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V5 Tremere Clan Question

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  • #16
    Originally posted by marin View Post

    Beckett's Jyhad Diary.
    Thank you very much

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    • #17
      Originally posted by thebiglarpnerd View Post


      There was something posted elsewhere that linked the talk of Schreckt in BJD about destroying the worm and the brainwashed council to the leaking of information, to some of the talk in the V5 corebook, heavily implicating that it was an inside job by other high-ranking Tremere to get rid of the SauloTremere worm.
      I buy it. It would pretty much have to be an inside job to some extent. Schrekt is a true Tremere loyalist who saw the corruption at the highest level and knew the Pyramid had to be decapitated before it could be rebuilt. Meanwhile the decentralization of the clan works in its favor. So while now he represents the most conservative of the houses, they’re in dialogue with House Carna and House Goratrix. House Tremere (under Schrekt) and House Carna are still affiliated with the Camarilla, House Goratrix May still be Sabbat-affiliated, and House Ipsissimus is Anarch. So there is at least one house in every sect, and the clan will survive, one way or another.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Cifer View Post
        They actually all had to. Tremere never sired - probably so noone could use his progeny as a ritual link towards him.
        In regard to this - early after I started reading and considering M:tA, I thought that such an approach can be completely wrong. Wouldn't such a giving in to paranoia, threats, and/or fear make a person vulnerable to some spells or abilities potentially more dangerous than whatever could be cast after kidnapping a Vampire's Childe ? Consider a Vampire not Embracing because of this reason ; what is next ? No meetings with friends, no Ghouling, no giving gifts to those she ( or he ) cares about ? I think that going by such a limitation might result in a mystical chink that could be exploited. So in the end kidnapped acquaintances or servants could be used as a ritual link against the paranoid person, because she ( or he ) has admitted and given in to the idea and principles of somebody's personal attachments allowing for contagion in regard to hostilities towards a person.
        Last edited by Muad'Dib; 12-21-2018, 02:12 PM.

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        • #19
          Well, right now clever mr. Tremere has everyone thinking hes MIA. Maybe even dead after the SI attack. The best way to hide is to make everyone think your already dead. In this way he can influence and lead the clan in secret without being targeted by any enemies since hes "already dead". Very clever.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Wissenschaft View Post
            Well, right now clever mr. Tremere has everyone thinking hes MIA. Maybe even dead after the SI attack. The best way to hide is to make everyone think your already dead. In this way he can influence and lead the clan in secret without being targeted by any enemies since hes "already dead". Very clever.
            I think that it isn't 'the best' way to hide at all. Staying hidden succesfully involves using numerous means, resources, and methods at one's disposal to cloak activities, disguise appearance, prepare means of re-location and escape, develop alternate identities, and neutralize, avoid and/or redirect observation, information gathering, and searching attempts.
            Faking one's demise is inefficient beyond very specific situations. It's cost will most likely be severe - contacts, resources, allies, influence, and reputation are harder to use, thus making attempts to stay hidden or act under alternate identities harder. Also, the faking of demise can fail to convince anyone or some. Furthermore, maintaining the faking of demise can be extremely limiting in regards to overall capabilities, and flexibility.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Muad'Dib View Post
              In regard to this - early after I started reading and considering M:tA, I thought that such an approach can be completely wrong. Wouldn't such a giving in to paranoia, threats, and/or fear make a person vulnerable to some spells or abilities potentially more dangerous than whatever could be cast after kidnapping a Vampire's Childe ?
              If being extraordinarily paranoid opened you up to some potent magic I expect that elder vampires never would have gotten very far.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Zanos View Post
                If being extraordinarily paranoid opened you up to some potent magic I expect that elder vampires never would have gotten very far.
                The entire discussion is rendered moot by the fact Tremere never really needed to sire in the first place. He had seven fifth-and fourth-genners willing to create pawns for him. Grimgroth's Embrace and installment on the Council are (weakly) implied to be a reward for his sabotaging the defense of Mistridge, igniting the Ascension War and turning the Order of Hermes' attention from annihilating the Tremere.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Theodrim View Post

                  The entire discussion is rendered moot by the fact Tremere never really needed to sire in the first place. He had seven fifth-and fourth-genners willing to create pawns for him.
                  These are not pawns ! These are Tremere Vampires .

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Muad'Dib View Post
                    I think that it isn't 'the best' way to hide at all. Staying hidden succesfully involves using numerous means, resources, and methods at one's disposal to cloak activities, disguise appearance, prepare means of re-location and escape, develop alternate identities, and neutralize, avoid and/or redirect observation, information gathering, and searching attempts.
                    Faking one's demise is inefficient beyond very specific situations. It's cost will most likely be severe - contacts, resources, allies, influence, and reputation are harder to use, thus making attempts to stay hidden or act under alternate identities harder. Also, the faking of demise can fail to convince anyone or some. Furthermore, maintaining the faking of demise can be extremely limiting in regards to overall capabilities, and flexibility.

                    And yet thats how many very old vampires operate. From the shadows with almost no one knowing they even exist. Your puppets have all the contacts, resources, allies, etc that you need.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Wissenschaft View Post


                      And yet thats how many very old vampires operate. From the shadows with almost no one knowing they even exist. Your puppets have all the contacts, resources, allies, etc that you need.
                      What I wrote in this post is not in regard to acting while staying hidden. It is in regard to a how a person faking her ( or his ) demise is far from being 'the best way' to stay hidden.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Muad'Dib View Post
                        What I wrote in this post is not in regard to acting while staying hidden. It is in regard to a how a person faking her ( or his ) demise is far from being 'the best way' to stay hidden.

                        I know exactly what you meant and my retort still stands. Elder vampires can manipulate younger vampires without those affected ever knowing they are being manipulated or that their puppet masters even exists.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Wissenschaft View Post
                          Elder vampires can manipulate younger vampires without those affected ever knowing they are being manipulated or that their puppet masters even exists.
                          The majority of Vampires probably do this from time to time, and to a smaller or greater extent. Mages also do this, but I think they are less skilled and capable than Vampires in regard to this.

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