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Changelings and Demons

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  • Changelings and Demons

    How do changelings and demons interact in your games? In ours, Kithain are the remnants of the Holy Host, and Fallen and Kithain sense each other on sight. We had a "thrall immunity" in our last game, as far as changelings are concerned. I might keep that. Kinain would essentially be Nephilim from a Demon's point of view, wouldn't they?

  • #2
    I have them be completely incompatible cosmologies, that get very confused if they ever have a long enough conversation to go through their histories.

    I do also have someone who's a Dreamer be a pretty potent Thrall, making conflicts over resources nasty.

    Plus I find the concept of an Earthbound in the Dreaming something I want to have show up in game at some point.

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    • #3
      I tend to kinda agree with zenten. The Fae and Demons are incompatible in a way, meaning that their facts about existence tend to conflict. Devil's Due, basically Dark Ages Demon, had a some information on how it would match to DA:Fae, which I have since then used as a basic guideline.

      In DD it's basically said that the Demons do not remember creating the Fae nor that they even existence during the rebellion which immediately makes them stand out. Are they beings created by the Host after the rebellion or beings brought here from another world created by the divine or most worrisomely are they a creation of humanity through their collective Faith. The Fae see Demons as just another odd being that does not concern them that much since they have so little to give to the Fae, but the Fae do cheer the Demons when they make trouble for the church.

      Of thralldom, and possession, I again like to take the DD approach, even though it is written with DA: Fae in mind. According to it Firstborn and the Inanimae are unable to be bound in pacts and too alien to be possessed but Changelings on the other hand can be both. When taken in CtD terms, and Now C20, I ruled it to mean that only those Fae who had a human component to their soul, that is those that went through the changeling way ritual, are able to be thralls or be possessed by Demons mostly meaning that the Dark-kin and the Arcadian Sidhe, and the few other Fae who have not gone through the ritual, cannot become thralls or be possessed.

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      • #4
        In my games, Changelings state overtly that Demons are just Christian themed Fae created by the Abrahamic religions belief system versus their Celtic origins.

        Demons...disagree.

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        • #5
          Interesting. Demons with Torment 4 or above register as corrupt. This makes Kithain think "Fomorian" ... and then things get ugly.

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          • #6
            I disagree. Recaps and sluagh should also seem "corrupt".

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            • #7
              Changeling would be much less interesting without either. I play both kith almost exclusively. Thanks for letting me know about the rules in Devil's Due We didn't get enough in C20, though I expected that, considering how much they had to cover already.

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              • #8
                What I mean is while the Seelie might not generally like high Torment demons, I don't think most of the Kithain will assume Formorians.

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                • #9
                  We had quite a few moronic house rules in the last game I was in, too many of which favored DtF. That was one of the less stupid ones. I was waiting for Changeling 20th to come out so I could figure out something less broken. It might be interesting if a literally Earthbound Demon binds itself to a freehold as a Reliquary. Or even worse, the balefire itself. I can see gatherings of Fallen refugees in the Dreaming, since they can use trods in Apocalyptic form and the Dreaming (might) anchor them from Hell's spiritual gravity.

                  Does anyone know what the "beacon for hunters, Technocrats, and others who would do him harm" is in Demon? What does "befoul[ing] the environment" refer to? The presence of an Earthbound Reliquary, or something else?

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                  • #10
                    Since Demons don't understand the Umbra (it came about after the rebellion), I don't think they could make a reliquary of a freehold. They just...wouldn't even notice it.

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                    • #11
                      Freeholds have nothing to do with the Umbra.

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