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  • Wolfgar
    started a topic Changing vampires into lawn furniture

    Changing vampires into lawn furniture

    So this was just posted on Facebook:

    The Notorious Vampiric Lawn-Chair (••••• Life/ ••••• Matter)
    A feat more spoken of than actually performed (if only because so few mages have Mastered both Life and Matter well enough to enact such radical transformations of both), this legendary spell transforms a dreaded undead entity into domestic furnishings. Variations include soap-bubbles, trees, household pets, and – in one infamous urban legend – a bag of flaming poo. Despite such rumors, though, the realities involved in this sort of metamorphosis make the idea more theoretical than practical.
    According to rumors, both Caeron Mustai and his arch-rival Porthos Fitz-Empress had several pieces of Kindred kindling in their studies, although this seems unlikely, given the risk of said furniture turning back into vampires at inopportune times. Certain vampires have claimed – rightly or wrongly – that mages turned them into chairs and other inanimate objects… typically using that claim to justify the nightmarish fates they inflicted upon those mages afterward. It was speculated that the Massasa Wars were sparked by such disgraceful transformations… and in at least one verified case, that speculation is true. The vengeance worked upon the Hermetic Master in question – who dared to turn a flesh-crafting Tzimisce into a commode – remains an object-lesson for mages with more skill than sense. According to all accounts, he’ll be screaming for a long, long time…
    ___________________
    By popular demand, yes, this rote is in Mage: The Ascension 20th Anniversary Edition.
    The Systems, section - which I am not posting here (you'll have to see it when the book comes out) - points out all the things that make this an EXTREMELY difficult spell to cast successfully, along with the hideous results of doing so UNsuccessfully.
    Enjoy!
    Of course it's included as a joke, but i thought I'd go ahead and comment anyway.

    Sphere-wise, I don't think it should be this difficult. The Life Requirement is just about right - for ease of use, treating Vampires as Life Patterns seems to be a step in the right direction.The MAtter requirement seems off though. 5? Really? We aren't turning a vampire into anti-matter or neutronium. It's a lawn chair. Now if it's a folding type that's pictured on the Facebook post, that might be Matter 4, as that would require moving parts. If it's a simple plastic chair though, that shouldn't require more than Matter 2.

    The bigger question of course is what paradigm allows for turning vampires into furniture, and the answer is likely none. Turn them into stone, turn them into a pillar of salt, turn them into a frog, maybe...no chairs.

    Personally I think for transformation magic, the target should get the benefit of lethal soak. HERO system points out that transforming someone is roughly analogous to killing them...a vampire turned into an earthworm is just as little a threat as one turned to ash.

    Finally, vampires have a natural tendency to revert back to there prior state every evening, so i think any such effect would have to include some sort of Time, Entropy, or similar effect to suppress that. Otherwise your lawn furniture rises as dusk as the blood-drinking undead, and that is just really inconvenient.

  • BC001
    replied
    Originally posted by Captain Aeon View Post
    On convincing the Consensus -- the Hermetics have been infiltrating schools (usually universities, but sometimes they aim younger) for centuries, and the Etherites have actually mostly won a few of the scientific battles (specifically, quantum physics and dark matter/energy). This isn't a focus in most campaigns because players usually want some adventurin' in their gaming, even in Mage, but it's in there.
    True, and even when it is the focus concept-wise of a campaign most of what actually happens “live” in the sessions tends to be the action/mystery/adventure stuff that surrounds it rather than the “education” part itself which tends to be "off camera" with other defining but not exactly thrilling stuff.

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  • The Hanged Man
    replied
    Originally posted by Captain Aeon View Post
    On convincing the Consensus -- the Hermetics have been infiltrating schools (usually universities, but sometimes they aim younger) for centuries, and the Etherites have actually mostly won a few of the scientific battles (specifically, quantum physics and dark matter/energy). This isn't a focus in most campaigns because players usually want some adventurin' in their gaming, even in Mage, but it's in there.
    One of the best Hermetic PCs I ever saw was the Cool History Teacher who sponsors the High School D&D club, and uses it as a way to scout potential acolytes with an interest in the occult and a good head for intricate minutia.

    Anyone who takes the premise of a Jack Chick cartoon and makes it a viable protagonist gets a big thumbs up from me.

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  • Thebian
    replied

    Originally posted by Ajax View Post
    Ya know, now I've been reading this, I just don't think I've ever run, been in or seen a Mage game where any character, NPC or PC, actually acted like an Awakening Guardian of the Veil and sat around spinning webs of influence over the Consensus by tucking bits and pieces of their Truth away into the various little niche sub-cultures. Has anyone else? We've always been doing mage-y stuff.
    It was an on-going concern of a SoE in my game. He spent a lot of time trying to insert "hard-light" remote hologram projection into the Consensus. Scientific papers, press conferences, etc. Very interesting.

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  • Solomon Black
    replied
    Originally posted by Ramnesis View Post
    Honestly, turning a Vampire into a lawn chair always seemed like an Etherite thing to me anyways. It's just the right shade of batshit.
    You make a solid point point....

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  • Papa Bear
    replied
    Originally posted by Ajax View Post


    We've HAD NWO characters and they were still more concerned with keeping a lid on the crap that was going down than in "edjumicatin'" the masses.
    But for the NWO, that IS how they want to educate the masses. "Nothing to see here, no such thing as magic, move along......"

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  • Captain Aeon
    replied
    On convincing the Consensus -- the Hermetics have been infiltrating schools (usually universities, but sometimes they aim younger) for centuries, and the Etherites have actually mostly won a few of the scientific battles (specifically, quantum physics and dark matter/energy). This isn't a focus in most campaigns because players usually want some adventurin' in their gaming, even in Mage, but it's in there.

    Leave a comment:


  • Ajax
    replied
    Originally posted by Papa Bear View Post





    Yeah, in Ascension, that's really the Technocracy's schtick of getting their stuff into the mainstream by placing the info in the right place. There's a reason the NWO's new Sphere is Data.



    We've HAD NWO characters and they were still more concerned with keeping a lid on the crap that was going down than in "edjumicatin'" the masses.

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  • Papa Bear
    replied
    Originally posted by Ramnesis View Post
    Honestly, turning a Vampire into a lawn chair always seemed like an Etherite thing to me anyways. It's just the right shade of batshit.
    Y'know, the only time I tried to transmogrify a vampire into anything, I was playing an Etherite........of course, I wasn't going for lawnchair, I was going for human.......but yeah, it takes a special kind of sadistic or crazy to do that.

    Originally posted by Ajax View Post
    Ya know, now I've been reading this, I just don't think I've ever run, been in or seen a Mage game where any character, NPC or PC, actually acted like an Awakening Guardian of the Veil and sat around spinning webs of influence over the Consensus by tucking bits and pieces of their Truth away into the various little niche sub-cultures. Has anyone else? We've always been doing mage-y stuff.
    Yeah, in Ascension, that's really the Technocracy's schtick of getting their stuff into the mainstream by placing the info in the right place. There's a reason the NWO's new Sphere is Data.

    Originally posted by Captain Aeon View Post
    The Verbenae as a whole have accepted (in some cases, very reluctantly) modern neo-pagans and Wiccans, because that's where the metaphysical action is. The Verbenae's roots are in exactly the sorts of classic polytheistic small-t traditions you speak of*, and I suspect that a majority of the (centuries-)old guard would rather support your sort of serious recreationism than my New Agey goddess faith. And even if they're not the majority, there's definitely a deep, powerful strain of upholding those ancient traditions there.

    *They probably share the Egyptian reconstructionism with the Hermetics' House Shaea.
    I think the Khemetics would still land in the Hermetic realm. One of the places the Verbena, Dreamspeakers and Cult of Ecstacy start to get muddled up together is in that "from the gut/heart" approach where it's more about the right feelings than anything else. Once you start getting into writing the stuff down and making it a formal ritual, it starts to get back to that area of magic that can be studied and experimented with, which is where the Hermetics take over.

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  • Ramnesis
    replied
    Honestly, turning a Vampire into a lawn chair always seemed like an Etherite thing to me anyways. It's just the right shade of batshit.

    Leave a comment:


  • The Hanged Man
    replied
    Originally posted by Captain Aeon View Post
    The joke is based on the fandom, not Hermetics. Vampire-to-lawnchair dates back to 1e wisecracks about the sorts of insane stuff Masters can get up to. Hermetics probably got the rote because they've got the biggest reason to want to transmogrify Kindred (c.f. House/Clan Tremere).

    EDIT: BTW, this is first draft stuff. Satyros probably threw in a bunch of the setting stuff for fun, and given how tight the word count is it'll probably be trimmed down considerably, if the rote isn't outright exiled to one of the Big Books of Extra Goodies.
    I'm aware of the source of the joke. I've been here (for a value of Here that includes several forum changes) since First Edition. And if I didn't think crap like that wasn't still subject to being revised or cut entirely, I wouldn't be talking still. I'd be withdrawing my pledge.

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  • Captain Aeon
    replied
    Originally posted by The Hanged Man View Post
    I agree that it's a joke - a particularly weak one at that. When there's such a tremendous wealth of excellent source material that won't make the cut, I don't see why any word count at all should be wasted telling weak jokes about how many Hermetics it takes to accidentally kill themselves with paradox and vampire bombs
    The joke is based on the fandom, not Hermetics. Vampire-to-lawnchair dates back to 1e wisecracks about the sorts of insane stuff Masters can get up to. Hermetics probably got the rote because they've got the biggest reason to want to transmogrify Kindred (c.f. House/Clan Tremere).

    EDIT: BTW, this is first draft stuff. Satyros probably threw in a bunch of the setting stuff for fun, and given how tight the word count is it'll probably be trimmed down considerably, if the rote isn't outright exiled to one of the Big Books of Extra Goodies.
    Last edited by Captain Aeon; 03-28-2014, 02:18 AM. Reason: Thought of a second point at the last moment

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  • The Hanged Man
    replied
    Originally posted by Wolfgar View Post
    Aye, the write-up is meant to be a joke, not a canonical statement about any of the major NPCs.
    I agree that it's a joke - a particularly weak one at that. When there's such a tremendous wealth of excellent source material that won't make the cut, I don't see why any word count at all should be wasted telling weak jokes about how many Hermetics it takes to accidentally kill themselves with paradox and vampire bombs*

    It was a very consistent trend in post-Revised Mage books to portray the Order of Hermes only as clowns and failures, but Jess Heinig used to swear up and down that they were his favorite tradition too. So frankly I don't care what Mr. Brucato says about Porthos. The only thing that matters is the words that wind up on the pages of this book, and these words aren't good enough.

    * - ONE. BECAUSE HUBRIS IS A MAJOR THEME FOR HERMETICS.

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  • Wolfgar
    replied
    Aye, the write-up is meant to be a joke, not a canonical statement about any of the major NPCs.

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  • Chase Variant
    replied
    Originally posted by The Hanged Man View Post
    I have a problem with individual Hermetics always being presented only as idiots. If a Hermetic is mentioned in the text, it is to be an example of someone being a fucking imbecile. When Porthos Fitz-Empress and Caeron Mustai are called out in this Rote Text, it is to say, "Look at these ignorant chuckleheads, wasting their vast cosmic power in such a foolish and risky manner. Wow, HUBRIS am I right? HUBRIS, as you may have heard, IS A MAJOR THEME FOR HERMETICS. It's so vital to their portrayal that it robs them of any other positive mental characteristics, every time it is invoked. HUBRIS. HUUUUBRISSSS."

    Why would Porthos Fitz-Empress transmute vampires into firewood and keep them around his house? He is not stupid. He is a Hermetic Archmaster. He understands things like spell durations and the inherent magic resistance that most supernatural creatures possess. He is busy (before he died anyway) trying to encourage and assist the rising generation of mages. He is very focused on his goals, and having a bunch of vampire bombs by his fireplace doesn't do much to forward his agenda. So why would he put a trap like that for himself into his house? He wouldn't. Because Porthos Fitz-Empress is a lot of things, but he is not an idiot.
    As Satyr has commented several times about how much he identified with Porthos and how the character became his mouthpiece, I seriously doubt that the rote writeup is intended to present Porthos as an idiot.

    http://satyrosphilbrucato.wordpress....-fragile-path/
    Last edited by Chase Variant; 03-27-2014, 11:49 PM. Reason: Added link.

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