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What if the Setting recognized the Sidhe as the badguys?

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  • #61
    I just figured out what happens to the human souls the sidhe send to Arcadia.There's mention of Arcadian humans. And the books say that humans in the Dreaming or in Arcadia who have no Banality can't leave. Comatose humans also can't leave, they just hang around and watch things, like an especially vivid dream. So when a sidhe is Undone, the human soul taken to Arcadia or otherwise lost in the Dreaming, like Harroth's, get a sudden influx of Banality when the Arcadian sidhe dies. That lasts long enough for the otherwise stranded mortal soul to find their way home again, taking back their lives.
    Last edited by Saint Michael; 07-19-2019, 10:42 PM.

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    • #62
      Originally posted by glamourweaver View Post
      If they’re meant to be anything other than the worst, the history needs an overhaul so that the Sidhe have a more Arthurian tragic-noble fall, or sacrificed themselves so the Changeling Way Ritual would be possible, etc - something that makes belief in their leadership a remotely rational moral position, instead of making those who fled to Arcadia and left their subjects behind the most craven of worthless cowards, as is currently the inevitable conclusion of the canon history.

      I'm sadly not experienced with Authurian myth beyond the Sword in the Stone, but if I have my facts right, Arthur lost his kingdom because Guenivier cheated on him with Lancelot. And while Arthur was busy chasing the fugitives across the countryside (since the punishment for adultery in those days was death), Morgan le Fey invaded the kingdom and successfully managed to conquer it.
      Last edited by Nyrufa; 07-19-2019, 01:49 PM.

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      • #63
        Originally posted by MythAdvocate View Post

        Legendary Plasmics are anomalous. They are not Wraiths, but something else entirely. There are many legends of faerie like beings whom Iron is not an issue, though these are monstrous and very alien beings. Banshees are an obvious addition to this, but the Cailleach (death hag), Jarnvidjur (troll hags), Sirens, Tenebrae (Greek/Roman death spirits) and assorted Psychopomps all fit the bill for creatures of both Death and Glamour. Some of these creatures might also be Kinain or Faerie animals.

        Of course, these creatures could "just" be Umbrood. Personally, I would treat such beings as Chimera with a "Nightmare Shield" that can be used to resist Banality and to soak Iron, and to cause Bedlam in Changelings. I would also say that such creatures could suck Glamour from the Pathos of Wraiths and Willpower from vamps.
        Their are Banshee from the shining host that are Sidhe Wraiths.
        Last edited by Konradleijon; 01-31-2020, 06:59 AM.

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        • #64
          Originally posted by Gothik_Knight View Post

          Uhmm.. you’ve suggested that the sidhe should be turned into complete villains while also saying that other changelings.. I’ll let others decide whether my comment was “strawmany”. I’m also not suggesting that mortals are “the power” because they are numerous.. I’m suggesting that mortals are “the power” because changelings need mortals in order to survive.. a single mortal who is easily inspired can be very good for changelings, while a single mortal who refuses to dream can be very dangerous to an entire freehold of changelings. To vampires, individual mortals might be food supply, to werewolves they are flunkies, to mages a single mortal is an inconvenience, to a changeling a single mortal could mean life or death.

          But for the sake of furthering the discussion, the current changeling paradigm already supports sidhe as being great villains. The Ailil hang out with Nephandi, Sabbat, and BSD’s.. do you think they somehow aren’t evil? The Baylor hang with Formorii and like to permakill fae, and the Leanhaun abuse mortals and partake in psychic vampirism. If you want to make the sidhe “more villainous”, just have the Unseelie and/ or Winter Court take all the most influential positions.
          What I never heard of the Dragons hanging out with such vile company,

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          • #65
            Are the earlier editions of Changeling: The Dreaming less obvious with their subtext? Cause I've read 20th Anniversary Edition, and that thing releases a miasma of the stuff, whenever I open the PDF.

            The Sidhe are quite obviously a stand-in for "The Man" (the Arcadian Sidhe literally took over the bodies of the 1%, when they returned to the Autumn World). And just like "The Man" in real life, they aren't recognized as "the badguys" for their heinous acts or hoarding of freeholds or refusal to help the common changeling in time of great strife, except by the fringes of society (i.e. those weirdos that went about pointing out the obvious subtext in fantasy novels, ruining your ability to read those kinds of books without being hyper aware of what the author was so clearly trying to say).

            And, like, that's exactly as it should be. That's how everything in The World of Darkness is (unless you and your Story Teller decide to just ignore all that stuff, and just have a fun little story about some fantasy creatures in the real world trying real hard to not die horrifically). It's all about telling those mature stories, and that means no cartoon villains running around, doing naughty things because they're just a bit mean. No no, they're afraid of their own deaths, and will do anything to prevent it, even rip out human souls or deny other's access to basic life necessities.

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