Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

confusion about the nature of the one

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • confusion about the nature of the one

    so ,i was reading time of judgement again(by far the most difficult book in the most difficult to understand gameline ever if you ask me)

    of course this whole confusion might be simply because every ending aside from judgement is to a lesser or greater degree awful(as in bad written and unthought especially for the most part in hell on earty)

    anyway.. so we know that canonnically the One is ascended humanity. thus the one(except as a future) doesn't really exist "now"
    now,the One is supposed to be the true god. that is, he is most definetely not YHWH
    if so.. how can this explain the existence of beings outside his creation. i.e the zigg it's mentioned several times i believe.

    it also doesn't help that the term "the one above" seems to describe jehovah and not the One


    also.. the book talks a lot about alternate universes etc. what is not made clear is ...do other universes have mages? this may seem irrelevant but it isn't after all the one thing i always found strange about mage is that the shards of the creator of all tapestries and potential tapestries... are all contained in an insignificant blue world in a standard D-A universe

  • #2
    The way I see it:

    I don't think what "The One" is was ever meant to be clearly understandable. Like many mystical concepts, what it appears as depends on how you look at it. In the context of mage, it looks like ascended humanity. But is ascended humanity the same as the One that the Choristers talk about that shattered long ago that somehow can transcend time and space?

    What I think is (looking at the various mage books) that beings from outside of "creation" are simply outside of our creation, which is only one of the creations of the One. It should also be noted that it's possible that the realms outside our world (like the high umbra) are simply reflections of how humanity thinks. Thus something from outside of it, is simply the embodiment of the alien concept the mind knows is possible in the great unknown.

    As for all the shards being only in one world, I think that all the shards are reflected in that insignificant blue World of Darkness because they will also be reflected in every other world in every reality possible. It's just that the reflections are pretty much direct links to the power of the one since, in a magickal sense, all things are one. You'll see reflections of the world of darkness in, exalted, the trinity continuum, and chronicles of darkness after all.

    Comment


    • #3
      It's probably also useful to examine the Real World origins of the concept of The One, as proposed in Neo-Platonism. It won't be immediately applicable to understanding of MtAs's particular cosmology, but it will get you on track with where the concept comes from, and how mages appropriate it for their own use.


      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Mark
        anyway.. so we know that canonnically the One is ascended humanity
        I seem to remember places here and there where the realms of the Spheres, the Shard Realms where reffered as "Shards of the One". Also I think that the Triat was refered as such somewhere.

        If this it's true then the One it's more than ascended humanity, but rather something that would need the unification of all the Realms to trully understand it's wholeness.

        In Time of Judgement 1º scenario the awakening (but not necessarily the Ascencion) of Humanity triggers the 10 Sphere and creates the neccesary conditions for Ascencion. But, while ascencion of humanity it's necessary for the formation of the One, it's never said that it's sufficent. Voormas whole plan was to stop the One from forming, not by making humanity unable to ascend, but rather by blowing up the 10 Sphere. Of course, you could interpret the Shard Realms as reflections of humanity's ascencion.

        thus the one(except as a future) doesn't really exist "now"
        But what's "now" for a being that encompases Time itself?

        now,the One is supposed to be the true god. that is, he is most definetely not YHWH
        Why not? . The One may be the true creator of the game universe. Mage tends to assume so, as nearly every time it appears it's assumed that it's in the top of the totem pole, so to speak.

        On the other hand, it may just be another primeval being that created it's own universe...In Time of Judgement 1º scenario this seems to be the case to some extent, as Psychopomps are presented as "fragments of The Other", if there's an Other then there isn't only One. Maybe there isn't a One Abobe All in Mage, but rather a group of nigh-omnipotent beings whose omnipotence it's only limited by the omnipotence of beings of similar rank (much like in Werewolf you can say that the Triat it's above Gaia, as many Fera think).

        if so.. how can this explain the existence of beings outside his creation. i.e the zigg it's mentioned several times i believe.
        Where it's said that the zigg aren't part of The Creation? They live in another dimension, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they're unrelated to the One.

        Logically, if there are things outside creation, then the One was not the Only One but I don't think this needs to be the case. Albeit it can be...Mage lore it's quite vague when it comes to the time of Creation. Maybe there's no one, and the big bang created the universe like scientists say.
        Last edited by Aleph; 03-03-2017, 01:01 PM.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Aleph View Post

          I seem to remember places here and there where the realms of the Spheres, the Shard Realms where reffered as "Shards of the One". Also I think that the Triat was refered as such somewhere.

          If this it's true then the One it's more than ascended humanity, but rather something that would need the unification of all the Realms to trully understand it's wholeness.

          In Time of Judgement 1º scenario the awakening (but not necessarily the Ascencion) of Humanity triggers the 10 Sphere and creates the neccesary conditions for Ascencion. But, while ascencion of humanity it's necessary for the formation of the One, it's never said that it's sufficent. Voormas whole plan was to stop the One from forming, not by making humanity unable to ascend, but rather by blowing up the 10 Sphere. Of course, you could interpret the Shard Realms as reflections of humanity's ascencion.



          But what's "now" for a being that encompases Time itself?



          Why not? . The One may be the true creator of the game universe. Mage tends to assume so, as nearly every time it appears it's assumed that it's in the top of the totem pole, so to speak.

          On the other hand, it may just be another primeval being that created it's own universe...In Time of Judgement 1º scenario this seems to be the case to some extent, as Psychopomps are presented as "fragments of The Other", if there's an Other then there isn't only One. Maybe there isn't a One Abobe All in Mage, but rather a group of nigh-omnipotent beings whose omnipotence it's only limited by the omnipotence of beings of similar rank (much like in Werewolf you can say that the Triat it's above Gaia, as many Fera think).



          Where it's said that the zigg aren't part of The Creation? They live in another dimension, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they're unrelated to the One.

          Logically, if there are things outside creation, then the One was not the Only One but I don't think this needs to be the case. Albeit it can be...Mage lore it's quite vague when it comes to the time of Creation. Maybe there's no one, and the big bang created the universe like scientists say.


          it's stated in quite a few sourced(or implied) that the wod god is a flawed(though propably ultimately good) demiurge. transmissions from the rogue council,revelations of the dark mother and propably more. plus the whole game runs on gnosticism
          the "other" is(IIRC) essentially the 10 sphere. or to be more precise the 10 sphere it the other'sface/manifestation. psychopomps are it's liberating elements while the malfeans are it's
          s destructive ones. this is the other that "must be reconciled with in order to bring ascension" which is precisely what voormas does not want.

          i believe the zigg scenario explicitly says"outside creation" but will recheck to make sure. perhaps they live in a higher dimension of an alternate universe?

          Comment

          Working...
          X