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  • Tribal Fae and Fetishes

    This is something that came up recently in one of my groups, no one is playing Nunnehi but they have met one or two local to the area as well as one garou. With Nunnehi and their totem bonds and dependency on the Umbra can they use fetishes? I always found it a bit weird that Tribal Fae have access to stuff tied to the Dreaming, nothing prevents them from taking Chimera, Arts, and Treasures but in my game some places do let Nunnehi enter the Near Umbra if they have a strong resonance with the folklore in which they hail from.

    So question at hand is if a Tribal Fae is gifted a Fetish could they use it? Using Medicine/Mana in place of Gnosis? Could Tribal Fae theoretical create talens and fetishes?

  • #2
    I would allow it, in general because I think its fun I would allow Fera to use Treasures, we know Bastet can use them, and I would probably allow all Changelings some way to use Fetishes. With Nunnehi I would just have them treat Medicine as a Gnosis trait.


    It is a time for great deeds!

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    • #3
      Tribal fae can freely enter the Umbra as of c20 if they have access to their totem in some fashion.

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      • #4
        I would say nay. Or NAY!

        Glamour (Mana / Medicine) doesn't goes well together. They lack the spiritual component to coax the Fetish's spirit to wake.

        But, if one would take the Wolf-Blooded Merit and got a Fetish which is made for a Kin (so tied to the Willpower and not Gnosis) he would be able to use it freely.
        (But not because of the Gallan, but Kinfolk status.)

        I also don't allow the Nunnehi to use Medicine Glamour. (For example empowering Rites, what the Kinfolks are now able.)

        I play a Nunnehi, but I would refuse these tools even if my ST would've allowed them. Changelings are powerful enough without letting them using unsanctioned (by RAW) powers.


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        • #5
          Originally posted by Lachdanan View Post
          I would say nay. Or NAY!

          Glamour (Mana / Medicine) doesn't goes well together. They lack the spiritual component to coax the Fetish's spirit to wake.

          But, if one would take the Wolf-Blooded Merit and got a Fetish which is made for a Kin (so tied to the Willpower and not Gnosis) he would be able to use it freely.
          (But not because of the Gallan, but Kinfolk status.)

          I also don't allow the Nunnehi to use Medicine Glamour. (For example empowering Rites, what the Kinfolks are now able.)

          I play a Nunnehi, but I would refuse these tools even if my ST would've allowed them. Changelings are powerful enough without letting them using unsanctioned (by RAW) powers.
          At the very least then using an art to Attune to a Fetish and or activate one should also work, like Willow Whisper or all of Sovereign, or even Naming.


          It is a time for great deeds!

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          • #6
            I would allow Naming to change the Fetish into a Treasure, but it would require at least Fae 5, and maybe some Prop.

            Also it would couse some ire, because the Changeling would destroy the spirit in the process.

            About the attunement. They can't do it, because they lack a neccesary element. An example from the nature: Virus resistance: Some - because of genetic makeup - are resistant to HIV. They can be infected, but the virus can't affect the white blood cells, because the cells don't have the components in wich the virus can dock.

            This is the same with a Fetish. To use it, you need to attune it. You need Gnosis for atunement. You lack it. Even if the Fetish wants to contact you, it would not help.


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            • #7
              Not exactly true. Gnosis can allow you to attune but isn't 100% necessary. For instance Mages and Vampires can use magics to commune with the spirits and attune without gnosis. A Changeling could in all likelyhood do the same, Arts are way stronger then Thaumaturgy, and is closest to Spheres of all the powers. An Unleashing could definitely do it if you don't allow cantrips. But considering the nature of how Spirit Manipulation allows you to attune, Sovereign would do the trick as it would be way more potent and flexible.


              It is a time for great deeds!

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
                For instance Mages and Vampires can use magics to commune with the spirits and attune without gnosis. A Changeling could in all likelyhood do the same, Arts are way stronger then Thaumaturgy...
                Partialy true. Please note that the Spirit Manipulation (W20) is UNABLE to create & attune the Fetishes of Fera. They are able to create something they call fetish, but it's not the same. Also they don't commune with spirits. They mind-rape them. Also it's a specialised power designed to deal with the Umbra and it's denizens.

                I didn't take anything else, but Changeling into account, because of the current topic. I speak about just the CtD, and not generalise & include the other game lines.

                Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
                , and is closest to Spheres of all the powers.
                Mages can use Magics for anything, that's not a question, but the True Magics are unbounded, except by Paradox. Fae Arts are sometimes much more powerful than TM, but limited in their effect. If the Aart wasn't devised in that way, you wouldn't be able to use it like that.

                Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
                Sovereign would do the trick as it would be way more potent and flexible.
                You would like to order a spirit to do something what it can't do. It's will does not matter in this case. Your order doesn't matter in this case. It's unable, and not because of his shortcomings, but because of the Gallans.
                And I *find* it very unwise to force a spirit.

                Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
                Unleashing could definitely do it if you don't allow cantrips.
                Yes, Naming would, with catastrophic consequences. And here I don't speak about the usability of the affected Fetish. With this you'd also rape the natural, spiritual order, something the changers, spirits, Gaia, and evil STs don't neglect.

                (And you also need a Fetish: Hey, wolfie, I'd burrow you Klave in which your ancestor is bounded next to a the Great Fenris' wolf kin to make some shady Unleashings, because I wanna use it, Ok?)

                BUT f I'd were the Onyx Path I would make a Nunnehi specific Art to deal with this topic (and bring back the Spirit Link!).


                Note: You seem to be a liberal playah /ST. It's not a problem, but I'm strict. Not in the story, not with the play(ers), or with creativity but with the rules. I saw multiple worlds breake under the "powers unleashed".
                Last edited by Lachdanan; 05-15-2018, 06:40 AM.


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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Lachdanan View Post

                  BUT f I'd were the Onyx Path I would make a Nunnehi specific Art to deal with this topic (and bring back the Spirit Link!).
                  All of Spirit Link's powers are innate to Tribal fae now or dooable with other arts thanks to their innate ability to talk and travel to the various spirit worlds.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Lian View Post

                    All of Spirit Link's powers are innate to Tribal fae now or dooable with other arts.
                    It's not true, or not true complately.

                    The first level of power is quarterly covered with the innate ability, but the Art allowed much more versality. The other levels are not covered at all, or partialy (Yes, other Art can be used to divine, but how could you contact your ancestor or summon a spirit army?).


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                    • #11
                      1-see into other worlds. Innate
                      2-talk to spirits, innate. Commune with ghosts, innate. Talk to objects about things Primal,
                      3-Talk to your totem innate. Talk to spirits of wisdom etc innate. See the future Soothsay
                      4-Doable by any fae with any emotion manipulating power.
                      5-Sovereign.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Lian View Post
                        1-see into other worlds. Innate
                        Yes, but doesn't cover the Lower World and scanning the spirit world from afar. And the received information is not detailed. The difference between the 5 sucess Art and the Innate ability is paralel between the new electronic eye technology and the perfect sight.

                        Originally posted by Lian View Post
                        2-talk to spirits, innate. Commune with ghosts, innate. Talk to objects about things Primal,
                        False. You can communicate with the spirits who are there, but can't summon your grand-grand-...-grandfather to answer your questions. Yeh, you can speak with a wolf spirit, but contacting with the shamanic-great ancestor to discuss ritual knowledge is a great difference.
                        The second level of this Art was (or is) the tool of a clever Nunnehi to ressurect tribal customs, language. To familiarize with long lost taboos and find out her ancestry.

                        Originally posted by Lian View Post
                        3-Talk to your totem innate. Talk to spirits of wisdom etc innate. See the future Soothsay
                        Yes, seeing a future is covered in sootsay, but the effects are different as the worldviews. Also the covered information are on a different level. And yes, you can communicate with your totem if she is there. Usualy she is not.

                        Originally posted by Lian View Post
                        4-Doable by any fae with any emotion manipulating power.
                        Nay. With this power you can placate the ghosts & not manipulate / dominate it. Yes, the effect will be the same: a ghost gone. But with placate you don't abuse your power and you negotiate. You are on the same level and you don't place yourselv above the ghosts.

                        Originally posted by Lian View Post
                        5-Sovereign.
                        Yes, but again with different effects & don't forget the spirit army!

                        In my viewpoint the Spirit Link is still a viable option which broadens the powers of Innate Abilities.


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                        • #13
                          Sovereign can be used to make it so a blade you just crafted is ordered never to bite anyone of your blood, or to command doors to shut, or Waterfalls to halt. Fetishes can do magic, with Sovereign you can order them to heed your words. Doors can't close themselves, shut off phones can't turn themselves off but you can certainly order them too.


                          It is a time for great deeds!

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
                            Sovereign you can order them to heed your words.
                            Yes / No / Maybe.
                            A gun would fire, sure. But would it without a bullet? A Fetish needs an attuned soul to work (usualy). It gives the juice.

                            You can order a squire to kill his master, but the knight guts her with a sword. Your order was tried, but never succeded.
                            Paralel, you can order the Fetish to attune. The Fetish tries, but fails, because YOU lack the spiritual component to get attached onto.


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