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Fates of Canon NPCs experiencing Avatar Storm ?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by History View Post
    True, but it was the only one of them written as an official ending to the metaplot and the line. The other ones just don't make that much sense and only work on their own, not as an actual part of the metaplot.
    Originally posted by Czernobog View Post
    Not to mention that it had a dedicated novel.
    Uh , but why WhiteWolf did this ? ... Don't kick me , I always think "Hell on Earth" is more official (Although it is not that "real" because it's the worst condition you can imagine ... )

    PS : Do other Series in ToJ have "more official" Ending like this ?
    Last edited by Rock113; 11-12-2018, 04:16 AM.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Rock113 View Post

      Uh ... Where mentioned this ? M20 reconnects 6th Malestorm ...
      Well, the world didn't end in 2004 and the Red Star disappeared soon after showing up.
      Last edited by Czernobog; 11-12-2018, 04:09 AM.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Czernobog View Post

        Well, the world didn't end in 2004 and the Red Star disappeared soon after showing up.
        Thanks . I expect more 5E books ...

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Rock113 View Post

          Uh , but why WhiteWolf did this ? ... Don't kick me , I always think "Hell on Earth" is more official (Although it is not that "real" because it's the worst condition you can imagine ... )

          PS : Do other Series in ToJ have "more official" Ending like this ?
          Why not? It was kind of the same with Wraith's Ends of Empire, even if that one wasn't ToJ.

          Also Hell on Earth is bad, the players can't do anything but to see the events unfold without any leeway and brought back a mostly forgotten character from Book of Madness 1st Edition to be an unstoppable villain sue without any kind of nuance. It also ignored the narrative going on at the moment for the sake of it.

          Originally posted by Czernobog View Post

          Well, the world didn't end in 2004 and the Red Star disappeared soon after showing up.
          Wasn't the Red Star still going on in the Beckett Jyhad Diary? I don't remember if there was any mention in Mage, but it's so toolbox-like with metaplot that I don't think that it would give an outright answer anyway. The Avatar Storm was kind of there, just weaker and more random.
          Last edited by History; 11-12-2018, 07:06 AM.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by History View Post
            Why not? It was kind of the same with Wraith's Ends of Empire, even if that one wasn't ToJ.

            Also Hell on Earth is bad, the players can't do anything but to see the events unfold without any leeway and brought back a mostly forgotten character from Book of Madness 1st Edition to be an unstoppable villain sue without any kind of nuance. It also ignored the narrative going on at the moment for the sake of it.
            Well it's a choice between ...

            *railroading PCs between talking heads who exposit on the metaplot and deliver plot coupons, all the way to the final battle with Voormas
            *a scenario that doesn't even include any clues on how to incorporate the PCs, apparently
            *an Armageddon-esque scenario where all the factions' attempts to stop a meteorite end up interfering with each other, but the PCs might save a tiny fraction of humanity
            *aliens stealing Avatars, who have to be rescued from their spaceship
            *PCs get to watch as a Villain Sue kills everybody and turns the setting into a post-apocalyptic nightmare

            Wasn't the Red Star still going on in the Beckett Jyhad Diary? I don't remember if there was any mention in Mage, but it's so toolbox-like with metaplot that I don't think that it would give an outright answer anyway. The Avatar Storm was kind of there, just weaker and more random.
            According to the Wiki:

            https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Beckett's_Jyhad_Diary

            And ...

            Originally posted by Convention Book: Void Engineers
            . Fifteen years ago, 28978 Ixion puzzled astronomers by exhibiting the characteristics of a redshifted microstar. NSC agents have spent a decade eliminating evidence of this “Red Star event” for a number of reasons, the most important of which is that we still have no goddamn idea what it was.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Czernobog View Post

              Well it's a choice between ...

              *railroading PCs between talking heads who exposit on the metaplot and deliver plot coupons, all the way to the final battle with Voormas
              *a scenario that doesn't even include any clues on how to incorporate the PCs, apparently
              *an Armageddon-esque scenario where all the factions' attempts to stop a meteorite end up interfering with each other, but the PCs might save a tiny fraction of humanity
              *aliens stealing Avatars, who have to be rescued from their spaceship
              *PCs get to watch as a Villain Sue kills everybody and turns the setting into a post-apocalyptic nightmare
              I don't agree that Judgment it's that much of a railroad, as it has a lot of space between events to do a lot of other stuff if you want (or tackle things the scenario just tangentially touches) and the players are actually doing something and being the center of the action. You are right about the plot coupons though. Add the thing about being obtuse to players that don't know the metaplot.


              Originally posted by Czernobog View Post
              I read Beckett's Jyhad Diary and I'm pretty sure they mention the star is still there more than once.
              Last edited by History; 11-12-2018, 07:50 AM.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by History View Post
                Also Hell on Earth is bad, the players can't do anything but to see the events unfold without any leeway and brought back a mostly forgotten character from Book of Madness 1st Edition to be an unstoppable villain sue without any kind of nuance. It also ignored the narrative going on at the moment for the sake of it.
                Yeah , it is unreasonable , " Bad guys never lost " . There is no any other thing except tragedy in this Chapter ...And bringing back a NPC who is only mentioned 10 years ago is not a good idea ...

                I'm wrong , the reason why this Chapter leaves me the most impression is that it has many Very Badass Guys (Aswadims , thousands of years old )... "Broaden my knowledge" ...
                Last edited by Rock113; 11-16-2018, 06:53 PM.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Rock113 View Post
                  I'm wrong , the reason why this Chapter leaves me the most impression is that it has many Very Badass Guys (Aswadims , thousands of years old )... "Broaden my knowledge" ... At least there is no such mages before (Dead Magic ll has a Etrurian mage , that's the only exception I remember...)
                  I think Voormas or even Aleph are better villains without the need of them being thousands of years old.

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                  • #24
                    Ascension was a pretty bad book that missed the point of Mage. "The End Times are Upon us" was never really a major theme of Mage, and just forcing random apocalypses on players is not the way to go.


                    What doesn't kill you, makes you... stranger.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Asmodai View Post
                      Ascension was a pretty bad book that missed the point of Mage. "The End Times are Upon us" was never really a major theme of Mage, and just forcing random apocalypses on players is not the way to go.
                      Well, the line was ending and it was a editorial plot point for all lines so at the time it had to happen one way or another.

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