Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

The Lost Greater Arts

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #31
    The Sundering wasn't the end of the Age of Sorrows, Exalted Ended way before that.


    It is a time for great deeds!

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
      But didn’t the only very briefly touch upon cosmology in DA Fae, we don’t know it doesn’t make sense. My opinion is the Fae of Christian and Muslim lands were kithain and they took to the Dreaming both because of a Tuatha connection to it and because they’re elimination of animism in their region. Other Fae were more linked in the public mind and were more obviously tied to the umbra, while Kithain may have gotten pushed farther back into the Mists.

      And yeah I believe the shattering effected Europe first and spread. The changes make slightly more sense then mages universally changing from Pillars to spheres over time. And with C20 their magic is even more similar to dark ages.

      I mean inanimae are directly linked in DA Fae.

      No mages can still used Foundation/Pillar. Spheres were just proven to be a better model for "magick" after careful study by the Council/Order of Reason. That's why you have those Black Hand members who just use foundation/Pillars.

      Comment


      • #33
        I know they can still use it my point is the Sphere system spread all around the globe, when in all honesty many Traditions, and especially the Crafts would still use their old Pillars as it fits more their beliefs and traditions. It is replaced by spheres more for meta reasons of a unified simple system for play.

        The Loka Pillars found in the Black Hand are more of an easter egg fan treat that fills out some Lacunae missing from Dark Ages as well as it flat out works better as a cross system thematic power. Though with the described culture of the Itarajana they in all likelyhood wouldn't be different from all other mages. They changed a lot with the world, for instance few of the Nagarajah NPCs strictly adhere to that ancient Indian Paradigm, most of the ones from the books are from all over the world and often are described quite western. Yet for some reason the preembracees would be archaic? Naaah. Though I do enjoy it so I will choose to handwavum this.


        It is a time for great deeds!

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
          I know they can still use it my point is the Sphere system spread all around the globe, when in all honesty many Traditions, and especially the Crafts would still use their old Pillars as it fits more their beliefs and traditions. It is replaced by spheres more for meta reasons of a unified simple system for play.
          .
          I don't think the Traditions would be using Foundations/Pillars.. I'd imagine they'd use a certain amount of shared cultural growth because well they've had 500 years of that.

          Crafts SHOULD use Foundations/pillars but yeah its simpler.

          But the Spheres have always been portrayed as a model that was superior to previous attempts since mage 1e. I mean if you look at Ars magica, Spheres SOLVE all the big problems that Hermetics have its clearly a superior model to what they were using before,

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by Lian View Post

            I don't think the Traditions would be using Foundations/Pillars.. I'd imagine they'd use a certain amount of shared cultural growth because well they've had 500 years of that.

            Crafts SHOULD use Foundations/pillars but yeah its simpler.

            But the Spheres have always been portrayed as a model that was superior to previous attempts since mage 1e. I mean if you look at Ars Wmagica, Spheres SOLVE all the big problems that Hermetics have its clearly a superior model to what they were using before,

            Not all the Traditions though. Dreamspeakers particularly are just a misc. group of Animists and Aboriginal Mages that don't really gather into a cohesive group, they pretty much let all their component members do their own thing, and most of the traditions are like this just to a lesser degree. Yes newer Traditions like Etherites, Adepts, and Hallow Ones didn't get the chance to formulate their Paradigms before Spheres became the default. Orphans weren't part of a greater magical society so its weird they use spheres and spontaneously invented them when it took others all of recorded history before they refined into using spheres. Many of the Tradition mages would use spheres, but Magic is powered by your definition of reality... its unlikely to have ancient groups just throwing away millenia of tradition and teach people the new school of how magic works, guess our ancestors were silly who needs tradition. Some Choristers would have updated to spheres as all religions can be viewed as unified spirit of man and divinity, but some are from more tight knit legacies of teachers and students and are more conservative and fundamental.

            The Traditions are mostly held to be a more Laissez Faire, they don't force everyone into the metric system and everyone doesn't just take up the metric system because its simpler more sensical.

            Especially when can live for a long time. It makes sense with the Metaplot of the Reckoning vanishing older mages beyond the gauntlet, but before that ehh... and even after that you would think many of the traditions(like lower case and higher case) of magic persist.

            It just makes sense for some like the Technocrats, new traditions, and hierarchical groups like Hermetics, but the other groups are too loose, individualistic and isolated. Remember it would be a helluva thing for a Mage to switch from Pillars to Spheres, pretty unlikely, its more to happen by making a point of only have their students taught by those with Spheres as their system... yet many wouldn't want only specific younger mages to teach other younger mages, they feel they have wisdom to impart to their own students. And these guys could have been around since before the Council of 9 Traditions ever formed.



            It is a time for great deeds!

            Comment


            • #36
              Dreamspeakers are disperse animists around the globe who decided to join the Council of Nine. Today the world is very connected, but I wouldn't expect Mages in far off parts of the world during Sorcerer's Cruisade to even be using Pillars, but instead have something much more specific to their own paradigms, or maybe some different shared system in say Mesoamerica.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by zenten View Post
                Dreamspeakers are disperse animists around the globe who decided to join the Council of Nine. Today the world is very connected, but I wouldn't expect Mages in far off parts of the world during Sorcerer's Cruisade to even be using Pillars, but instead have something much more specific to their own paradigms, or maybe some different shared system in say Mesoamerica.
                Connection isn't so much the issue.

                But Foundations/Pillar system is supposed to be the default system not a subsystem. It wasn't spread out around the world (unless you believe myths that Fae and or Demons introduced Magic to Mortal Man), it was how Mages around the world first cultivated magic.


                It is a time for great deeds!

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
                  It just makes sense for some like the Technocrats, new traditions, and hierarchical groups like Hermetics, but the other groups are too loose, individualistic and isolated. Remember it would be a helluva thing for a Mage to switch from Pillars to Spheres, pretty unlikely, its more to happen by making a point of only have their students taught by those with Spheres as their system... yet many wouldn't want only specific younger mages to teach other younger mages, they feel they have wisdom to impart to their own students. And these guys could have been around since before the Council of 9 Traditions ever formed.
                  Not really. Spheres are litterally the only way for the Traditions to function as a faction. Its a universal language for the Traditions and to an extent the Technocracy. It also seems to have some greater Truth than Pillars/Foundations ever did. You have shade/shard realms of various spheres. Pillars/Foundations are litterally outdated views that don't work as well as spheres.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    They don't work as well on purpose, they are very flavorful. And actually sometimes they work better but the issue is they have blindspots, which in my mind is fine since they are so evocative.


                    Back on the subject, I am wondering rules wise how True Fae are different then Tuatha/Fomorians. Or is it just myths and Tuatha and Fomorians are just particularly strong elder fae.


                    It is a time for great deeds!

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
                      Connection isn't so much the issue.

                      But Foundations/Pillar system is supposed to be the default system not a subsystem. It wasn't spread out around the world (unless you believe myths that Fae and or Demons introduced Magic to Mortal Man), it was how Mages around the world first cultivated magic.
                      I'm pretty sure the Foundation/Pillar system is just what Mages use from the Middle East all the way up through Britain in the DA setting. It's not supposed to be how all Mages conceive of Magic, or even go back through time immemorial.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
                        Back on the subject, I am wondering rules wise how True Fae are different then Tuatha/Fomorians. Or is it just myths and Tuatha and Fomorians are just particularly strong elder fae.
                        Well, the closest thing to canon rules wise is in Time of Judgment, and that's explicitly non-canonical.

                        Personally I ususally have them as being the same sorts of things that became Changelings, just more powerful, but I would change it from chronicle to chronicle. They could also actually be what became Changelings, or some sort of gods, or just be humanity itself, as some options.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by zenten View Post

                          I'm pretty sure the Foundation/Pillar system is just what Mages use from the Middle East all the way up through Britain in the DA setting. It's not supposed to be how all Mages conceive of Magic, or even go back through time immemorial.
                          I think that is more that you only would encounter mages from those areas in a standard Dark Age game, so they don't give rules for Mages of the Americas or Far East. But Itarajayana is much older and from farther away than these places and they use it. I have saw nothing indicating this wasn't the default of early mages.


                          It is a time for great deeds!

                          Comment

                          Working...
                          X