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  • #16
    Given that Chicago is a Cam city, I'll say there's a decent chance the surprise clan in the Cam book will be the Lasombra.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Murder-of-Crows View Post
      Chicago by Night Kickstarter later in 2018, actual book maybe one year later?
      Since White Wolf have taken back the IP, and are contracting a book to be written by Onyx Path: Why are we kickstarting it?
      Surely the IP holder would be paying the producers of a book to, well write the book. And then profit goes to the IP holder?

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Illithid View Post

        Since White Wolf have taken back the IP, and are contracting a book to be written by Onyx Path: Why are we kickstarting it?
        Surely the IP holder would be paying the producers of a book to, well write the book. And then profit goes to the IP holder?
        They probably realised it's a far less risky proposition this way. It makes sense, too, given that OPP has a strong reputation for the nostalgia stuff.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Illithid View Post

          Since White Wolf have taken back the IP, and are contracting a book to be written by Onyx Path: Why are we kickstarting it?
          Surely the IP holder would be paying the producers of a book to, well write the book. And then profit goes to the IP holder?
          '
          Every time we put a book on Kickstarter, we get people asking why we're putting it on Kickstarter.

          First, you have the flow of money backwards: we license from White Wolf, which typically means we pay them to use the IP. That payment could be a flat fee or it could be a percentage of sales, but in any case we're paying them for the license to use the IP. That has always been the case with the relationship between Onyx Path and the White Wolf IP holders.

          Second, like most of our Kickstarters, the book is getting produced regardless of the outcome of the Kickstarter. What KS allows us to do is get a deluxe or prestige edition made, or get a traditional print run into brick-and-mortar stores, which we do not ordinarily have the funds to do.

          Third, depending on the project, stretch goals may also allow the production of ancillary materials: expansions to the book's content, fiction, etc.


          Ian A. A. Watson
          Onyx Path Community Manager
          Trinity Continuum Content Lead

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Nosimplehiway View Post

            V5, p. 63.

            If you're a Giovanni, I guess the upside is that doing your Christmas cards just got a lot easier.
            I guess that means we don't need to worry about the Giovanni break the veil to the land of the dead any time soon. Thats one end of the world event avoided.

            That same page also mention that the tzimisce and Lasombra fall under the shadow of the sabbat. I wonder if this hints at both clans losing status in the Sabbat. Or is it just meant to say both clans are mostly found in the sabbat. We'll have to see.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Nosimplehiway View Post

              V5, p. 63.



              If you're a Giovanni, I guess the upside is that doing your Christmas cards just got a lot easier.
              Ouch!

              The Giovanni are actually my favorite Clan that came after the Original 7 and in my top 5 easily. Bummer....

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Wissenschaft View Post

                I guess that means we don't need to worry about the Giovanni break the veil to the land of the dead any time soon. Thats one end of the world event avoided.

                That same page also mention that the tzimisce and Lasombra fall under the shadow of the sabbat. I wonder if this hints at both clans losing status in the Sabbat. Or is it just meant to say both clans are mostly found in the sabbat. We'll have to see.
                No endless night?... Maybe yes, maybe no.

                There are still some Giovanni left in their urheimat of Venice. Also, Beckett's Jyhad Diary outlined a plan whereby most of the sub-families of the Giovanni would spread out as supposed rivals of the main clan to pursue aims which seem at cross-purposes, but ultimately fit together to achieve the clan's goals. (If I read it correctly, anyway, I kind of glaze-over when necromancers of any sort come onstage, tbh.) If there are a bunch of vampires and ghouls not named Giovanni out gathering souls, and a few very potent Necromancers preparing the ritual, this could just be the final phase of "Project: Proving Valentina Right".

                As for the Lasombra and Tzimisce, the phrase "fall under the shadow of" is too colloquial, poetic, and vague to reach any firm conclusion. It usually implies someone is in imminent, and ominous danger, like a field-mouse "under the shadow" of an owl.

                This makes little sense in context, though. Historically, the Lasombra and Tzimisce, taken together, constitute a majority of all Sabbat, and hold the lion's share of political power to boot.

                The phrase, more broadly, can also imply a bad situation in which one can't see a clear exit strategy. (The aformentioned field-mouse knows he's under a shadow, but direction of flight is uncertain, so it's hard to see how to flee.) This might make sense. With most elders leaving, sect demographic shifts away from the traditional clans of leadership and toward shovel-heads and antitribu would put the remaining Lasombra and Tzimisce in a reduced position. Any sign of disloyalty, however, might trigger the very revolt the leaders fear.

                It could just be an unusually pretentious way of saying "are mostly found within the Sabbat".

                Perhaps most likely -and most frustratingly- it may be a poetic flourish and a red herring. Frankly, it feels like they wanted to leave their options open for later meta-plot decisions, rather than hemming themselves in with anything more specific.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by IanWatson View Post
                  Every time we put a book on Kickstarter, we get people asking why we're putting it on Kickstarter.

                  First, you have the flow of money backwards: we license from White Wolf, which typically means we pay them to use the IP. That payment could be a flat fee or it could be a percentage of sales, but in any case we're paying them for the license to use the IP. That has always been the case with the relationship between Onyx Path and the White Wolf IP holders.

                  Second, like most of our Kickstarters, the book is getting produced regardless of the outcome of the Kickstarter. What KS allows us to do is get a deluxe or prestige edition made, or get a traditional print run into brick-and-mortar stores, which we do not ordinarily have the funds to do.

                  Third, depending on the project, stretch goals may also allow the production of ancillary materials: expansions to the book's content, fiction, etc.
                  I see, Instead of them contracting you to make it, you're making it in much the same way as V20.
                  I assumed, being that you no longer control the IP, that they would be directing you on what to provide; contracting the book to be produced.
                  I hope it works out as well as when you had full control with the V20 Line

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Illithid View Post
                    I see, Instead of them contracting you to make it, you're making it in much the same way as V20.
                    I assumed, being that you no longer control the IP, that they would be directing you on what to provide; contracting the book to be produced.
                    I hope it works out as well as when you had full control with the V20 Line
                    Our license has not changed; it is for the WoD regardless of whether that is V20 or V5. We pitch ideas to the owner (first CCP and then WW), they respond, we provide staged deliveries for approval, they send notes, we implement and get the project published. I’d say we never had “full control” compared to Scion or the Trinity Continuum, because it has always been a license.

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                    • #25
                      Thank you for the insight RichT

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Illithid View Post
                        Since White Wolf have taken back the IP, and are contracting a book to be written by Onyx Path: Why are we kickstarting it?
                        Surely the IP holder would be paying the producers of a book to, well write the book. And then profit goes to the IP holder?
                        Crowdfunding does not only produce money, if successful, but as well helps the visibility of a product.
                        For IPs held by a different owner, companies pay for being able to use the IP, as well as for their production costs. They do that for the expected win margin from the IPs being used.
                        For example, if you do a Star Trek game, you pay Paramount money and hope that the plethora of Star Trek fans will make up for the investment.

                        Originally posted by Vamps like Us
                        The Giovanni are actually my favorite Clan that came after the Original 7 and in my top 5 easily. Bummer....
                        The Giovanni are my personal favorite Clan. Clearly number one, even with the original 7.
                        I took the very brief two mentions they got in the core book with quite a bit of optimism in regards to an unreliable narrator.

                        Maybe they aren't as sundered, but just got a way lower profile in the wake of being attacked from two sides.
                        Maybe a new assignment or some earnest talk with Dis Pater.

                        I do would enjoy if it weren't just like one or two Giovanni per city, but little family pockets, who do interact more with the Camarilla and Anarchs.

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                        • #27
                          Matthew Dawkins said that the Giovanni got destroyed.

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                          • #28
                            I haven't caught up with the videos at all, but that would be quite a change of heart?
                            By both White Wolf, who keep stern to their statement that all the 13 Clans will do remain the 13 Clans, and not the 12 Clans and a bloodline or such?

                            I mean, I have as well talked about the Giovanni with him during GenCon?
                            The Gentleman Gamer I am confused, maybe you can bring enlightenment?

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                            • #29
                              It sounds like the Cappadocians are coming back in force. From what I'm gathering from what I've read and what I've heard from the Gentleman Gamer videos it sounds like the Clan of Death is going to be a catch all term for all the separate factions of the original Cappadocian Clan including Giovanni, Cappadocians, Harbinger of Skulls, and I think the Samedi.


                              "The only consistent wisdom is in knowing you know nothing" ~ Socrates

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                              • #30
                                How are they not killing each other immediately?

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