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How do you do your Ravnos?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by CTPhipps View Post
    I've often wondered if Nagaraja need to kill.

    How "fresh" do bodies have to be?

    You could be a Nagaraja in a lighter and softer Seattte game.
    I figure not too fresh. Otherwise it just gets unsustainable if you want to stay within the Masquerade. So you could e.g. steal medical waste from a morgue and sate yourself off that.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Draconis View Post

      I figure not too fresh. Otherwise it just gets unsustainable if you want to stay within the Masquerade. So you could e.g. steal medical waste from a morgue and sate yourself off that.
      Agreed.

      I like the image of a Nagaraja in the Dark Ages rushing to a graveyard after a funeral as soon as the sun goes down, so she can unearth the freshly interred corpse and P A R T A K E. Much closer to the concept of a Ghoul (or ghul/ghula) than that of the living blood thrall.


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      • #18
        Hindu custom is typically to cremate the body within 24 hours or so after death. This makes corpse scrounging difficult outside of the coastal Muslim trading communities until the Ghurid invasions and the creation of the Delhi Sultanate makes Islam more wide spread.

        (I honestly always assumed that the only reason the Korean courts gave them sanctuary was to have something to laugh at; by KotE standards, they are so backwards that they can't even gain the basic enlightenment to stop having to eat flesh.)


        What is tolerance? It is the consequence of humanity. We are all formed of frailty and error; let us pardon reciprocally each other's folly. That is the first law of nature.
        Voltaire, "Tolerance" (1764)

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        • #19
          Originally posted by No One of Consequence View Post
          Hindu custom is typically to cremate the body within 24 hours or so after death. This makes corpse scrounging difficult outside of the coastal Muslim trading communities until the Ghurid invasions and the creation of the Delhi Sultanate makes Islam more wide spread.

          (I honestly always assumed that the only reason the Korean courts gave them sanctuary was to have something to laugh at; by KotE standards, they are so backwards that they can't even gain the basic enlightenment to stop having to eat flesh.)
          Then again, in the World of Darkness, maybe there's a reason cremation is done so quickly. (Aside from religious reasons, of course).

          Having cannibal undead who are also necromancers sounds like pretty good cause to set cultural precedent, in this regard. It may even have been encouraged by Indian Ravnos and other bloodlines (like the Danava), in an attempt to drive Nagaraja from the region.


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          • #20
            My Ravnos are a bloodline, the descendants of Ravana. The 4th generation who became a Yama King. The compulsion towards sin is though to be because their blood is a bit closer to the infernal. In Europe they claimed to be the dominant clan of vast India, but they lied. It was basically a Prester John letter con. The bloodline is extinct in India. The actual Indian Ravnos do not have Chimestry in-clan, although many of the older ones know it well as an out-of-clan power. They are much more like the Ventrue, and do in fact mutter about the Ventrue having no Antediluvian and isn't that convenient. Slain you say?

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            • #21
              Thinking about it, I’ve never actually run a WoD game. With that said, Ravnos is one of my favorite clans, but I really enjoyed the original gypsy aesthetic far more than the revised clan. I can understand the Romani wanting to expand and embracing gaje, but moving the whole clan away from the family-loving, wandering stranger gypsy aesthetic I feel was a mistake. One of my favorite characters was a Phuri Dae palm reader who had some of her family members as allies. Unfortunately, it seems like when the Ravnos were gypsies, players were more likely to try to push them into a two-dimensional antagonist role instead of actually trying to understand gypsy society, mythology, etc and how vampires work into that.

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              • #22
                In my current masquiem play one of my players is a Ravnos and I rule them as a Gangrel Bloodline born in India.Rumors say that their founder was an intelligent draurg in wassail obssesed with eating flesh and becoming a god who survived thanks to obfuscate allowing him to hide until he grew strong enought to embrace his rakhasa army that revolted against him in a civil war with ended with the demon king sealed but lengends say that he will raise again during a week of nightmares to seek revenge.

                More mythical creation myths suggest that the bloodline was born as consecuence of their founder triying to eat the indu gods like an Asura against the Devas or like the Rakhasa tried to eat Bhrama.Their founder failed but he ended eating some of their flesh and as consecuence he was cursed with the compulsive nature of demons and marked as an untochable wich is the reason why they sin and have obfuscate as their bloodline discipline.

                Whatever it´s true is hidden by the liying tongues of the elders.

                The bloodline is divided in between the ones who give themselves freely to their vices argumenthing to be demons on earth (Those usually end up joining the Carthians or Sabbath) and those who seek redemptiom from the gods who choose to join more spiritual groups or alternatively just end up in the Camarilla where they create domains who operate under a cast system made by themselves where those who do not follow their rules are demmed untouchables and ostrasticed.

                In-Clan Disciplines:Protean , Animalism , Resilence , Obfuscate
                Clan Weakness:+1 diff to all frenzy rolls.
                Clan Gift:All Gangrel are difficult to kill and they start with 10 health levels
                Bloodline Gift:All Ravnos have a mouth full of retractile teeth that allows them to cause agravate damage with a biting move while grappling (In my games agg damage is rare so this is huge)
                Bloodline Weakness: All Ravnos have a vice , for some of them it´s stealing , for others it´s killing or eating flesh.They don´t need it to survive but if they don´t fullfill it they get a -2 penalty to all physical and discipline rolls as the vice makes them unable to focus.The idea is that they are forced to comitt crimes and this makes them outcasts who can hide and this makes a lot of princes unhappy.
                Last edited by Leandro16; 07-13-2019, 12:07 AM.


                Hunger pool

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Gothik_Knight View Post
                  Thinking about it, I’ve never actually run a WoD game. With that said, Ravnos is one of my favorite clans, but I really enjoyed the original gypsy aesthetic far more than the revised clan. I can understand the Romani wanting to expand and embracing gaje, but moving the whole clan away from the family-loving, wandering stranger gypsy aesthetic I feel was a mistake. One of my favorite characters was a Phuri Dae palm reader who had some of her family members as allies. Unfortunately, it seems like when the Ravnos were gypsies, players were more likely to try to push them into a two-dimensional antagonist role instead of actually trying to understand gypsy society, mythology, etc and how vampires work into that.
                  Saying you liked something racist for the aesthetic of it is a bad look, especially when your post is full of a racial slur. Just sayin.


                  Remi. she/her. game designer.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by atamajakki View Post

                    Saying you liked something racist for the aesthetic of it is a bad look, especially when your post is full of a racial slur. Just sayin.
                    Can we try to avoid slandering each other please?
                    To be more clear, I enjoy the gypsy aesthetic, but the original Ravnos concept was racist by making all Ravnos criminals by blood.. you simply couldn’t play a Ravnos that wasn’t a criminal. I was hoping that the revised clan book would get away from the criminal aspect, instead they got away from the gypsy aspect and introduced to the clan another racial group which was forced to be entirely criminal. I wanted to see more concepts involving non-criminal Romani and, if that wasn’t seen as a big enough culture to pull many concepts from, maybe they could have added other nomadic cultures such as tinkers and Bedouins. But all in all, the original clan Ravnos concept was actually better than the later concept.

                    Also, all clans and tribes have heavy racial components to them, so singling out the ravnos as being racist seems a little strange to me.

                    P.s.: admittedly, not all clans/tribes hit the negative stereotypes as much as the Ravnos, but I can’t see myself as being happy about the incestuous necromancy sicilian mafiosos if I were part of that ethnic group.. not to mention the Egyptian devil-worshippers or the Arab assassins.
                    Last edited by Gothik_Knight; 07-13-2019, 01:49 PM.

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                    • #25
                      He's referring to the fact that, when referring to Romani (its used by other groups by themselves non-pejoratively), that gypsy is a slur.



                      Author of Cthulhu Armageddon, I was a Teenage Weredeer, Straight Outta Fangton, Lucifer's Star, and the Supervillainy Saga.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Gothik_Knight View Post
                        P.s.: admittedly, not all clans/tribes hit the negative stereotypes as much as the Ravnos, but I can’t see myself as being happy about the incestuous necromancy sicilian mafiosos if I were part of that ethnic group.. not to mention the Egyptian devil-worshippers or the Arab assassins.
                        hey, don't use devil worshipping as a pejorative

                        and it's diablerists, not assassins...Assamites have a noble cause


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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Pleiades View Post

                          hey, don't use devil worshipping as a pejorative

                          and it's diablerists, not assassins...Assamites have a noble cause
                          Set isn't the devil.

                          SET IS THE GOD THE DEVIL PRAYS TO!




                          Author of Cthulhu Armageddon, I was a Teenage Weredeer, Straight Outta Fangton, Lucifer's Star, and the Supervillainy Saga.

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                          • #28
                            Amen

                            [10 character requirement]


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                            • #29
                              The biggest problem with the idea that Ravnos hang around with and primarily embrace new members from their extended Roma families is that Roma cultures traditionally have very strong taboos about both the dead and blood, considering them to be deeply and inherently unclean in a spiritual sense. To a traditional Roma person, a vampire is essentially an abomination to their culture and beliefs. And a Roma vampire who turns his kinfolk in a blood drinking slave or worse, another vampire, is an entire order of magnitude higher in repulsiveness. 😕
                              (Honestly, all of the independent clans as originally presented suffer from this sort of logistical problem; a bunch of hired killers with no other skills, a cult that presumes everyone in it is automatically faithful, a monoethnic group that violates one of the culture's major tenets, and a single small inbred mortal family. That part of why I prefer them as diverse collections of obsessive truth seekers, Dionysian rebels, sin-cursed tragic figures, and corrupt gothic-fiction freaks. But others' mileage may vary.)


                              What is tolerance? It is the consequence of humanity. We are all formed of frailty and error; let us pardon reciprocally each other's folly. That is the first law of nature.
                              Voltaire, "Tolerance" (1764)

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by No One of Consequence View Post
                                The biggest problem with the idea that Ravnos hang around with and primarily embrace new members from their extended Roma families is that Roma cultures traditionally have very strong taboos about both the dead and blood, considering them to be deeply and inherently unclean in a spiritual sense. To a traditional Roma person, a vampire is essentially an abomination to their culture and beliefs. And a Roma vampire who turns his kinfolk in a blood drinking slave or worse, another vampire, is an entire order of magnitude higher in repulsiveness. 😕
                                (Honestly, all of the independent clans as originally presented suffer from this sort of logistical problem; a bunch of hired killers with no other skills, a cult that presumes everyone in it is automatically faithful, a monoethnic group that violates one of the culture's major tenets, and a single small inbred mortal family. That part of why I prefer them as diverse collections of obsessive truth seekers, Dionysian rebels, sin-cursed tragic figures, and corrupt gothic-fiction freaks. But others' mileage may vary.)
                                I dunno, it depends whether we assume Clans are meant to be large groups versus what is best for an existing game.

                                Assamites, Giovanni, and Followers of Set may not be particularly diverse but they're very easy to write games about.


                                Author of Cthulhu Armageddon, I was a Teenage Weredeer, Straight Outta Fangton, Lucifer's Star, and the Supervillainy Saga.

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