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Interesting Weaker WoD Creatures

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  • Interesting Weaker WoD Creatures

    I'm working on an alternative WoD setting where the more powerful creatures have disappeared and some of the lesser WoD creatures rise up to take their place. So far, the one which is most developed, are revenants replacing vampires. I was also thinking about having kinfolk replace werewolves, though they may be a little bit repetitive with revenants, since they are mystical bloodlines. I have trouble thinking about other creatures though. Maybe fomori and/or other possessed like Kami. I can't think of much else for other gamelines. Any ideas?

  • #2
    Mortals. Or if you still want a WoD setting with some supernatural elements in it, throw in some Numina. Fomori as weak? Not that much. Kami aren't any slouches either. Generally none of the Possessed are weak at all. Hmmm.. I suppose you can also do a thing where Thin-Bloods somehow are the only vampires left with the main line of regular Vamps somehow dying off. Kinfolk? I suppose you'll need them to instead of outing them- because there aren't alot of "weaker" splats you can choose from, so I guess you should leave them in. Oh Sorcerers (not Awakened) can work for you too.. beside that's all I can think of.


    Jade Kingdom Warrior

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    • #3
      Honestly, most gamelines have options built in.

      For WtA I would agree about kinfolk or kami, although another route might be just lupines who are more limited to classic werewolf legend. Change into wolves (just wolves) on the full moon, slightly stronger, slightly more intelligent, full moon, may or may not have any control over themselves.

      Mages have a pretty strong built in alternative as well with Hedge Workers who use what MtA would call linear magic. So yeah, Hedge Workers and Geniuses for the technomancer side.

      Wraith is tricky but removing higher level arcanoi alone could maybe work. Or you could go with mediums instead. Taste thing really.

      Changelings have an option with kinain whose power is similar to changelings but is far more limited and reflects what folklore may have referred to as 'Cunning People'.

      As far as other things go I can see things such as Psychics, Zombies, and the like offering fertile field for this sort of thing.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Gryffon15 View Post
        Honestly, most gamelines have options built in.

        For WtA I would agree about kinfolk or kami, although another route might be just lupines who are more limited to classic werewolf legend. Change into wolves (just wolves) on the full moon, slightly stronger, slightly more intelligent, full moon, may or may not have any control over themselves.

        Mages have a pretty strong built in alternative as well with Hedge Workers who use what MtA would call linear magic. So yeah, Hedge Workers and Geniuses for the technomancer side.

        Wraith is tricky but removing higher level arcanoi alone could maybe work. Or you could go with mediums instead. Taste thing really.

        Changelings have an option with kinain whose power is similar to changelings but is far more limited and reflects what folklore may have referred to as 'Cunning People'.

        As far as other things go I can see things such as Psychics, Zombies, and the like offering fertile field for this sort of thing.
        Some gamelines lend themselves to this better than others. The idea of using kinfolk and kami both interest me. Kinfolk don't have many powers, so maybe a little boost for them might make for more interesting characters. Maybe instead of merely kinfolk, maybe as you say toning down werewolves a little bit. It might be interesting to make them shape shifters in that they can change into wolves, but not Crinos form, without a vulnerability to silver but easier to kill otherwise. Then they can keep some Gifts or maybe hedge magic, so maybe something like shape shifting shamans. I suppose that the shamans and shape shifters could be different.

        Psychics could be a cool one. That sort of appeals to me more than general sorcerers, because they have a mage-like feel to them, but psychics feel different to me.

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        • #5
          I feel that world of darkness largely works because of the large power disparity. Say you replace Vampires with revenants, changers with kinfolk who have more access to low level gifts, Hedgewizards and psychics get their day:

          How do hide from, and not get killed by, an angry mob? As much as Vampires rule primarily through the universal best stat (resources) they have a good time because they can choose their members and their powers smooth problems over. A revenant takes forever to grow and can't mess with someone's memories; once one gets found they just need to hunt down your family.

          Also, the low-power WoD creatures, except for formori, don't really have weaknesses. They don't need to build a herd, stay away from people, group together with other people like them, or corrupt society to accomadate their percuiliar needs. It'd be quite a bit less interesting without that pressing WoD need to fuck shit up.


          Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by MyWifeIsScary View Post
            I feel that world of darkness largely works because of the large power disparity. Say you replace Vampires with revenants, changers with kinfolk who have more access to low level gifts, Hedgewizards and psychics get their day:

            How do hide from, and not get killed by, an angry mob? As much as Vampires rule primarily through the universal best stat (resources) they have a good time because they can choose their members and their powers smooth problems over. A revenant takes forever to grow and can't mess with someone's memories; once one gets found they just need to hunt down your family.

            Also, the low-power WoD creatures, except for formori, don't really have weaknesses. They don't need to build a herd, stay away from people, group together with other people like them, or corrupt society to accomadate their percuiliar needs. It'd be quite a bit less interesting without that pressing WoD need to fuck shit up.
            You make some good points. With both revenants and kinfolk, I intend on giving them a power boost. They still weaker than vampires or (especially) werewolves, they have some cool abilities. In either case, if a human mob goes after them, they may be more likely to win. Well, in the case of vampires, not necessarily, since they have so many weaknesses. But on the other hand, kinfolk and revenants largely seem human, they are far less likely to attract an angry mob in the first place.

            Vampires are largely defined by their weaknesses, but other creature types not so much. Werewolves, if they so wanted and their Rage wasn't too high, could just go live a mortal life with benefits. Other creatures may be able to do that too, depending on the creature type. Though there are other things that are important to WoD creatures, usually much more important, than merely dealing with weaknesses. Even in the case of vampires. Vampires have enemies, they have their political intrigues, they have personal rivals, war against the Sabbat/Camarilla/Anarchs/Elders/etc. Playing out having to feed while worrying about falling to the Beast or burning in the sun is a fun aspect of V:tM, but I don't think that it is the primary focus. It depend on the group and on the chronicle of course, but most of the V:tM I have played has been about political intrigues, which can work with any kind of creature.

            So, in emulating their parent game lines, I would put a lot of focus on the political intrigues between families for a revenant game, along with conflict between larger organizations, the equivalent of Camarilla vs Sabbat conflict. There would also be the conflict between mortals, the struggle to dominate mortal institutions while maintaining secrecy, much like vampires do but with fewer things to cover up and harder access to mind control.

            In the case of kinfolk, I would want to preserve the goal of saving Gaia, so that the kinfolk are motivated to fight the Wyrm, to reduce environmental damage, to oppose Pentex or something like it.

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            • #7
              Good tools (guns) ofset powers by a wide margin, and numbers make the game. If a mob wants your perverted revenant family out, it's out.


              Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows.

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              • #8
                Well, yes, perhaps so, but then you could say that about nearly any creature in WoD. I don’t think that a creature type needs to be able to withstand a full assault from a united humanity.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by MyWifeIsScary View Post
                  Good tools (guns) ofset powers by a wide margin, and numbers make the game. If a mob wants your perverted revenant family out, it's out.
                  Not only that the Revenant class of (former in this theoretical universe) Vampire society was already small enough as is and only relegated to Eastern Europe because it was only the Tzimisce who dealt (and practically invented) the Revenants since the beginning. Revenants aren't like vampires- they reproduce as normal and can't instantly create more of their kind (because Revenants can't ghoul or have any options of "embrace") like Vampires can with the embrace. Not only that Revenants will never have the skills, connections, or anything else to ever bring back the gap of the wider Vampire society that used to exist at large- it just isn't feasible.

                  Also Kinfolk only and no Fera? They would never survive against the Wyrm so ever. I don't even think Kinfolk can even side-step.. not being able to do that little thing would render the entire universe practically open season.


                  Jade Kingdom Warrior

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                  • #10
                    Well, clearly these creature types are weaker. It’s far less pronounced with Revenants because they lack vampire weaknesses and have Disciplines. They aren’t going to dominate society like vampires do, but they can still be powerful enough to be interesting. Don Corleone has no supernatural powers at all.

                    As for kinfolk, yeah even with a power boost, they are way less powerful than werewolves. Which I see as a benefit because the power level of werewolves really defines the nature of the game. In a kinfolk game, if players were going to oppose forces of the Wyrm, it would be on a different scale than werewolves. They won’t be going into the Umbra to fight Nexus Crawlers, but maybe they can sabotage a Pentax owned factory or destroy a single fomori terrorizing an area. It is a game on a different scale, though it could also encourage a different kind of game play - when you don’t have a huge hammer, all of a sudden every problem isn’t a nail.

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                    • #11
                      Kinain are probably the most potent of the sub supernaturals, they get friggin arts! But does this setting mean no new werewolves are born from kinfolk or just the population starts over.


                      But you also have sorcerers and psychics!


                      It is a time for great deeds!

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
                        Kinain are probably the most potent of the sub supernaturals, they get friggin arts! But does this setting mean no new werewolves are born from kinfolk or just the population starts over.


                        But you also have sorcerers and psychics!
                        I wasn’t familiar with Kinain, but I’ll look into them.

                        I was thinking no new Garou either, not unless something big changes. Though maybe that could be a goal of the kinfolk characters, to learn what happened to the Garou and see if they can find a way to bring Garou or other fera into the world again.

                        Yeah, sorcerers and psychics are good. They can overlap with the other groups too.

                        i have especially been looking over the rules for Kami lately, they seem cool, something Gaia oriented like kinfolk but with a few more powers and quirks that make the, interesting. Maybe with the disappearance of Garou, Kami start becoming more common?

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                        • #13
                          Kinain are the sometimes result of changeling relationships who will occasionally manifest with wellsprings of glamour and as such have limited access to arts, birthrights, and chimerical reality.

                          They're generally rare, how many exactly is ST fiat, but they usually take up a kinfolk-like status in Changeling society where they bridge the two worlds and are considered part of the family, although occasionally too banal to be around.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Gryffon15 View Post
                            Kinain are the sometimes result of changeling relationships who will occasionally manifest with wellsprings of glamour and as such have limited access to arts, birthrights, and chimerical reality.

                            They're generally rare, how many exactly is ST fiat, but they usually take up a kinfolk-like status in Changeling society where they bridge the two worlds and are considered part of the family, although occasionally too banal to be around.
                            It sounds like they could pop up from time to time as people with faerie ancestry have kids, kind of like any case of a recessive gene being expressed because both parents carried it - not that it should be so scientific.

                            I’m actually less familiar with Changeling than a lot of other WoD games. I have the first edition core book somewhere, but I don’t think I’ve cracked it open for 20 years.

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                            • #15
                              Yeah, C20 mentions that there's no real 'changeling gene' or anything of the sort but that kinain manifest almost without any rhyme or reason and the only unifying feature is some ancestral connection to the fair folk... which could include much of humanity.

                              They are somewhat more likely to be born from immediate changeling families, but there's very little science to it.

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