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  • Extending Life?

    So, in my game one of the mages is stuck in 1875. he Has to go back to 2016 but he wants to do a couple of detours, WW1 and 2, and also the 80's.

    Is there a way for him to survive all that long with out dying or aging? i was thinking on "Faking his death" and create new identities with Life...but, i want your thoughts


    Forum's Official's Joker and Trickster. Pardon my bad english, aint my first language (I Speak Spanish).
    ST: DtF, HtR, WtO, MtA
    Signature Chars: Crowley (hakalu), Joe The Nuwisha (WtA)
    Changelings: be afraid of the Technocracian High Five of Doom

  • #2
    Not without incurring a ton of permanent Paradox. Any mage that extends their life considerably past a natural lifespan, whether they look like they've aged or not, ends up as a walking Paradox backlash waiting to happen, which is why older Masters retreat to the Umbra where it's not as much of a problem.

    As far as how, Life would be the easiest. There are a couple of Rotes found in Masters of the Art that involve high levels of Prime, Entropy, Life, Mind, and Time, but that book is a bit silly. The best option IMO would be Time travel, or entering suspended animation using Life and Time. Suspended animation is pretty self explanatory. Time travel, I would think, would be less Paradox-inducing in this case since you would just be returning to your proper place in the timeline, so long as you haven't done anything in the past to change things.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Frozenfishy View Post
      Not without incurring a ton of permanent Paradox. Any mage that extends their life considerably past a natural lifespan, whether they look like they've aged or not, ends up as a walking Paradox backlash waiting to happen, which is why older Masters retreat to the Umbra where it's not as much of a problem.

      As far as how, Life would be the easiest. There are a couple of Rotes found in Masters of the Art that involve high levels of Prime, Entropy, Life, Mind, and Time, but that book is a bit silly. The best option IMO would be Time travel, or entering suspended animation using Life and Time. Suspended animation is pretty self explanatory. Time travel, I would think, would be less Paradox-inducing in this case since you would just be returning to your proper place in the timeline, so long as you haven't done anything in the past to change things.
      thing is, he IS a mage from 1875. so he hasn't time traveled. i was thinking that the OoH would freeze him and de suspend him for the WW1 and WW2 (for small campaings involving the mages).


      Forum's Official's Joker and Trickster. Pardon my bad english, aint my first language (I Speak Spanish).
      ST: DtF, HtR, WtO, MtA
      Signature Chars: Crowley (hakalu), Joe The Nuwisha (WtA)
      Changelings: be afraid of the Technocracian High Five of Doom

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      • #4
        The last time I saw hard rules on Paradox for extended life, it was 1 Permadox at 100 years, and them 1 Permadox every 50 years or so.

        Either way, time-travel to future is usually less Paradox-Inducing, because it is the natural flow of time. Also, it is less challenging of the Consensus in a lot of ways, from the times-old story of the time spent on Faerie to suspended animation.


        Eu prefiro ser essa metamorfose ambulante,
        Do que ter aquela velha opinião formada sobre tudo,
        Sobre o que é o amor, sobre que eu nem sei quem sou.
        É chato chegar a um objetivo num instante,
        Eu prefiro ser essa metamorfose ambulante.

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        • #5
          There's a combination of enchantments which I find very neat, a bit Voldermort-ish but less grim, possibly allowing a mage to "live" several lifetimes over, indefinitely (so long every goes well), and bypasses the permanent Paradox otherwise incurred:

          The Foundling (Correspondence 2, Life 5, Matter 2, Mind 3, Spirit 4):
          This last-ditch enchantment is worked by a Master who is about to die, and occasionally by less enlightened mages who burn away their essence for one last burst of wild magic.

          This magic attaches the mage's Avatar to his most prized item as a phylactery, apports ti to somewhere else on the globe where there is a couple desperately longing for a child of their own and creates the body of a newborn infant to house his Sleeping spirit. The couple who finds the child and phylactery are then subconciously influenced to lock the phylactery away "until he's older," then raise the child up as their own. Once the child is "ready to make his way in the world" (in modern times when he's leaving for college), the phylactery is presented, along with the miraculous story. Doing so, along with the Memento Mori enchantment, prompts the mage's Awakening and returning memories of his prior life.

          Of course, mages being who and what they are, many foundlings jump the gun, finding the phylactery in some locked bureau drawer and Awaken as children.
          Memento Mori (Mind 3, Spirit 3):
          With this magic, a mage awakens the spirit of an object, infuses it with the sum of his conciousness, then lulls it back to sleep simultaneously. The object thus becomes a psychic backup copy of his being, and remains quiescent until it is contacted again by the same spirit thaat placed the impressions. Besides, working as insurance against Technocratic brainwashing, it also makes it possible for a mage to remember his past life as a mage (or even for a Sleeper to Awaken spontaneously as he remembers who he was). Combined with Beads on a String, Talismans or even simple mementos can wander the Earth until they find the soul to whom they properly belong, then remind that person of who he was. Sometimes, they do so gently (through hints and dreams); sometimes they do so with a sudden barrage of raw memory. Most, however, make their revelations at some speed in between.

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          • #6
            Honestly, using Time to put you in suspended animation is the easiest way to get to the future, if you don't mind in being a one-way trip. And adept of Time and Correspondence could put you into a pocket dimension, removed from the regular flow of time and space, and have you spat out at the appropriate era.


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            • #7
              Originally posted by Bluecho View Post
              Honestly, using Time to put you in suspended animation is the easiest way to get to the future, if you don't mind in being a one-way trip. And adept of Time and Correspondence could put you into a pocket dimension, removed from the regular flow of time and space, and have you spat out at the appropriate era.
              The best way to do this, of course, is to be a Son of Ether and build a TARDIS version 0.1. Only travels forward, I'm afraid.

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              • #8
                Alternative yet messy way. Entropy, Mind, and possibly Spirit to reincarnate the mage at the appropriate time while retaining all their memories.
                You could even put effect into some kind of artifact with Prime.


                Keepers of the Wyck: A Chronicle I'm running UPDATE Chapter 25: Going Down

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                • #9
                  I would still make it cause Permadox when the conscience of the character gets old enough, but only counting "living and with memory" time.


                  Eu prefiro ser essa metamorfose ambulante,
                  Do que ter aquela velha opinião formada sobre tudo,
                  Sobre o que é o amor, sobre que eu nem sei quem sou.
                  É chato chegar a um objetivo num instante,
                  Eu prefiro ser essa metamorfose ambulante.

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                  • #10
                    Easiest way I suppose would be finding a secure location and freezing himself in time until the 'detour' doing what he wants and doing it again.

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                    • #11
                      The time freezing thing seems like it would be highly vulgar or possibly even accrue permadox anyway. The "reincarnated with memories and powers" route seems less vulgar in my opinion, the mage isn't doing anything reality doesn't already do and his memories from his new life are more than enough of a balancing force.

                      He's a new person now and may not think the same way he used to or even care about what used to be so important. The new mage has no obligation to live his old life(could be represented by a change in nature/demeaner, reshuffled attributes, and the "past lives" merit).

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                      • #12
                        There's no difference between "Slightly Vulgar," and "Highly Vulgar." Only Vulgar. And any means of getting through the ages unharmed aside from the merit is Vulgar.

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                        • #13
                          There are differences. There are things that accrue Paradox at a rate, and things that do so only once, and there are Permadox.

                          I wouldn't give Permadox for anything similar in principle to jumping in time to the future, and that includes freezing. Also, it is simple to do at a secure place, witch means both the possibility of doing at a Sanctum and getting no Paradox at all, or being almost never witnessed and get very few Paradox points. So the vulgarity of freezing through time isn't as harsh as not aging at all.

                          Reincarnation does have ways to balance itself, but there is one problem: the mastery of the secrets of the universe. As it stands, it seems that the "new" Mage have as much Arete and Sphere scores as the original. It is enough to be an issue, if a lesser one. It isn't really an immortal Mage, but still immortal as a Mage. I wouldn't give Permadox for time spent dead or as Sleeper, but would count time spent as an Awakened being.

                          By the way, I would let the Mage use the rote in a way to shut down the Avatar in the process, so she becomes without magic from there on. This would limit the memory of the new Mage to that moment, and the old life would be without True Magick, but this would save some precious time. It is, still, a way of avoiding death, with is the theme in question.


                          Eu prefiro ser essa metamorfose ambulante,
                          Do que ter aquela velha opinião formada sobre tudo,
                          Sobre o que é o amor, sobre que eu nem sei quem sou.
                          É chato chegar a um objetivo num instante,
                          Eu prefiro ser essa metamorfose ambulante.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Enginseer-42 View Post
                            There's no difference between "Slightly Vulgar," and "Highly Vulgar." Only Vulgar. And any means of getting through the ages unharmed aside from the merit is Vulgar.
                            Time has layered Paradox.
                            This is pretty much Highly Vulgar plainly written down. Permadox being the other possibility as monteparnas has written already.


                            So, this Zen Master walks up to a hot dog stand and says: "Make me one with everything!"

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                            • #15
                              To make things simple (unless complex methods or plothooks are the point), I'd recommend the 2pt Unaging Merit from MtA Revised (page 295). The short description is "you don't age, make up your reason why." Nothing more to it than that, except for a few examples.

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