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  • g3taso
    started a topic Vampire Services to Provide

    Vampire Services to Provide

    Neonates and ancilla have little prospect for wielding power in Cainite society. However, that does not mean they are powerless. Enterprising young Licks want to be useful to their elders, whether for want of cash or even mere recognition. So what services do your less powerful vampires offer their sect members? I'd love to see your ideas, perhaps a paragraph detailing how you make your little cainites stand out?

    My idea is the Blood Factory, which I posted in an embryonic form previously.
    The Blood Factory is a discreet service, providing vitae to those who desire it. It consists of the Technician and Broker, Bound mortals who respectively harvest and negotiate the vitae provided by the Vessel while never meeting each other directly. The Vessel is a thin-blood, sired originally from some unfortunate, made a paraplegic and psychically lobotomized prior to Embrace. The goods are delivered by a company well-compensated for discreet deliveries at night, and like the Broker are cutouts, unable to provide useful information even via Auspex. The Company understands the value their patrons place on privacy and therefore employees enjoy freedom from harm or intimidation.

    I like this one because it provides a service to exactly those vampires you want to recognize you (and approve of you), and no Prince is so gracious a host they want a visiting elder to take a bite out of their childer for a night, let alone several. Everything is discreet. The player might make his ownership known, or keep it anonymous.
    Last edited by g3taso; 11-14-2017, 04:32 PM.

  • Nosimplehiway
    replied
    Apparent Age Appropriate Pop Culture Consultant

    Are you a 300 year old elder who looks 16, but have absolutely no idea what a learner's permit is, or how a human could throw shade without being a Lasombra ghoul? Were you born in 1847, look like you were born in 1947, and don't know whether a real-seeming 60 year old woman should wear a floral mumu, a plaid double-knit suit, or puddle jumpers and a shell top? Do you look 25, but are still humming those great old tunes from the Lawrence Welk Show?

    Well, then Generational Experience Trainers, Inc., is the only night-person oriented trend consultant you need!

    Other services say they will keep you up to date on current trends, but focus solely on the young, in-the-know humans of today! But, that tired old way of teaching assimilation into modern, human culture is a has-been!

    Here at G.E.T. Inc., we understand that in tonight's fast-paced popular culture, different images are appropriate depending on the generation you appear to be. So, we tailor our consultation service to providing you with a believable set of tastes in music, clothing, popular culture preferences, speech patterns, and personal grooming habits. All personally tailored to the demographic of the role you choose to project in human society!

    For those Kindred who wish to go the extra mile, we offer advanced classes in "What Does It Mean When Someone Says: I'm, like, You Know, Spiritual, but Not Religious", "I'm a Widow, but Optimistically Hoping To Build A New Life In A New Town!", and, our most popular course this year: "Daria 101: The Vocal Fry, or Are You Boring Them, or Did They Just Take Too Much Cold Medicine?"

    Call us tonight, and let G.E.T., Inc., make your masquerade... generation-proof!

    Leave a comment:


  • Thoth
    replied
    Originally posted by g3taso View Post
    I don't agree, because I hear your concerns but don't think any of them are insurmountable. Your concern about sleeper agents is reasonable, but Auspex (or Dominate) can detect those and of course if you got a "trick" ghoul like that you would be sure that "vendor" would have a suntan quickly.
    ​Dominate doesn't inherently detect other peoples use of Dominate, and Auspex requires rank 4 to detect Dominate and even then you have to spend a great deal of time searching through the persons brain looking for it.
    Also just because there is a Dominate Command in place, it doesn't mean that the Elder would understand what it means. For instance if part of a minions training was computer related and the Dominate command was to always keep your programs updated, that in and of itself isn't harmful or treacherous, though if that updating process just happens to reliably activate a virus that transmits all the relevant data back to the trainer without the subjects knowledge, then finding that command doesn't mean anything.
    ​Lastly let us look at the clans with those Disciplines and see how they would deal with concept of outsourcing Training. There are four main clans with Dominate and 4 clans with Auspex as in-clan disciplines, though one clan has both.

    Ventrue / ​Giovanni / Lasombra have Dominate
    Tremere - Dominate & Auspex
    Malkavian / Toreador / Tzimisce have Auspex

    ​With the exception of the Malkavians and the Toreador, all of these clans are relatively self contained. The Cainites are expected to either locate pre-trained minions or train them personally, thus negating the usefulness of a professional trainer. Everyone else lacks the inclan disciplines to detect sleeper agents, which means they would be too concerned with letting some one else handle training if they wanted a minion.
    ​I mean the Giovanni clan are related by blood twice and the fluff still says that the elders swap around who gets embraced by whom to ensure that no one can build too much of a trusted power base. This makes the concept of outsourcing anything to different clan seem highly unlikely.
    ​You could make an argument for a professional trainer that is inside a given clan and only deals with that clan. But then you start running into the issues of how many minions are really going to need to be trained at any given time.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kammerer
    replied
    Originally posted by g3taso View Post


    I don't agree, because I hear your concerns but don't think any of them are insurmountable. Your concern about sleeper agents is reasonable, but Auspex (or Dominate) can detect those and of course if you got a "trick" ghoul like that you would be sure that "vendor" would have a suntan quickly.

    Concerning a school of specialists, I think not. We have mortals for that, and we call them recruiters. Hire a company to provide you with candidates, with hidden preference given to those without family. It's better than human trafficking because you can offer them money to move out and start their new job and they traffick themselves into ghouled slavery.

    Your final point about more rapid training is a good one. I like blowing away willpower with Presence (with Dominate to keep doing it) until they are silly putty. Then make your Dom4 roll against a single die. At even 5 successes per roll you will own them body and soul amazingly fast, and with them unable to even resist you can make those rolls much faster as well.
    My main concern with this would be the demand. Ghouls are immortal, so in your normal not very violent city you'd satisfy all your customers within a decade. And just how many groomed slaves could a vampire possibly need? Dracula just had Renfield, and Renfield's qualifications were being british and selling real estate.

    Leave a comment:


  • Nyrufa
    replied
    A former detective who had little choice but to resign from the force after their embrace into clan Gangrel. Fortunately, their new job as a private investigator allows them to dictate their own work hours, while still making use of their investigative tracking skills.


    A Tzimisce antitribu who sells their flesh crafting talents to those who have violated the masquerade. By assigning them with new identities, their clients have a chance to avoid punishment from both mortal and kindred authorities.


    A Bruja who serves as a public relations manager for high ranking kindred. Their passionate speeches and liberal use of Presence makes them an ideal spokesperson for those trying to maintain a good reputation among elders and neonates alike.

    Leave a comment:


  • Black Fox
    replied
    Originally posted by Kammerer View Post
    And, allegedly, instantly murdered by Tremere/Giovanni ninjas for practicing blood magic without being a licensed union member a clan member.
    But as I explained, Blood Magic isn't needed and these people don't have it. They are just knowledgeable about the occult. You can put Wards and Forbiddances against Wraiths by just expending Willpower and actually believing the old wives tales that certain things protect you from ghosts. You don't need Disciplines, Paths, or Rituals. Likewise a lot of defenses against Lupines are rather well known and also don't require Blood Magic.

    The idea that Tremere actively go out and kill anyone with Thaumaturgy just isn't true. There is just too much out there. If this is their policy, they are incredibly bad at it. I have no problem believing that there are unique to Tremere secrets including certain Paths, and that the Tremere try to protect those by destroying the vampires who betrayed or violated them, but general occult knowledge does not qualify for that. (And at this point, there are even whole Paths and Rites that should be considered general knowledge).

    Leave a comment:


  • g3taso
    replied
    Originally posted by Thoth View Post
    I thought about suggesting a "training school" concept as well, but it really falls apart when you view it through the lens of vampire society.

    ​Out sourcing your minion training, especially if Dominate and Presence is involved basically means you are begging for sleeper agents to be given to you. Also the skillset a servant would need to be a useful servant differs greatly between the clans.

    ​You would need an entire school of specialists to cover all the possible skillsets that could crop up as requests. You would need an entire paramilitary training facility since lots of vampires want combat minions, you would need almost an entire brothel to cover the techniques and kinks that a given servant would need to be competent at to please just the relatively "vanilla" tastes of most vampires (I really don't want to think about the training for Tzimices or Malk minions...), you would need what amounts to a business school and a law school so that the minion would be useful at economic tasks.

    ​If there was some form of mechanic that allowed rapid training, this would be more viable, but unless you ghoul these minions to halt aging, they will be in their late 30s or early 40s before they can complete their "training".

    ​Don't get me wrong, there is a lot of potential for stories with this sort of setup, but you would have to either ignore the setting or make some adjustments to make things more lore friendly. I think the best way to make this work is not that you outsource the training, but the talent scouting. By this I would say a vampire could keep their eyes out in certain institutions for mortals with already existing skillsets and preferences, and then contact a given vampire with the information as a potential buyer.

    I don't agree, because I hear your concerns but don't think any of them are insurmountable. Your concern about sleeper agents is reasonable, but Auspex (or Dominate) can detect those and of course if you got a "trick" ghoul like that you would be sure that "vendor" would have a suntan quickly.

    Concerning a school of specialists, I think not. We have mortals for that, and we call them recruiters. Hire a company to provide you with candidates, with hidden preference given to those without family. It's better than human trafficking because you can offer them money to move out and start their new job and they traffick themselves into ghouled slavery.

    Your final point about more rapid training is a good one. I like blowing away willpower with Presence (with Dominate to keep doing it) until they are silly putty. Then make your Dom4 roll against a single die. At even 5 successes per roll you will own them body and soul amazingly fast, and with them unable to even resist you can make those rolls much faster as well.

    Leave a comment:


  • g3taso
    replied
    Originally posted by Murdoc View Post
    I think that this fits in at about a 1 on the Hierarchy of Sins, so I don't see this flying in the Camarilla. Maybe a Lasombra business?


    Another idea is body disposal and clean-up. This could be as little as a guy with Potence who comes and picks up the body (from an unfortunate accident from feeding, frenzy, or combat), to a big operation including scrubbing the scene clean of blood and other evidence (possibly with a forensic expert on staff), dealing with witnesses (most likely with Dominate), and computer hackers and/or ghouls in police and/or news companies to deal with evidence and reports already collected (street, traffic, and ATM-cams, even cell phones). This would be huge in a Camarilla town, and run by a Ventrue could be quite lucrative. For those poor licks that can't afford your services, well, that's what prestation is for. The more they screw up, the more you own them, all while making yourself look awesome to the elders.
    #1: The business is discreetly providing vitae, not how it's made. The clients don't deal with that.
    #2: We have that! We call it MurderVans. Got the idea from John Wick.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bluecho
    replied
    Originally posted by Black Fox View Post
    Providing services to the elders is pretty the job description of Neonates in a Camarilla society. They are there to be the crucial link between vampires and humans, just as ancillae serve as middle management over neonates on behalf of the elders. I imagine the most typical services Neonates can provide would be:

    1) Collection of blood for other vampires to safely feed on. This could be either "cold" blood already removed from bodies or "warm" blood of still living humans. People who are in contact with animals, slaughterhouses, blood banks, or control living people as herds through club goers, drug addicts in a slum house, or anywhere people are effectively trapped.
    I like the idea of a character who goes around buying blood from people, while claiming to her "customers" that she's doing it for black market medical procedures. Since plenty of folks would willingly sell their blood for even a little scratch, I can see it being productive. And since it's not actually going anywhere except down a vampire's gullet, there's less of a chance it might be noticed by the feds, who likely have people planted in organized crime, looking for black market suppliers. Sure, the feds will still have a chance of finding her from the supply side, which creates a risk-reward element to her operations. Still, the elders need to feed.


    6) Occult service providers who could assist vampires who have problems with odd things like ghosts, lupines, sorcerers, fomori, and other strange phenomenon. Blood magic isn't always needed to help vampires in such situations, and someone who could do so who is not Tremere or Giovanni would be in demand. You just need lots of knowledge, Willpower, and perhaps some odd artifacts.
    With this, I'm imagining an occult general practitioner. Max 1 or 2 dots in blood magic (if any at all, which is not even necessary), the character instead focuses on getting a broad base of knowledge in Occult and various Lore specialties. They aren't a specialist, nor are they likely part of an organized (and therefore maligned) vampiric group, like the Tremere and Giovanni. As such, Kindred will prefer to go to them first if they have a spooky problem. No one wants to go begging the Tremere or the Giovanni for a favor, unless it's absolutely necessary. Necessity, ergo, is what the general practitioner seeks to determine. They investigate the problem, do some research. Solve the problem if possible - it might just be a matter of moving a ghost's Fetter or putting a monster down.

    If not possible, they will hopefully understand the problem enough that they can recommend more qualified help. The elder might grumble, but it's helpful to know that you HAVE to get the warlocks or the necromancers involved. I also imagine that such a kindred might also make contacts with specialists not associated with the major Clans, like Anarch sorcerers or a wandering Nagaraja. Someone who can help the client solve their issue in a more private fashion. Of course, getting supposedly "disreputable" Cainites involved can reflect badly on the general practitioner. So, tread lightly.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kammerer
    replied
    Originally posted by Black Fox View Post
    6) Occult service providers who could assist vampires who have problems with odd things like ghosts, lupines, sorcerers, fomori, and other strange phenomenon. Blood magic isn't always needed to help vampires in such situations, and someone who could do so who is not Tremere or Giovanni would be in demand. You just need lots of knowledge, Willpower, and perhaps some odd artifacts.
    And, allegedly, instantly murdered by Tremere/Giovanni ninjas for practicing blood magic without being a licensed union member a clan member.

    Leave a comment:


  • Black Fox
    replied
    Providing services to the elders is pretty the job description of Neonates in a Camarilla society. They are there to be the crucial link between vampires and humans, just as ancillae serve as middle management over neonates on behalf of the elders. I imagine the most typical services Neonates can provide would be:

    1) Collection of blood for other vampires to safely feed on. This could be either "cold" blood already removed from bodies or "warm" blood of still living humans. People who are in contact with animals, slaughterhouses, blood banks, or control living people as herds through club goers, drug addicts in a slum house, or anywhere people are effectively trapped.

    2) Someone who can provide alternate identities and the paperwork that goes with it. That is needed by any new vampire needing to start over a new identity, ancillae and elders who need to migrate through new personas every few decades, or people who just need cover identities for a specific job.

    3) Running a "school" of ghouls or other servants where loyal retainers can learn various skills that will be needed by their masters. Such a school might also provide such Conditioned servants to others for a price. Although the person who does this will need to have a stellar reputation since the danger of them putting Dominate or other means of control over such servants is significant.

    4) Security experts who can assist people in reducing their vulnerability in their havens. Essentially someone who keeps us his expertise and able to sub-contract out jobs as needed. Again, such a person needs to have a great reputation or other means to protect confidentiality.

    5) Transportation and hospitality expert. Vampires sometimes need to travel long distance and need their safety needs met. Somebody who can make such travel arrangements would be prized, especially for those events that see lots of vampires travel somewhere for an important meeting - Conclaves, Toreador salons, Ventrue board meetings.

    6) Occult service providers who could assist vampires who have problems with odd things like ghosts, lupines, sorcerers, fomori, and other strange phenomenon. Blood magic isn't always needed to help vampires in such situations, and someone who could do so who is not Tremere or Giovanni would be in demand. You just need lots of knowledge, Willpower, and perhaps some odd artifacts.

    7) Someone who can provide legal services represent other Kindred at court or elsewhere during the day. Such lawyers would need to be in the know of the Masquerade in order to properly serve other vampires, but retain enough free will in order to do their job properly. Some of this may be someone who has influence in the bureaucracy or other authorities, or it may just be ordinary legal representation to make sure that anarch thug is released from police custody quick enough so they can reach their haven before daytime.

    Leave a comment:


  • Nyrufa
    replied
    Originally posted by Nosimplehiway View Post
    I've often wondered what happens to all those Sabbat shovel-heads who don't make it out of the ground.

    What if someone goes around, digs them up, and re-sells them for the benefit of elders with Methuselah's Thirst? For those elders who cling to the more humane paths it has the added feature of not exactly causing someone's death, so much as putting them out of their misery.


    From what I've been told, the Sabbat just kills them for being a bunch of pathetic weaklings.

    Leave a comment:


  • Nosimplehiway
    replied
    I've often wondered what happens to all those Sabbat shovel-heads who don't make it out of the ground.

    What if someone goes around, digs them up, and re-sells them for the benefit of elders with Methuselah's Thirst? For those elders who cling to the more humane paths it has the added feature of not exactly causing someone's death, so much as putting them out of their misery.

    Leave a comment:


  • jamiemalk
    replied
    Originally posted by Thoth View Post
    ​If there was some form of mechanic that allowed rapid training, this would be more viable, but unless you ghoul these minions to halt aging, they will be in their late 30s or early 40s before they can complete their "training".
    Like Instruction?

    http://reference.l2fury.com/index.php/Instruction

    Leave a comment:


  • Nyrufa
    replied
    Originally posted by Thoth View Post
    (I really don't want to think about the training for Tzimices or Malk minions...),

    Puzzle solving and riddle games for Malks, so that they can comprehend their master's orders.


    Arts and Crafts + Med School for Tzimisce, so they can appreciate their master's work.


    -----------------------------------------------


    A brothel who's 'employees' consists of blood dolls, providing the kindred of the city with a supply of willing vessels. No, the manager does not have a third eye in their forehead... You probably just saw a really convincing tattoo!

    Leave a comment:

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