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Caine is the Eater-of-souls (and Set is an avatar of the Defiler)

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  • Caine is the Eater-of-souls (and Set is an avatar of the Defiler)

    I wasn't sure to post this in the Vampire subforum, because it deals with both VtM and WtA.
    I was reading the Apocalypse sourcebook for Werewolf, and i stumbled across some shocking words: "The Eater-of-Souls, known by somebody as Caine"
    That would explain lots of stuff, including why vampires must drain blood to survive (the Eater-of-souls "preaches" cannibalism), why they are detected as wyrm-tainted more easily if they have commited Diablerie, and why they aren't detected as wyrm-tainted at all if their humanity is 6 or higher. In fact, the Croatan sacrificed themselves to push Caine back.
    But I also though a thing: in "Lore of The Clans", the "Aura of Typhon" flaw makes the setite who gets it to be, in fact, wyrm-tainted (more than usual, lol), as the Garou wil try everything to slay him. My initial thought was that Set was another member of the Triat, the Defiler Wyrm, but I think he could be more easily an avatar of the Defiler. After all, the setites always stated that he already was as powerful as a god before the embrace, and that might also explain why the Setites are universally known as defilers.


    My English sucks. Sorry.

  • #2
    The triatic wyrm is much older than Caine and the antediluvian, it goes back to a time where no humans was on Earth. Never the less the Antediluvian are for sure one of the mightiest manifestation of the Wyrm on Earth, at least on pair with a Maeljin Incarna.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Undead rabbit View Post
      The triatic wyrm is much older than Caine and the antediluvian, it goes back to a time where no humans was on Earth. Never the less the Antediluvian are for sure one of the mightiest manifestation of the Wyrm on Earth, at least on pair with a Maeljin Incarna.
      But apocalypse states that Caine is the eater-of-souls


      My English sucks. Sorry.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by ToreadorGentleman View Post

        But apocalypse states that Caine is the eater-of-souls
        It's really more of a suggestion that you could use. The games don't lean or rely on each other nearly to that extent, and there's another explanation for a Caine-like first vampire figure given in the Silver Record, The Bloody Man, who is more of a tainted Weaver work..

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        • #5
          (sorry but where in the book is it said that Caine is the Eater of souls? I can't find it)

          It would not be the first book that says that Caine is a big thing even in other setting (in Mage Caine is the first mage ever,and the killing of Abel was the first act of will that lead to Paradox), but i'd like to check.

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          • #6
            If you operate under he theory that the Wyrm getting trapped in the Weaver’s webs corresponds to the Neolithic Agricultural Revolution, that in turn corresponds nicely with Caine (the settled Farmer) slaying Abel (the nomadic shepherd), which of course corresponds well with Mage cosmology and the severance of Telos by the First Murder (Telos corresponding to the natural cycle of life and death where Man is part of nature as opposed to willworjing over it).


            Check out my expansion to the Realm of Brass and Shadow

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Undead rabbit View Post
              (sorry but where in the book is it said that Caine is the Eater of souls? I can't find it)

              It would not be the first book that says that Caine is a big thing even in other setting (in Mage Caine is the first mage ever,and the killing of Abel was the first act of will that lead to Paradox), but i'd like to check.
              Page 32. It's a throwaway line, though; nothing really supported it to any degree of meaningful substance in the whole of the line, and it also precedes a passage where it suggests the possibility of using vampires as throwaway shock troops. You probably wouldn't find it as interesting or curious as you seem to think it would be.

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              • #8
                The different splats of the oWoD are not 100% compatible with each other. It's like they all exist in slightly different parallel universes, with a lot of overlap, but not the same.
                As such the werewolves in the V20 book are not the same as the Garou. The vampires in the W20 books are not Kindred, etc. Not entirely at least.

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