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Thallain and the Houses, Need Some Clarification

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  • Thallain and the Houses, Need Some Clarification

    Something to which I've been curious for a while, but can't seem to find any confirmation in the C20 book is whether or not the Thallain are capable of joining the noble houses of the Kithain? The book says that they often try to disguise themselves as Kithain (assuming they have a counterpart with which to do so) and that they have a tendency to join the Shadow Court, but it doesn't go into any further detail beyond that.


    At the moment, I'm speculating that they might hide out among House Balor, due to their Fomorian ancestry. But I would prefer somebody to clarify that before I commit to the idea.

  • #2
    My interpretation of the rules is any being capable of swearing the allegiance Oath to the house in question can join, assuming that the house wants them to.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by zenten View Post
      My interpretation of the rules is any being capable of swearing the allegiance Oath to the house in question can join, assuming that the house wants them to.


      That's what I was hoping for. But I'm having trouble figuring out how to properly convey it in terms of the story. Given how the Thallain apparently side with the Fomorians who are decidedly against (most) of the noble houses.

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      • #4
        To me the two options are House Balor, and the Thallain in question pretending to be a different Kith (which would not be easy for this).

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        • #5
          Originally posted by zenten View Post
          To me the two options are House Balor, and the Thallain in question pretending to be a different Kith (which would not be easy for this).
          ...yeaaah...some of the meins of the Thallain are pretty distinct from their Kithain counterparts.

          Like sure, it probably wouldn't be that hard to mistake an aithu for an eshu or a boggart with a boggan... but a goblin is going to look VERY different from a nocker, same with a bogie versus a sluagh.

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          • #6
            Weirdly it's canon that goblins get confused for nockers.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by tasti man LH View Post

              ...yeaaah...some of the meins of the Thallain are pretty distinct from their Kithain counterparts.

              Like sure, it probably wouldn't be that hard to mistake an aithu for an eshu or a boggart with a boggan... but a goblin is going to look VERY different from a nocker, same with a bogie versus a sluagh.

              "I'm this wierd kith you've never heard of from Kazikstan.."

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              • #8
                Originally posted by zenten View Post
                Weirdly it's canon that goblins get confused for nockers.
                ...please tell me that's an artifact from 1e or 2e. Since in C20...

                Nocker (p.94) - "They tend to have thick, reddish skin and elongated arms and legs."
                Goblin (p. 376) - "In faerie seeming, they are quick and sharp, green- or brown-skinned predators with pointy ears and vicious wit."
                Otherwise unless if I missed the secret curse where people go colorblind while around nockers and goblins...

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                • #9
                  It was in the Shadow Court book, and the description hasn't changed since then.

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                  • #10
                    I've mentioned I feel the Svartal need their own houses so Thallain can join. But Balor is the most viable option and maybe a Murduacha house.


                    It is a time for great deeds!

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                    • #11
                      Also in the Sluagh Kithbook it’s mentioned that Bogies are often mistaken as, and they pretend to be, Sluagh and that the main features that seperate them from Sluaghs are that they have sharp little teeth and that they can speak outloud, the latter of which is easy to find out by binding them which caused them to cry out in anguish.

                      So there is somewhat conflicting information about the Thallain as it is often mentioned how they pretend to be their Kithain counterparts and at the sametime their appearances are usually described to be quite different from them.

                      Any way as for the matter at hand, like said before I think Thallain may join any House that would have them by swearing the appropriate Oaths. The likeliest House to have them would be Balor but I could see some others as well, like Ailil accepting a Sevartal as one of their own but it would be rare.

                      Edit:
                      As a side note I agree with Eldagusto that the Thallain, Sevartal especially, would need Houses of their own. Hopefully we would get those in some future book.
                      Last edited by Possessed; 03-14-2018, 06:56 PM.

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                      • #12
                        Yeah, the book makes it a point that some of the Thallain are immediately kicked out of society if their true identity is ever discovered. Some Kithain even attack them on sight, as seems to be the case with Satyrs and Nasties. So I wasn't sure how they would go about concealing themselves properly.


                        Especially since there's a house who's entire gimmick is detecting lies and piercing deception!

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Nyrufa View Post
                          Yeah, the book makes it a point that some of the Thallain are immediately kicked out of society if their true identity is ever discovered. Some Kithain even attack them on sight, as seems to be the case with Satyrs and Nasties. So I wasn't sure how they would go about concealing themselves properly.


                          Especially since there's a house who's entire gimmick is detecting lies and piercing deception!
                          One of the things is to realize that none of the characters in Changeling have read the Thallain writeup. As an ST I would require a fairly hard Greymare roll to identify Thallain, unless it's something the character learned through personal experience.

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                          • #14
                            I really wish satyrs got Minotaurs or Baphomets as their Thallain instead of nasties.

                            I feel there was dissonance in earlier writing about how alike physically Thallain were to their Kithain. I mean bogies weren’t illustrated as looking like slaugh or acting like slaugh so I don’t see them being mistaken just because they slink in the dark. Yet Aithu and Ogres could probably pass as unseelie.


                            It is a time for great deeds!

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
                              I really wish satyrs got Minotaurs or Baphomets as their Thallain instead of nasties.

                              For real. Like, what the hell is a Nasty, anyways? That sounds more like a behavioral description, than the name of a mythical creature.

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