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Replacement Assamite Weakness: Thoughts?

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  • Replacement Assamite Weakness: Thoughts?

    Weakness from Caine's Curse:

    Clan weakness: "Behold my most deadly child/ who chose to judge his brethren for his own sins/ Let only their blood slake him, so that all may fear/ and loath him"

    Every Assamite has a variant of the Methuselah's Thirst flaw. They only gain sustenance from the blood of their fellow children of caine, although they gain 3 BP for every 2 BP drained from another Assamite and can only be blood bound by other Assamite's.

    Weakness from Bali Curse:
    In addition to the above, every Assamite suffers from a variant of Thirst for Innocence. Contact with the blood of any non Assamite Kindred causes the Assamite to frenzy unless they succeed on a Self Control/Instincts roll (Difficulty 4 for skin contact, 6 for consumption).

    Weakness from Tremere Curse:
    Every BP of non Assamite blood that enters their body does one point of unsoakable Aggravated Damage and Diablerie against a non-Assamite results in immediate final death.

    ---
    I tried to keep the curse thematically appropriate and fitting well with how the clan is portrayed in the plot over the years. Because of the Tremere Curse the entire clan is effectively in a 8+ Vinculum with every other member. They are, in effect, cursed to remain apart from the species that they dared to Judge as they can't join the Sabbat (immunity to blood bonds with non Assamites), they can't join the Camarilla (the cursing and the fact that they frenzy easily), and virtually all vampires fear them (especially pre Tremere curse) as to Assamites the Kindred are their food source.

    The plus side for being an Assamite is that generational promotion is a thing and you have an entire, world spanning, organization to support and back you up. If advantages were represented mechanically this would be lots of free background points.

    On the downside, it makes playing Assamites in a Chronicle not designed to justify it much harder. The independent Assamite, or Assamite antitribu simply aren't things either pre or post Tremere curse.

    So thoughts? Suggestions? Concerns?

  • #2
    Every Assamite has a variant of the Methuselah's Thirst flaw. They only gain sustenance from the blood of their fellow children of caine, although they gain 3 BP for every 2 BP drained from another Assamite and can only be blood bound by other Assamite's.
    That would mean that two Assamites who are not afraid of being blood-bound to one another can just swap blood back and forth and forego hunting completely, thus negating the need to ever hunt and removing one of the two principal pillars of the vampiric condition.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Cifer View Post
      That would mean that two Assamites who are not afraid of being blood-bound to one another can just swap blood back and forth and forego hunting completely, thus negating the need to ever hunt and removing one of the two principal pillars of the vampiric condition.
      Yes, they can. But then they are a clan who claim their leader self embraced and are a clan that, historically, has never been big on humanity (the whole Path of Blood thing).

      And two kindred with efficient digestion can already do that; it's a 3 point merit. Actually, only one of them needs it. Eat 2 points, gain three, have the one without ED eat two, ED vamp drains those two back, gaining three. Every cycle nets one BP for the pair.

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      • #4
        I don't like it. This alteration would give the same weakness to all 3 castes, and I think their curse fine as is. The hints that Sorcerers might actually be some other kind of variation on the blood (relation to Baali) are nullified by this change.

        Immunity to blood bonds is a huge difference. The Black Hand being primarily Assamite Antitribu, who rejoin the main clan when Ur-Shulgi awakens is no longer a plot point.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by PazuzuAxelf View Post
          I don't like it. This alteration would give the same weakness to all 3 castes, and I think their curse fine as is. The hints that Sorcerers might actually be some other kind of variation on the blood (relation to Baali) are nullified by this change.
          I fundamentally dislike the idea of Clan vamp's having different clan weaknesses. If you are of a clan then you have your clan weakness, period. If you are of a distinct bloodline then you might have a different weakness but the castes aren't bloodlines.

          Immunity to blood bonds is a huge difference. The Black Hand being primarily Assamite Antitribu, who rejoin the main clan when Ur-Shulgi awakens is no longer a plot point.
          Yes, it is. I also think it fits thematically.

          As for meta plot, frankly I tend to think that the Assamite's metaplot has been pretty much crap for a long time. Ur-Shulgi waking up and removing the Tremere curse is cool, but how that fact has been dealt with is kinda blah. I mean you have this massively powerful 4th gen blood mage with an entire army of blood mages and assassins at his back, located in one of the most secure bases of operation on the planet, with blood samples from the entire clan, and Quietus 9 (so Condemn the Sins of the Father). I kinda wish WW had had the balls to have him wake up, use a ritual/quietus/auspex to read the minds of every Assamite in the world (justified via the Well if nothing else), and then ripped the blood, life, and souls out of every single one of them who was not an adherent to the Path of Blood/Road of Blood - using that power to rip the Tremere curse from all the rest.

          That's the old testament Judge doing his thing. Of course, you can't kill off most of the "Islamic" clan based on their religious beliefs - that wouldn't be PC.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Sagacious Gamer View Post
            I fundamentally dislike the idea of Clan vamp's having different clan weaknesses. If you are of a clan then you have your clan weakness, period. If you are of a distinct bloodline then you might have a different weakness but the castes aren't bloodlines.
            So what did you do about Salubri Antitribu, Toreador Antitribu, Tremere Antitribu, Wu Zao, and Telyavelic Tremere? These are just as much of a bloodline as the Assamite variants and have different weaknesses from the main clans. Do you change all of them too?

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            • #7
              Originally posted by PazuzuAxelf View Post

              So what did you do about Salubri Antitribu, Toreador Antitribu, Tremere Antitribu, Wu Zao, and Telyavelic Tremere? These are just as much of a bloodline as the Assamite variants and have different weaknesses from the main clans. Do you change all of them too?
              A clan weakness changing based on a vampires political leanings (and that is what the antitribu are, or at least started as in the relatively recent past) kinda misses the whole point that these are Curses leveled by Caine against the clan.

              The Salubri is semi reasonable given that it is (arguably at least) a 4th gen starting a new bloodline while the Tremere have the benefits of no original curse while being (kinda) a Tzimisce bloodline and having Saolut possessing Tremere's body (and then having the heart of the Pyramid ripped out).But the Toreador change only makes sense if you assume that their Antideviluian didn't like it and decided to cuse them

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              • #8
                None of these weaknesses, including the original Assamite weaknesses, change due to political affiliation. They are the result of the blood mutating, like any other bloodline.


                Caine did curse the Assamites with the darkening skin already. You're not really fixing anything.

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                • #9
                  Also as far as I am aware Salubri weren't cursed. Or at least that's what they like to pretend anyhow.

                  Also Salubri and and Assamites castes predates the curse. Which is why I thought they had different weaknesses. They are so old that they diverged to the point of being quasi-bloodlines.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by PazuzuAxelf View Post
                    None of these weaknesses, including the original Assamite weaknesses, change due to political affiliation. They are the result of the blood mutating, like any other bloodline.


                    Caine did curse the Assamites with the darkening skin already. You're not really fixing anything.

                    Supposing one buys into the whole Caine myth and that the weaknesses are products of his displeassure with each othe clans respective founders.
                    Because if one does, it beggars the question of why kindred society is so into killing Caitiff, the one's without curse, ergo, absolved by Caine based on such conceit/principle?

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Baaldam View Post
                      Supposing one buys into the whole Caine myth and that the weaknesses are products of his displeassure with each othe clans respective founders.
                      Because if one does, it beggars the question of why kindred society is so into killing Caitiff, the one's without curse, ergo, absolved by Caine based on such conceit/principle?
                      Now that you mention it, it is a nice parallel to Caine killing Abel whose offering was accepted by god.
                      Of course, at least officially, the Camarilla doesn't believe in Caine and the Antediluvians. They're just gerontocratic classist assholes who both like to grind others into the dust and can't stand people who don't have weaknesses like theirs.
                      Last edited by Cifer; 05-29-2019, 07:02 PM.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Cifer View Post
                        Now that you mention it, it is a nice parallel to Caine killing Abel whose offering was accepted by god.
                        Of course, at least officially, the Camarilla doesn't believe in Caine and the Antediluvians. They're just gerontocratic classist assholes who both like to grind others into the dust and can't stand people who don't have weaknesses like theirs.

                        Officially. But it's the ones wwith a noddist fetish that tend to throw their sheriffs and hounds upon clanless & thin-bloods no questions asked.

                        In fact some of the most entertaining political games i have participated have involved people bullsh***ing the Cam big time with their own official propaganda bullshit.

                        Weird stuff like the Lasombra antitribu, a number of bloodlines and some well-placed Caitiff banding together in a power bloc/pseudo-clan of their own, the Unbound, those with ties to no existing clan founder.

                        Or a Sabbat-dominated city that joined the Cam, without leaving the previous sect based on the fact that while it does not recognize the Antes or Gehenna it does not forbid belief upon it, among a lot of other horsecrap arguments, because their archbishop-prince was that much of a troll.
                        Last edited by Baaldam; 05-29-2019, 07:42 PM.

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