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  • Gods and Monsters Discussion thread

    This thread is due discussing God's and Monsters, which has just been released to Kickstarter backers. It's not for Errata, but it is for discussing issues that you have with it that don't qualify as Errata.



  • #2
    The animal strengths are terribly done in my opinion. A gorilla has 4 strength and an elephant has 7? Come on, really? Freaking really?
    Gorillas are five times stronger than a human. They should be well beyond 5 strength. Also a bear is stronger than a gorilla for some reason?

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    • #3
      Originally posted by theoutlander523 View Post
      The animal strengths are terribly done in my opinion. A gorilla has 4 strength and an elephant has 7? Come on, really? Freaking really?
      Gorillas are five times stronger than a human. They should be well beyond 5 strength. Also a bear is stronger than a gorilla for some reason?
      ...then go mention it in errata.

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      • #4
        Is it just a normal Gorilla or it's a Gorilla Spirit?

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Nicolas Milioni View Post
          Is it just a normal Gorilla or it's a Gorilla Spirit?
          Normal gorilla. Also has less health levels than a normal human for some reason.

          Comment


          • #6
            It's a small thing but I hate the format of most of the art, with multiple character all in the same piece. Like, if I want to use one of the characters, I can't show my players a picture without the other characters in the shot.

            I imagine there's quite possibly a cost issue there, but it's still a disappointment.


            Comment


            • #7
              Frankensteinian Monstrosity is everything I ever wanted to see in the World of Darkness. Finally!


              I'm a gamer. I'm conservative. We exist.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by theoutlander523 View Post
                The animal strengths are terribly done in my opinion. A gorilla has 4 strength and an elephant has 7? Come on, really?
                Of note is, that the entry mixes up a few large primates. Not just Gorilla, but also primates like the Orangutan - which definitely more matches along the lines of strength 4.
                So yeah, the problem of the entry isn't that it's too low, but that Gorilla either deserves its separate entry along 'Huge Apes', or it should suggest a scale of 3 - X.


                cWoD Dice Probability Chart ||| cWoD Dice Statistics Calculator ||| cWoD Alternative Armor System
                cWoD Alternative Damage Roll System ||| My explanation of cWoD Damage Levels ||| 'Interesting' Strength Attribute Stuff
                EXPLOSIVE cWoD STUFF! ||| How Technocrats don't think they are Mages

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                • #9

                  I applaud the way the section on Igors actually digs into what is going on beneath the stereotype. That said, years of Pratchett have conditioned me to think of Igors as having much more power in that relationship than it first appears. Also, I now want to depict a really snarky Igor who insight and belligerence combine to keep his "master" grounded.


                  Mage: The Ice-ension: An Epic Game of Reality on the Rink

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Ramnesis View Post
                    I applaud the way the section on Igors actually digs into what is going on beneath the stereotype. That said, years of Pratchett have conditioned me to think of Igors as having much more power in that relationship than it first appears. Also, I now want to depict a really snarky Igor who insight and belligerence combine to keep his "master" grounded.
                    And then it was revealed that the 'Igor' was actually the crazy Etherite, deformed by previous Paradox mishaps, and they had created a whole, unblemished clone of themselves to act as their servant - while nobody's looking.

                    Or you spin it even one step further




                    cWoD Dice Probability Chart ||| cWoD Dice Statistics Calculator ||| cWoD Alternative Armor System
                    cWoD Alternative Damage Roll System ||| My explanation of cWoD Damage Levels ||| 'Interesting' Strength Attribute Stuff
                    EXPLOSIVE cWoD STUFF! ||| How Technocrats don't think they are Mages

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Tiberius....Just saying.

                      https://imgur.com/MIqR9Ow

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Reviewing the Companion Character Creation. And, not surprisingly, Companions are inherently weaker than mages: not only do they not have access to Arete, Spheres, or the Avatar Background (which makes perfect sense, and would be enough in and of itself to leave them “weaker” than mages), but they also have lower Attributes overall, fewer dots for Abilities, fewer Backgrounds, and less Willpower. As I said, I'm not surprised, as the World of Darkness has a long history of doing this. That said, I fully intend to port the “Equal For All” option from Sorcerer Revised into Gods and Monsters.


                        Comment


                        • #13
                          How are the Advantages in the new book? I can't buy the PDF yet but I'm curious to hear about the crunch. There's a cyborg NPC in my setting, the adopted child of two Etherites, and I'm messing around with Advantages and Enhancements with her.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Dataweaver View Post
                            Reviewing the Companion Character Creation. And, not surprisingly, Companions are inherently weaker than mages: not only do they not have access to Arete, Spheres, or the Avatar Background (which makes perfect sense, and would be enough in and of itself to leave them “weaker” than mages), but they also have lower Attributes overall, fewer dots for Abilities, fewer Backgrounds, and less Willpower. As I said, I'm not surprised, as the World of Darkness has a long history of doing this. That said, I fully intend to port the “Equal For All” option from Sorcerer Revised into Gods and Monsters.
                            God I hate this. There is absolutely no reason, Crunch or Fluff wise, that a starting Mage should have more Attributes/Abilities/Freebies/Anything than a starting Companion/Consort/Acolyte. Companions should be chosen by Mages because they are good at mundane stuff. That means they should have better Attributes and Abilities, strong Backgrounds, plenty of freebies. That makes them fun to play compared with being a weaker alternative. For example, the Syndicate Mage chooses a Companion who is physically fit and attractive to act as a bodyguard and gracious host to business contacts. They could have two sets of Primary Attributes and one Secondary, and two sets of Secondary Abilities and one Primary. This reflects the sort of excellence Mages would seek out in their assistants, the kind you can easily find with Level 1 spheres and magickal persuasion.

                            There could be an option for "my kid brother" type consorts who weren't headhunted for their abilities of course. In that case having the same starting traits as mages, or weaker, would make sense.

                            Ghouls have the same issue but at least they are missing all of the huge curses, plus thematically they're intended to have these downsides in power.
                            Last edited by 11twiggins; 02-21-2019, 03:52 PM.

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                            • #15
                              For what it's worth, G&M gives someone either 15 Freebie Points if they're some version of the kid brother type (“acolytes and backup agents”), 21 Freebie Points if they're recruited for some special benefit they provide (“consors and other skilled allies”), and 25 Freebie Points if they're a Familiar. I'm also fine with them starting with Willpower 3 instead of 5; having an abnormally strong will is every bit as much a defining feature of mages as Avatar, Arete, and Spheres are. But I see no reason to nerf Attributes, Abilities, or Backgrounds.

                              Mind you, the book also provides templates for Storyteller Character children, teens, and elders; and for many of them, reduced Attributes, Attributes, and/or Backgrounds are entirely appropriate for their player character counterparts — though in some cases, like the elderly, a case could be made that they should have more Abilities and Backgrounds than normal, even as their Attributes are degrading. But those are well outside the usual scope that the character creation system is designed for, so it doesn't bother me that there book doesn't devote any words to creating them as playable characters.


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