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[WIR] Beckett's Jyhad Diary - The Big book of Metaplot

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  • Originally posted by CTPhipps View Post
    Only eight more chapters to go. I may slow down a little to try to stretch this out until THE CHICAGO FOLIO and LET THE STREETS RUN RED.

    You might be waiting a while, in that case.


    Matthew Dawkins
    In-House Developer for Onyx Path Publishing


    Website: http://www.matthewdawkins.com
    Patreon: http://https://www.patreon.com/matthewdawkins

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    • Originally posted by The Gentleman Gamer View Post
      You might be waiting a while, in that case.
      I was figuring spreading over the course of one a week for about two months. But mostly it was the case of attempting to lengthen the discussion, not get directly to the finish line. I'm sure the books will be done when they're done. You can't rush art. Sorry if I gave that impression.

      I hope you're still enjoying our re-read. Today I found out you guys DID mention the Blood Curse in the Germany section, so I can now remove The Red Death Trilogy off my list of things this book didn't cover. I'm fully expect to see the Children of Osiris somewhere now.
      Last edited by CTPhipps; 08-14-2019, 06:31 AM.


      Author of Cthulhu Armageddon, I was a Teenage Weredeer, Straight Outta Fangton, Lucifer's Star, and the Supervillainy Saga.

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      • Originally posted by CTPhipps View Post

        I was figuring spreading over the course of one a week for about two months. But mostly it was the case of attempting to lengthen the discussion, not get directly to the finish line. I'm sure the books will be done when they're done. You can't rush art. Sorry if I gave that impression.

        I hope you're still enjoying our re-read. Today I found out you guys DID mention the Blood Curse in the Germany section, so I can now remove The Red Death Trilogy off my list of things this book didn't cover. I'm fully expect to see the Children of Osiris somewhere now.

        No, no bad impression. I just doubt those books will be out in two months.


        Matthew Dawkins
        In-House Developer for Onyx Path Publishing


        Website: http://www.matthewdawkins.com
        Patreon: http://https://www.patreon.com/matthewdawkins

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        • Originally posted by CTPhipps View Post
          Grumpy RPG Reviews

          The big appeal for me in this chapter is actually Rebekah's statement about Golconda as a 12-step program and sobriety. I mentioned I really like this but if they could reverse Golconda to being almost a religion or lifestyle of "Do No Harm" that doesn't necessarily come with mystical perfection then I think it becomes a lot more useful in game. You could even have it be like the Path of Harmony or High Humanity in general as a way to roleplay. There's a presently hilarious video series on going on at the SF Debris site where the protagonist of the Sith Warrior playthrough of STA WARS: THE OLD REPUBLIC is doing their best to do a 12 step program to not let the Dark Side control them. Except being a Sith Lord is a lot like being vampire in the Camarilla--even when you're trying to do good, you're probably doing evil.
          Light Side Sith Warrior is one of the better story arcs in that game, imo, and I’m always glad when I find another fan of it. The character strikes me as what every Camarilla Archon and Sabbat Templar should aspire to be. Or priests and holy warriors of the Lawful Evil deity of your favorite D&D campaign setting. The Sith Empire would clearly be run more effectively if it had more Sith like that running the show instead of the short-sighted and greedy maniacs that it has, but it would still be an evil society at the end of the day.

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          • Originally posted by The Gentleman Gamer View Post

            You are the first person to say you've noticed that!
            It's silly, I know, but I also noticed that on the weekend, but I didn't have the time to wright anything - I blame my work. ;-)
            Fun fact - to add at least a little bit of input: Anatole is the one who actually says the truth (Master oR is a Malkavian and not that powerful, Demetrius is of 6th gen, and indeed not as powerful as some of the others in Hunedoara) - so maybe that's an example for "fools and children tell the truth"? Made me wonder, if you could find proof of that in Anatole's other statements in the Book. But than again, the Chapter I'm reading deals with A's betrayal in Jerusalem, so maybe that was just a lucky guess.

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            • I find the use of Ilias cel Frumos in the New York section interesting, as he was quite clearly killed in the dark ages clan novel byt eh Tzimisce Antediluvian. I like to think that the Ilias that shows up here is the face the Tzimisce Antediluvian likes to use when it wants to interact with the world not as a lovecraftian monster. Since the clan founder has a history of killing other Tzimisce and taking their identity (see Lujo).

              Just my personal preference though!

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              • Originally posted by SuperSabbatST View Post
                I find the use of Ilias cel Frumos in the New York section interesting, as he was quite clearly killed in the dark ages clan novel byt eh Tzimisce Antediluvian. I like to think that the Ilias that shows up here is the face the Tzimisce Antediluvian likes to use when it wants to interact with the world not as a lovecraftian monster. Since the clan founder has a history of killing other Tzimisce and taking their identity (see Lujo).

                Just my personal preference though!
                You may be on to something there


                Matthew Dawkins
                In-House Developer for Onyx Path Publishing


                Website: http://www.matthewdawkins.com
                Patreon: http://https://www.patreon.com/matthewdawkins

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                • Here's what we're told of the Eldest's fate, from Beckett's account of Ilias's words on p.394 of BJD:

                  The Eldest has also sought truth, sought knowledge — for a time, the Eldest was lost in itself with the seeking of an answer it could not find, riven as it was by the severance of its bonds to the earth. It is...no longer lost. And it has gone to take counsel with its own siblings, who are also no longer lost.
                  That is, it's left New York to take counsel with the other Third Generations.

                  Factoring that in with the suggestion above that Ilias here was a face of the Eldest... hm.


                  Scion 2E: What We Know - A wiki compiling info on second edition Scion.

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                  • Funny thing about that "face of the Eldest"-idea: I did exactly that in my TC-chronicles, to give the Eldest a familiar face for the PCs :-)
                    That "Ilias" claims, that the Bogatyr are overtly protective of him - them being the bodyguards of the Eldest could be another proof for your theory, SuperSabbatST

                    What intrigued me when reading this chapter yesterday, was the ring, that "Ilias" gave to Beckett for Vykos. Skulls and Grain should be a symbol of Jarilo, the death-rebirth-fertility pagan god that the "real" Ilias served in CN-DA:Tz. A fitting description for the Eldest as well, though.

                    It also is a great way to deal with my irritation of bringing Ilias back from the dead. And it serves as a nice counterpart to Vykos freeing himself of the Dracon.
                    Last edited by Athanasius; 08-14-2019, 03:16 PM.

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                    • Originally posted by SuperSabbatST View Post
                      I find the use of Ilias cel Frumos in the New York section interesting, as he was quite clearly killed in the dark ages clan novel byt eh Tzimisce Antediluvian. I like to think that the Ilias that shows up here is the face the Tzimisce Antediluvian likes to use when it wants to interact with the world not as a lovecraftian monster. Since the clan founder has a history of killing other Tzimisce and taking their identity (see Lujo).

                      Just my personal preference though!

                      I tend to agree, even If give a slight different interpretation of it.

                      Ilyas is surely now a face of the Tzimisce Antideluvian (but I would rater say an "aspect"), but more in the sense that now he is a part of the Tzimisce Antediluvian.

                      I think that Tzimisce, while is surely the most alien and monstrous of the Antes, is basically alone, and that is ultimate aim is not being alone anymore by assimilating everyone. I think that Ilias is now part of him, like a giant hive mind. And I suspect that this could be the destiny of other Tzimisces like Byelobog, Lugoj and Yorak.
                      Basically we saw the real Ilyas : that was him (as a subjective individual) , not some kind of Vicissitude decoy. But it was also the Tzimisce antideluvian, like a finger is a part of the body.
                      The thing we saw was both Ilyas, and the friendly face of the Eldest. Two people, two consciousness, one existence.

                      And I think that this is also the case for Lambach.
                      The Tzimisce tends to leave their individuality at some point, they are the trascendentalist par exellence. Yorak was one with the Cathedral of Flesh, Demdeh became a virus, the Dracon was fused inside Vykos, Byelobog was a part of the Pripjet Marshes.
                      I think that the easiest way to explain the problem of Lambach generation is assume that in Lambach there are several Tzimisce at once.
                      The Ruthvens are, of all the Tzimisce, the ones who seems more closely linked with the concept of family, legacies and dinasty. Who build their rank from a family to such an extent. Lord Ruthven, Damek Ruthven, Tabak Ruthven, Danika, Lambach and so on, the Ruthvesky Revenant family. The Ruthven seems really focused on the family.

                      And I think that, in a similar way, Lord Ruthven did the same the Eldest did. We know that the Eldest can manifest itself in anyone who has Tzimisce blood. What if Lord Ruthven, and the Ruthvens, could survive throught their blood and their family?
                      This would explain how Lambach Ruthven teleported himself from New York to the Caymans, and why while he is at the Cayman Dracula assume that his sire (that should be Lambach) is imprisoned in a castle in Transylvania. The Ruthvens identity is not limited by physical form, and can travel through the Blood, like the Agents from Matrix.



                      Last edited by Undead rabbit; 08-14-2019, 03:35 PM.

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                      • Originally posted by The Gentleman Gamer View Post
                        You may be on to something there
                        I had thought that the Eldest just vomited up Ilias for some reason while it wandered off, looking for other members of the 3rd Generation. If "Ilias" is simply a disguised Founder, then Beckett has had personal encounters with at least three Antediluvians (Saulot, Malkav, and Tzimisce) who selected the Noddist to survive for some reason. I wonder what they all expect of him.

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                        • Originally posted by The Gentleman Gamer View Post
                          No, no bad impression. I just doubt those books will be out in two months.
                          *scribbles down tidbit of info for his wall of info*

                          Thanks for sharing!

                          Originally posted by Grumpy RPG Reviews
                          I had thought that the Eldest just vomited up Ilias for some reason while it wandered off, looking for other members of the 3rd Generation. If "Ilias" is simply a disguised Founder, then Beckett has had personal encounters with at least three Antediluvians (Saulot, Malkav, and Tzimisce) who selected the Noddist to survive for some reason. I wonder what they all expect of him.
                          Given Illias gives Vykos a love letter at the end via Lucita, I'm inclined to think it is actually Ilias and not Tzimisce as well.

                          Mind you, the Antediluvians are not inclined to swat a buzzing fly.
                          Last edited by CTPhipps; 08-14-2019, 03:46 PM.


                          Author of Cthulhu Armageddon, I was a Teenage Weredeer, Straight Outta Fangton, Lucifer's Star, and the Supervillainy Saga.

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                          • If Saulot, Malkav, and Tzimisce are all childer of Enoch, as depicted in some accounts, they very well may be in cahoots on some level. It would be a hell of a thing if the Genenna War was really a feud between the vampires of the Second Generation, using their Third Generation childer as lieutenants/weapons/pawns.

                            At that level of power it ceases to be something that player characters could survive witnessing, let alone impact the outcome in any way, but the idea could serve as a pretext for any number of houseruled metagame shakeups. A lot of this book is like that, modular ideas to plug in if they’re useful and ignore if they’re not.
                            Last edited by Reasor; 08-14-2019, 04:28 PM.

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                            • Originally posted by CTPhipps View Post

                              Given Illias gives Vykos a love letter at the end via Lucita, I'm inclined to think it is actually Ilias and not Tzimisce as well.

                              Mind you, the Antediluvians are not inclined to swat a buzzing fly.
                              Right, but I've got a slightly head-ache-inducing thought for you there: At that point in the story, Vykos still harbors the Dracon, so maybe the "love letter" is not meant for Vykos but for the Eldest favourite childe?

                              Also: If Elias/Ilias indeed IS another face of the Eldest, then what is the point of his art exhibitions: Luring kindred "of every clan" to NY? To what end? To consume them? That would at least match with Lambachs scribblings of the "peculiar taste" of the Eldest.

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                              • Originally posted by Athanasius View Post

                                Right, but I've got a slightly head-ache-inducing thought for you there: At that point in the story, Vykos still harbors the Dracon, so maybe the "love letter" is not meant for Vykos but for the Eldest favourite childe?

                                Also: If Elias/Ilias indeed IS another face of the Eldest, then what is the point of his art exhibitions: Luring kindred "of every clan" to NY? To what end? To consume them? That would at least match with Lambachs scribblings of the "peculiar taste" of the Eldest.
                                I think that's another sign Ilias is just on the level. Either that or the Eldest likes showing art he's made.

                                After all, Lasombra used his Gratiano handpuppet to rule a city for centuries.


                                Author of Cthulhu Armageddon, I was a Teenage Weredeer, Straight Outta Fangton, Lucifer's Star, and the Supervillainy Saga.

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