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Can a marauder/potential marauder be Cured?

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  • Can a marauder/potential marauder be Cured?

    Basically that. one of my PC's is sliding the slippery slope of insanity and he might break into that level of quiet preeeetty soon.. advices?


    Forum's Official's Joker and Trickster. Pardon my bad english, aint my first language (I Speak Spanish).
    ST: DtF, HtR, WtO, MtA
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  • #2
    NO. It's like Nephandism, it can't be cured (unless you, as the ST, want, of course). A Marauder doesn't need to be a gibbering maniac, if it has a Quiet of 1 it can be even relatable.

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    • #3
      As far as I'm aware, once you go Marauder you can't come back. That said, it's largely up to you and the player if the character ever becomes a Marauder. It's not a certain thing. Marauderdom is something more than just really bad Quiet, it's a complete rejection of reality and a reversal of the relationship between Mage and Avatar.




      Mage: The Ice-ension: An Epic Game of Reality on the Rink

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      • #4
        If the character is heading that way but isn't there yet, there are indeed ways to avert full Maruaderdom. The character can spend Willpower and roll that Trait against a difficulty of 7 (or Quiet level + 5, if you prefer the task be harder). If they score 3 or more successes, they can act normal for a scene, having Willed themselves sane for the moment. This also removes a point of Paradox from their pool, potentially reducing their Quiet. This is according to M20, and you should check those rules out (the section on Quiet begins at p. 554).

        Alternatively, get them to enter a Mindscape, and they can attempt to resolve their issues through a kind of modified Seeking (but with the goal being to reduction of Quiet, not raising Arete). M20's section on Quiet has rules for that too. If the other characters have sufficient Mind (3 or 4 maybe), they might be able to enter the Mindscape and assist in the healing. If the character has a Demesne, they could take their Mindscape to there, if the player so chooses.


        As for whether Marauderdom can be cured after the fact, I'm going to go to my old standby when it comes to this game: Of course you can, so long the Storyteller is willing. This is Mage, a game about engaging Reality in a staring contest, and making Reality blink first. Sure, the books say you can't cure a Marauder. But the books say a lot of things, many of them contradictory. Entire supplements have been released exploring how to defy the apparent rules of the World of Darkness.

        So if the player really wants to save their character, and it would be a enjoyable story to tell, you can totally make it possible. That said, it should not be Easy. It's like reversing the Curse of Caine - making a full Marauder sane should be a herculean task, the likes of which have never been verified in-universe as being possible, and for good reason. This is something you build entire chronicles around. If your game group isn't prepared to commit to that - to making the quest to cure the character the focus of their campaign - then it would probably be better to retire the character and ask the player to make a new one. Honestly, you should still take the character over as an NPC, since Marauders are not meant for players.

        That, of course, assuming it gets far enough that the character becomes a full Marauder. As I said before, up until that point there are easier options for curing Quiet. It's when Quiet hits level 6 that you pass a threshold nigh-impossible to come back from.


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        • #5
          I don't really have a problem with it being incurable, but what is the metaphysical reason? With Nephandi the Avatar was inverted--is there anything that specific and severe that happens to Marauders?

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          • #6
            IIUC The Mages Mind takes second place to their avatar.

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            • #7
              The Avatar acts as a translator/mediator between the reality and the mind.
              On some accounts this may seem as if the Avatar is in control.
              Marauders can be agents of the Wyld, although this was retconned later and they could get denial and jhor too.


              So, this Zen Master walks up to a hot dog stand and says: "Make me one with everything!"

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Nonsense View Post
                The Avatar acts as a translator/mediator between the reality and the mind.
                On some accounts this may seem as if the Avatar is in control.
                Marauders can be agents of the Wyld, although this was retconned later and they could get denial and jhor too.
                Denial is interesting... Threat Null would be more interesting if all those maniacs in Autochtonia had became pattern Marauders than by being spirits

                And a Jhor marauder... What's the difference from Nefandi?

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Karlgust View Post

                  Denial is interesting... Threat Null would be more interesting if all those maniacs in Autochtonia had became pattern Marauders than by being spirits

                  And a Jhor marauder... What's the difference from Nefandi?
                  Jhor maruders aren't about decent of deception, decent, or destroying the world (usually). They are mages who have become so obsessed with death that it starts manifest around them in various ways.
                  One marauder might start seeing everything and everyone as Wraiths, transforming the world around him into the Shadowlands. Either that or they'd see everyone as walking skeletons.
                  Another might be convinced that they themselves are dead, and so their skin will be in a constant state of rot. They may believe that in order to pass on, they need to shed the old body, and will constantly try to find ways to remove their flesh, but it keeps growing back. Things become very dangerous when they notice other people with the same "affliction" and attempt to help them move on by removing their flesh too.
                  A Marauder might even be convinced that they are the literal embodiment of Death, in one of its many forms. Perhaps the Grim Reaper, or the Angel of Death, Barron Samedi, a Shinigami, or something completely fictional running on rules only known to the marauder. They aren't trying to bring down the world, they simply have a job to do. (Most likely, this is what happens to Jhor laden Euthanatos). Maybe they even think that Death is something that every person craves, but is conditioned by society to fear. All the marauder wants to do is help liberate people.
                  More perversely, there may be a marauder that fetishises and idolises Death (in whichever form they take), and sees them stalking the streets, and wants to impress them alla Thanos. In reality, they may consider a normal person who dresses in black to be the walking form of Death and will show them just how worthy they are of Death's affection, and will go to great lengths, perhaps by killing the unworthy, creating Saw like murder chambers, or simply killing anyone "on behalf" of Death. This basically makes the Marauder a muderus stalker figure. Their victim will have a lot of influence over what the Marauder does next, but if their stalker they no longer resembles Death to them, then they are in real trouble.

                  On the less macabre side of things, a marauder might simply think that he cannot die. He is the highlander in a way, immune to death through whatever nonsense logic they happen to hold.
                  Or they could be convinced that they are being chased by killers, or demons wishing to drag them to hell, as Silent Hill type monsters, or even Terminator style robots, and see anyone that approaches them as someone with murderous intentions (which of course means they get the urge to kill them, or anyone else who happens to be in the room.)

                  One last idea is a Marauder who inverts pain and suffering. So the closer to death you are, the less pain you feel, while the healthier you are, the worse you feel. Anyone that comes near them will essentially have their health levels reversed. Any enhancements will become flaws, and any illnesses or disabilities will become boons.




                  Regarding Threat Null. I actually prefer them as is. They are the old members of Control, the leaders of the conventions who were stuck in the Umbra and eventually became spirits. In becoming spirits, they lost a lot of their versatility, becoming more exaggerated versions of their former self. But let's not forget that they were still the best of the best regarding Technocrats of the 90s. This means they were able to see the patterns and take advantage of their new situation. "So we're incorporeal now... Let's see what we can do with this!" They represent everything the Union might have become had the Avatar Storm not happened, and they are determined to bring the Union back into their original views.

                  Once they become more known (which probably won't happen for as long as the VE have a say in things), they will be the ultimate trial by which the Technocratic Union is judged by. Threat Null will be the ones to spark the Civil War and threaten the tolerant incarnation of the Union, allowing those who still remember with starry eyes the 1990's heyday to assert themselves back into the reigns of power. Forcing the Union to decide between their ideals at the risk of falling apart, and stability at the risk of becoming monsters yet again.


                  Keepers of the Wyck: A Chronicle I'm running UPDATE Chapter 25: Going Down

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