Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Optional Dividing Successes Rule

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Optional Dividing Successes Rule

    Ok, I was just reading some rules and now my head is confused with the successes rules. The optional successes rule is quite clear, you take a base success requirement and add on top of it Damage(2 for each success), Duration (According to table) and Targets(1 target for success) by buying them with you remaining successes.
    So, if you have 5 successes in an effect that has 2 base successes requirement, you stil have 3 successes to spend in damage/duration/targets as I said above.

    Now, if we don't use the Optional dividing success rule, I believe that you must see how much the base success require and see the duration OR damage based on the base requirement. For example:

    You want to create a fireball it requires at least 2 successes and you will damage according to your Arete successes at a minimum of 4 damage.

    You want to become invisible (personal effect) than base successe is 1 (?) and you will be invisible for at least a turn. If you get 3 successes on the Arete roll you become invisible for a day.
    Correct me if I'm wrong.

    Now, it is stated that the optional rules only comes into play when you want to have damage AND duration in the same effect. So I have two questions:

    1)If you want to make a force shield that negates 4 damage successes you need 2 successes (using the damage table). The duration will be a scene (2 successes), since there is no damage and duration and the optional rule ins't being used. We could use another example like: buffing attributes with Life sphere. Getting 2 successes could give Str +2 for a scene. Is that right?

    2)I just read HDYDT and in page 37 we have an example of a wall of ice that deals 6 lvls of damage everytime someone touches it, for a day, requiring 6 successes, "adding up" the damage and the duration table. If this can be done, when the hell would the optional rulehave to be used? Is it completelly optional?

    Bonus question: M20 pg 538 have an example of damage over time, but it isn't explained well. Is the damage dealt the same for every interval until it is over? How much damage will be dealt every interval? And what if the mage wants to damage every turn?

  • #2
    You're quite right regarding the two rules!
    When not using the Dividing Successes rule, it's the total amount of successes that counts for every aspect of the spell, and the minimum you need to roll depends on the (rather flexible) base successes table.
    The Optional Dividing rule is pretty much what was the actual default rule in Mage Revised for the everything - and it turned even smaller feats at times into repeated extended rolls and rituals, especially for low Arete characters.

    That said, yes, there are cases where you need to use the (not-so)Optional Dividing Successes Rule - as you said, when making an effect with damage *and* duration.

    Now, for the answers:
    1) Yes, that's pretty much how I read the normal rule and would handle things. It has the side effect of making more powerful effects also last longer, but I like it because it keeps things simple, and also removes the problem of needing extended rolls for even simple things.

    2) Actually, your example on page 37 *is* using the Dividing Successes rule.
    Consider that normally, those 6 successes would equal 12 damage. And 6 successes would give a duration that is probably damn near permanent. However because the ice-wall effect deals damage *and* has a duration, the example splits up those 6 succeses: 3 successes for the damage (resulting in those 6 damage), and 3 succesess for the duration (resulting in a day).
    The player could instead split up those 6 successes into 2 successes for 4 damage, and the 4 remaining successes for the duration of one story. Or 4 succeses for 8 damage, and a 2-success duration lasting a scene.

    Bonus Answer!
    The full damage gets applied for each interval. However, what the Time-Release damage writeup makes not quite clear is, you need the indicated successes *per interval*
    Example: You want to deal 4 damage each day for 3 days:
    4 damage = 2 successes
    3 days = 6 successes, because each day interval costs 2 successes, and you want 3 day repeats. 2 * 3 -> 6.
    Total: 8 successes.

    A per-turn interval is not explicitely mentioned, probably for balancing reasons...though it's not expliciately forbidden either, so the cost *might* be the same as for the Scene interval. It's totally an ST call wether this is possible or not.
    ...but probably it would be the best for balance *not* to allow this repeated damage on a per-turn basis:
    It would essentially double your damage output in normal combat, for a single additional one-turn interval success (dealing the same damage again next round), which is just overpowered/broken.

    There is no logical in-game reason why it would not work, but for balancing reasons as an ST I'd say 'Sorry, scene intervals or higher please.'. And it's for the better - after all you also probably don't want HIT Marks to have multi-stage warhead ammo in those chainguns aimed at you...
    Last edited by Ambrosia; 05-24-2019, 04:53 AM.


    cWoD Dice Probability Chart ||| cWoD Dice Statistics Calculator ||| cWoD Alternative Armor System
    cWoD Alternative Damage Roll System ||| My explanation of cWoD Damage Levels ||| 'Interesting' Strength Attribute Stuff
    EXPLOSIVE cWoD STUFF! ||| How Technocrats don't think they are Mages

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Ambrosia View Post
      2) Actually, your example on page 37 *is* using the Dividing Successes rule.
      Consider that normally, those 6 successes would equal 12 damage. And 6 successes would give a duration that is probably damn near permanent. However because the ice-wall effect deals damage *and* has a duration, the example splits up those 6 succeses: 3 successes for the damage (resulting in those 6 damage), and 3 succesess for the duration (resulting in a day).
      The player could instead split up those 6 successes into 2 successes for 4 damage, and the 4 remaining successes for the duration of one story. Or 4 succeses for 8 damage, and a 2-success duration lasting a scene.
      Then ther is no base successes requires for creating an ice wall?

      Originally posted by Ambrosia View Post
      Bonus Answer!
      The full damage gets applied for each interval. However, what the Time-Release damage writeup makes not quite clear is, you need the indicated successes *per interval*
      Example: You want to deal 4 damage each day for 3 days:
      4 damage = 2 successes
      3 days = 6 successes, because each day interval costs 2 successes, and you want 3 day repeats. 2 * 3 -> 6.
      Total: 8 successes.

      A per-turn interval is not explicitely mentioned, probably for balancing reasons...though it's not expliciately forbidden either, so the cost *might* be the same as for the Scene interval. It's totally an ST call wether this is possible or not.
      ...but probably it would be the best for balance *not* to allow this repeated damage on a per-turn basis:
      It would essentially double your damage output in normal combat, for a single additional one-turn interval success (dealing the same damage again next round), which is just overpowered/broken.

      There is no logical in-game reason why it would not work, but for balancing reasons as an ST I'd say 'Sorry, scene intervals or higher please.'. And it's for the better - after all you also probably don't want HIT Marks to have multi-stage warhead ammo in those chainguns aimed at you...
      That makes sense. I was thinking about a pool of damage, but that wouldn't work nice..

      Comment

      Working...
      X