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Aggravated Damage with Firearms

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  • Aggravated Damage with Firearms

    Are there any RAW options to do aggravated damage with firearms to vampires?

  • #2
    Dragonbreath ammo I guess?

    We usually play very big caliber (like "small" anti-tank caliber) as aggravated damage in our games but I don't think there's anything about that in RAW.

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    • #3
      Aside from Dragonbreath ammo, I don't think there's any RAW VtM rules for that sort of thing (at least insofar as Revised is concerned*1). I think the Technocracy had access (in MtA Revised) to special ammunition that caused Aggravated Damage to vampires, but I don't know if that crossed over into M20. Think: high-tech tracer rounds from the first Underworld film.

      *1 - I'm not familiar with V20 (or M20 for that matter)


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      (Also known as "Derpwraith" and "PretentiousFontsGuy
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      • #4
        And where do i find the rules for Dragonbreath ammo?

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        • #5
          Incendiary ammunition in general can but you will need to pierce the flesh first unless you are using a high caliber
          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incendiary_ammunition

          You can also use things like molotovs or incendiary grenades made with white phosforus the problem is that this will raise the atention of the mortal autorities risking the masquerade.

          Also going by raw not my rules there is a combo discipline (Protean + visicitude) that allows you to make weapons that deal aggravated , maybe you can use this to make agg bullets.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Nazfool View Post
            Aside from Dragonbreath ammo, I don't think there's any RAW VtM rules for that sort of thing (at least insofar as Revised is concerned*1). I think the Technocracy had access (in MtA Revised) to special ammunition that caused Aggravated Damage to vampires, but I don't know if that crossed over into M20. Think: high-tech tracer rounds from the first Underworld film.

            *1 - I'm not familiar with V20 (or M20 for that matter)
            Ectoplasmic Rounds have made the jump to M20, appearing in The Book of Secrets, page 162! They deal aggravated damage to vampires, werewolves and ghosts, and come in a wide variety of calibers to work with most readily available firearms!

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Aahz View Post
              And where do i find the rules for Dragonbreath ammo?
              I'm unaware of any RAW notes on dragon's breath rounds, but I feel that you could use the mechanics of Ectoplasmic Rounds and say it does the same damage, just aggravated. You could theoretically say if your character was a talented chemist or something that he's working with white phosphorus and basically allow any firearm to do aggravated like Ectoplasmic Rounds (though only to Kindred, of course).

              However, I think that anything like dragon's breath or phosphorus would need both Target and shooter to roll for Rötshreck, because, well, you're basically holding a thin tube of metal that's barely separating your flesh from something that would instantly reduce you to a pile of ashes.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Aahz View Post
                And where do i find the rules for Dragonbreath ammo?
                I use the Firearms charts in the crossover-friendly World of Darkness: Combat, on pgs. 105-109. Incendiary ammunition in multiple calibers and types is covered, along with some more exotic kinds of ammo (among other things...). Alternatively, a quick and dirty method for approximating Dragon's Breath ammunition, which is more of a "2 seconds of flamethrower in a shotgun shell" situation, is just to make standard damage from a shotgun Aggravated instead of Bashing/Lethal.
                Last edited by AzraelFirestorm; 04-08-2018, 03:23 PM.


                What's with the penguin? https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/borderland

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                • #9
                  The problem with dragons breath is that it is more of a mini-flame thrower or burning shrapnel that is short range. If you are going by real world usage, I would say dragons breath shotgun rounds are more for inducing frenzy or rotshreck than outright damage.

                  A tracer round on the other hand is a bullet that has normal range, but also has a chemical that burns brightly enough to allow you to see where the bullets are going. In news clips or archival battle footage the rule of thumb is that every 5th or so bullet is a tracer, so when you see a string of tracers flying through the air, there are four bullets in between them that you can't see. ​Having a full magazine of Tracer rounds would make for some nasty aggravated damage at range, assuming you got enough penetration to allow the fire to burn the vampire.

                  ​Finally there is good old fashioned explosive bullets. These things tend to penetrate well and explode on the inside of a target, which is a nasty combination. Especially if you combine that style of bullet with a caliber that gives you some options. Shooting a Vampire in the head with a 22 long rifle tracer round really will only do damage based off the tracer part of it, on the other hand if you use a 50 caliber bullet in a sniper rifle from half a mile away and going for a head shot.... well there isn't going to be much a "head" left to take aggravated damage.

                  ​Admittedly I always found it odd that the Assamites didn't make custom 50 caliber rounds that could hold enough of their Quietus augmented blood to qualify for the usage requirements, I mean if all you need is enough to coat the tips of your own fingernails, then a hollow point 50 caliber rifle round could hold ten times that much.

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                  • #10
                    I don’t know dragon’s breath seems like it would jack you up pretty badly, and should do more damage closer to the ballast due to the nature of the ammos fuel.

                    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WwhCygmhbCg


                    It is a time for great deeds!

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Eldagusto View Post
                      I don’t know dragon’s breath seems like it would jack you up pretty badly, and should do more damage closer to the ballast due to the nature of the ammos fuel.

                      https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WwhCygmhbCg
                      Jacked up they shall be, for the close range fire breathing shotgun will make it so.



                      What's with the penguin? https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/borderland

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                      • #12
                        Blimey!!!



                        Also makes me think the books should have released some custom guns made both to hunt draculers as well as made to be used by draculers. Like dragons breath island tracers are just repurposed ammo for vampire hunting. We need some tech literally designed for draculer hunting. As well as extra large guns with plenty of kick made for those with potence/gigantic forms. Vampires shouldn’t have to always settle for mortal weapons when they have the money of the Camarilla, the tech of the Trujah/Assamite Viziers, or sorcerous Alchemy.


                        It is a time for great deeds!

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                        • #13
                          Don't flare guns do Agg? Are there rules for that somewhere?

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by AzraelFirestorm View Post

                            I use the Firearms charts in the crossover-friendly World of Darkness: Combat, on pgs. 105-109. Incendiary ammunition in multiple calibers and types is covered, along with some more exotic kinds of ammo (among other things...).
                            But even there nothing about Agg damage is explicitly mentioned.

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                            • #15
                              Not everyone takes Agg damage or takes it from the same sources.


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