi Wan may be subjected to Treatments, but most are far too frail to survive the training than the more resilient Kuei-Jim and hengeyokai endure. Most Nephandi are instead given standard Demonic Investments.
    So this is feasible, although considering human’s mortality they may only be gifted with Demonic Investments or any other demonic power, becoming a standard supernatural infernalist (Or, a Sleeper Diabolist, according to Book of Madness 1st)

    You can find Demonic Investments in Book of Madness (both have them), Dragons of the East, ST Handbook to Sabbat, all I can recall now

    I think “Inversed Imbued” should be more suitable for corrupted Extremist, not human akuma. Yams kings connect more with spirits or banes, not Demon (Although they retcon this later, what a fluff)

    two Angels/Messengers (These Angels being from the Celestial Bureaucracy)
    One tip, The Heaven from KotE is not the same as that in DtF

    Heaven in KotE is a rather umbral, or spiritual thing than Christian concept. KotE core also mentions Heavenly Realm (I know Book of Worlds also concerns this, but at least Eastern ones is not the same as that in Demon). The “minister of Heaven” refers to Incarna in KotE, not elohim

    Scarlett Queen and Ebony Dragon are powerful spirits before Demon, not the last remaining Elohim
    Last edited by Rock113; 03-08-2020, 06:29 AM.


    • #3
      Yes, its called infernalism.


      • #4
        What Rock103 is describing sounds like an accurate description of what something like a mortal servant of the Yama Kings could look like, although I do think a point could be made that such individuals would more resemble infernalist sorcerers or perhaps fomori then they would resemble Imbued.

        I think that works rather well thematically to showcase the different levels and capabilities of lower compelling forces and higher compelling forces. I'm a bit reminded of the old-school D&D cosmological foundation that the forces of evil are many and myriad but the forces of good while few are impowered within those few far more then most dark powers. I.E. Evil might get hordes of imps and lesser fiends, but good gets one angel who can annihilate dozens of lesser fiends.

        Speaking on the matter of thralls, demons an earthbound can imbue there thralls with powers such as minor magical ability or supernatural strength and vitality, but ultimately, the average thrall is unlikely to survive very long if the average imbued decides to 'Purge the Unclean'.


        • #5
          Most who sell their souls to Demons are Fomori, those who receive Infernal Investments, Sorcerer/Ritualists of Infernal Magics or a combination of those three options. They are you Anti-imbued.

          It is a time for great deeds!


          • #6
            Any or all of the above probably qualify by that definition, I guess it depends on how strict a comparison to the imbued you want to make (much less a Dark Ages Inquisitor.. who in some ways might be more powerful/versatile than the imbued.)

            Originally posted by Gryffon15 View Post
            Speaking on the matter of thralls, demons an earthbound can imbue there thralls with powers such as minor magical ability or supernatural strength and vitality, but ultimately, the average thrall is unlikely to survive very long if the average imbued decides to 'Purge the Unclean'.
            That might be because, by DtF's system, imbued have significantly more Faith than your average person:

            Originally posted by DtF Storyteller's Companion
            A typical hunter’s high Faith potential provides a wealth of power that a demon can use to fuel his own evocations — a singe imbued thrall can provide as much Faith as five ordinary mortals — or provide gifts to the hunter to make him even more effective than before. The pact of faith does not ensure loyalty, though, nor does it restrain a hunter’s inevitable descent into madness.

            The same high Faith potential that makes the imbued such valuable potential thralls also makes them
            eminently suitable as vessels for possession. The act of imbuing conditions the hunter’s body to channel levels of Celestial energy that would destroy a typical mortal, thus presenting the fallen with an opportunity to seize a host capable of sustaining much higher amounts of Faith.
            Your 'average' human might be around 1, usually 2 faith:

            Originally posted by Demon the Fallen Core Rulebook
            Faith potential Mortals don’t have a Faith rating. Instead, they have a Faith potential, a measure of how much Faith a demon can use to reconfigure their souls.

            The Storyteller decides what Faith potential a mortal possesses. Most humans have a Faith potential of 2. Someone such as a devout priest with strong religious beliefs (no matter how twisted) would have a potential of 3. A Faith potential of 4 is the province of the fanatically religious, such as a fundamentalist preacher or Buddhist monk. Only a handful of people possess the determination, belief and devotion necessary for a potential of 5 — this is the hallmark of the pope, Mother Teresa or the Dalai Lama.

            Mortals with a potential of 1 are spiritually weak, with no religious beliefs and little ability to believe in the demon’s power. Such mortals make poor thralls, but may have other abilities that compensate. People with zero potential exist, but they are rare. Such spiritually dead, deeply skeptical mortals cannot enter into a pact with a demon.
            Mechanics wise the Storyteller Companion lists the Hunter with a Faith of 7-10 so thats 'approximately' true and fits with the whole Apocrypha 'blood royal/ancient heroes' background Fyodor was pushing. To be fair imbued will also have a bunch of powers that come less directly from their Messenger/Minister patrons as through their own potential as much as through their own empowering (as Fall from Grace notes, the imbued can be given their level 5 stuff through the messengers, demonic patrons, or achieve it through their own efforts) whereas the Demon grants its abilities to a thrall directly without the thrall developing their own power (and split the faith between what the Demon siphons off for its own use and the powrs it grants) so there are other differences governing that too.

            But I'd imagine that given a thrall of comparable faith potential that was mostly/totally given over to empowerment (rather than the Fallen borrowing part of it) you could boost that power, which is closer to 'hunter like'. But Thralls of that power level would be too precious to risk casually (as if Thralls weren't to begin with) and might equally serve as vessels of possession which limits the number available as thralls even more.

            Edit: On the other hand a 'average' hunter might only have a few powers (not all of them combat related) and isn't necessarily less squishy than a Thrall (depending on what kind of powers the Thrall has from its master) I'm not sure 7-10 is really 'that' average for a Hunter? seems more like someone who is closer to 'Fall from Grace' level on further reflection.


            • #7
              I wonder, Hunters may represent forcibly boosting a mortals faith through a visitation. Being an artificial faith boost and by a being of pure faith knowledgeable in its metaphysics they seem then that their powers could be essentially Faith Miracles given concrete form as edges. Like normally those with Saintly levels of Faith, Faith above five, don't really have magical skills they just direct their faith in the form of prayer and intent. Meanwhile Hunters artificially attuned to direct a their mortal spark of faith but dialed to 11 can direct their faith as concrete specific skills or edges.

              But Demon the Fallen Companion was so short but it defined so much for the game, like that example from the Hunter section always made me think Hunters would be a perfect Vessel for an Earthbound, because for someone like an Archduke your only other alternative is if a Vampire learns level 9 Daimonion.

              One thing Demon needs to Fix is they need to come up with some way to represent Demons harnessing lots of Faith. Because really a Demon has nothing to spend faith on if they accumulate too much. One of the factions is even built on the idea of accumulating huge amounts of Faith to rebuild the Universe. The other thing is they need more concrete rules on the effects of Demons switching host. Some have suggested the First Host is the one that imprints the most, but we need a better system, because wasn't the only real rule that they lose a Point of Permanent faith or something? And what happens when weak Demons get a high Faith Host given to them, like an Imbued Surrenders to a sliver of a one faith Demon?

              But taking into account that Imbued could represent the concrete harnessing of Faith, the Revised Possessed book gives this Autonomy system where Fomori grow stronger if the host gives up autonomy to the bane, this fits with the idea maybe if a demonic spirit eats more of the divine spark they have more power to work with. So another Antimbued idea could be like a supped up Infernally invested being, one whom an evil spirit manipulated its soul/Faith towards empowering the being rather then feeding the demon. Like how we discussed Earthbound essentially do with their thralls. So maybe have a ritual discovered/given to desperate Anti-Imbued Candidates. I take the concept of Disciples from Berserk if you are familiar. They used a demonic Egg amulet known as a Behelit, and humans sacrifice something important to them, whether they are their own Parents, or child, or even their entire world and they are reshaped via the Behilit. So you can have such an Artifact and or Ritual a desperate Candidate has to choose to sacrifice to and they are given Infernal Edges. But what is the direction we want to take these Anti-imbued. Are they purely counters to the Enemies of Demons (so Fera, Holy Men like Choristers and Dreamspeakers, and Imbued), or are they meant to fight rival demonic beings in an infernal gangwar? In a pinch you could just use imbued edges colored black, with less concern for mortals.

              Spawn and Ghost Rider come to mind for inspiration, but also Green Sun Princes and Abyssal Exalted but they are Demigods.

              It is a time for great deeds!