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  • Demon Homebrew

    Might be starting a Demon game soon, and was wondering if anyone had any homebrew for Demon.
    Anything would be good, especially Lores, Forms, and character options.
    I appreciate anyone who has any and thanks ahead of time either way!

  • #2
    In my games, the Fallen were never angels. They are spirits of primordial origin locked away in the Abyss. Over time, human mythology shaped the Earthbound, attaching a Judeo-Christian mythology to them, which eventually became the norm. All demons released after 1999 AD have this belief system imposed on them by what is basically the mages’ Consensus.

    That demons have a Background that allows them to remember things from the incredibly distant past means to me that the veracity of those memories is...somewhat dodgy.

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    • #3
      Here are some things I do when I run Demon:

      •I refer to their houses either by the houses’s title (I.E. The Devils) or the house’s order (IE the first house)

      •I open up Lores to be more like something between Changeling Arts and Mage Spheres: using the lores that Demon has as their ‘spheres’ with a sphere mastery scale akin to the sphere mastery scale that Mages use as well as a bunk-style system to effect the invocation of lores

      •Demons in their apocalyptic forms can soak agg and can use faith to heal it at a 3:1 faith:agg lvl rate in other forms

      •Mystery as to the events of the before, with conflicting accounts inspired by predominant religious cultures in surrounding areas

      •Demons can feed on Faith in a similar fashion to how Changelings do with Glamour

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      • #4
        I used hybrid rules from Devils Due & D:TF.
        This makes their powers more flexible. It also allows them to use their own Torment, which is almost never used in DTF. [Also it will allow them to heal all bash damage for 1 faith point and etc.]
        Let the angels do their angelic deeds. Perhaps he remembers Word that breathed life... Let him create an unholy parody that will raise the undead.
        Try to understand the spirit of the demonic Lores. It's strange that a demon can only do one thing per level, with divine knowledge of the world.


        Apocalyptic Form: Don't limit yourself to 8 abilities. Make them unique, but keep them part of House. (Otherwise it will be Earthbound) You can be inspired by the demonic forms of Kuei-jin.
        Gryffon15 has already proposed "agg soak" for apocalyptic form and idea of transforming Lore into something like Changeling cantrips.
        Last edited by Alphari; 03-10-2021, 11:31 AM.

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        • #5
          These are definitely some really good ideas.
          I'm really a more narrative kind of player/ST so any help making mechanics easier is greatly appreciated you guys! :]
          I personally like the Judeo-Christian mythos for Demons, I personally think that it adds to the feeling of sin, damnation, redemption, and divine love. I may not be religious myself, but damn (hehe) Christianity really adds flavor to my storytelling. :P
          I really have always been a fan of the Lores basically being what Magick is based off, so making them more fluid has always been my preference, but the actual application of said Lores is kinda hard to get down since I suck at mechanics. So I should check out Devil's Due?
          I've also been interested in Kuei-jin, so I'll definitely give them some focus.
          Thanks for all the help, I still have a while before we start, so this'll give me some prep to do.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by KnightFenrirWulfhart View Post
            So I should check out Devil's Due?
            At least, this will help you to create "good" demon. [Those who have high torment and are half way to existence as "Earth-bound"]

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Alphari View Post

              At least, this will help you to create "good" demon. [Those who have high torment and are half way to existence as "Earth-bound"]
              Well, that should help me with antagonists then.

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              • #8
                I have a project I’m working on for Demons in Changeling.


                A simple hack for Fallen is to treat Faith more like Balance from Mummy/Dharma from KotE. So raising it is more expensive but the faith pool eventually becomes exponential and faith above 5 raises your human host body’s limits.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
                  faith pool eventually becomes exponential and faith above 5 raises your human host body’s limits.
                  Not bad idea.
                  But... Technically, it's already in canon. It is mentioned that Earthbound (and demons who escaped from the Abyss in ancient times) have a large amount of faith (hundreds or more). This is due to the relic and the awakening of their lost powers.
                  DD gives all demons Divine Potential. So they can increase their Attributes and Abilities beyond human limits.

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                  • #10
                    I still need to read devils dues but at least I have the pdf now!

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                    • #11
                      I just got time to read Devil's Due and I really like the mechanics for Arcana. Definitely good for using Torment as a mechanic in a way that encourages being evil. Also using Taints as a shortcut to power is really evocative, and I think I'll try to incorporate the Arcana in Apocalypse Form as a bonus that can be purchased later.
                      The nonstop "EVIL" preaching of the fluff was a little heavy handed and whatnot but I just stopped paying attention and skipped to the mechanics section.
                      Either way, thanks y'all for suggesting it to me. Demon's one of my favorite lines and I was so upset to learn that I didn't know about Devil's Due even though I love DA: Fae and DA: Mage.
                      I'll check out KotE next, and maybe that'll help me work out more for my game.

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                      • #12
                        I tried splitting out the demon types so that rather than one house having three lores to choose from, you'd have three types of demon per house with one lore each. All supernatural powers were tied to the character's Faith rating; the first dot gave all of the basic powers, the second gave the first lore power, the third gave an apocalyptic form trait, and then it alternated between lore powers and form traits.

                        All powers could be activated by spending a single point of faith, to avoid having to make the host coincidentally well-specialised to be able to use lore powers effectively. The faith expenditure route was only one automatic success, so you could still train up your skills to make more effective use of lore powers, it's just that I didn't want to force certain ability choices at character creation.

                        Finally, faith rating and permanent torment were the same track, so eventually you'd reach a cap on faith that could be only overcome by reducing torment. Also eventually gaining torment meant actively losing your powers. My reasoning was that faith is the connection to the divine needed to access the former angel's powers, while torment represented the demon's hatred of the divine for their imprisonment.

                        We didn't have any loyalist angels show up, but if they had I'd have used the same approach; giving them one lore path each and probably faith 10 to represent their devotion.

                        All together it made for characters whose powers were much more specialised and who gained supernatural power more slowly, and it brought the conflicted relationship with the divine to the foreground.

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                        • #13
                          In Devil's Due - the Circle of Red - what are those 1-5 dot things? Abilities? Arcana? I'm confused about how to buy them/prereqs/etc because they seem interesting.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Gryffon15 View Post
                            Here are some things I do when I run Demon:

                            •I refer to their houses either by the houses’s title (I.E. The Devils) or the house’s order (IE the first house)

                            •I open up Lores to be more like something between Changeling Arts and Mage Spheres: using the lores that Demon has as their ‘spheres’ with a sphere mastery scale akin to the sphere mastery scale that Mages use as well as a bunk-style system to effect the invocation of lores

                            •Demons in their apocalyptic forms can soak agg and can use faith to heal it at a 3:1 faith:agg lvl rate in other forms

                            •Mystery as to the events of the before, with conflicting accounts inspired by predominant religious cultures in surrounding areas

                            •Demons can feed on Faith in a similar fashion to how Changelings do with Glamour

                            Can you detail a little more your homebrew systems? Specially Lores!

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                            • #15
                              So I’ve never written it down but my logic is something like this.

                              The demons took part in the construction of reality and the idea that they are still attuned to elements of it through their lores make sense. I imagine their lores being something like arcana, lenses through which reality are perceived and defined. So I imagine something less broad then Mage Spheres and more focused then Changeling Arts with the addition of a bunk system and maybe a variable modifier based on the ambient faith in the area, a similar model based on stuff like WtA Umbra density & WtO Veil density, or perhaps have that sort of 1-10 chart determine difficulty for invocation rolls.

                              Basically what I imagine is a system based on Lores where demons are able to use their Lores following a similar 1-5 scale as the spheres have: perception, manipulation, control, etc. but this power is balanced by more limited scope then spheres. Then you could have a bunk sort of system, though I’d probably have it be of limited potency, where using symbolism that is resonant to the lores being applied helps with invocation.

                              Again, this is still a very rough and conceptual model, but here’s an example of what I’m thinking:

                              [Damien the Devil is walking down the street in Detroit. He sees his old frenemy Francine the Faustian walking past an oil drum while on her cellphone. He decides to give her something better to pay attention to. Damien has Lore of Flame 2, enough to give him the power of perception & manipulation. He decides to begin invoking the Lore of Flame at level 2. Pulling out a cigarette and reaching up with his lighter he mutters an invocation, “As your eyes have become dull because of dead light, may your cinder become scorched because of scorching fire”. Because he’s on an ordinary street with a malaise of apathetic cynicism, his difficulty is let’s say 7. He lowers the difficulty by 1, using the cigarette lighting as a bunk. He rolls a number of dice (maybe willpower or lore) against difficulty 6. He gets 1 success and scorches Francine for 1 agg damage from the fire.]

                              While very much rough, this is a basic summary of the idea that I have.

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