[V5] Players Handbook - What do you want to see

[Farast]

So given that Mophidius/Onyx Path are likely to be hard at work creating this book I would be interested in hearing what people want to see out of this book. I would like to focus this more on mechanical and role playing tools rather than fluff (metaplot, history etc. etc.) as this is likely to be the primary tool for helping new players to create characters.

A few things I would like to see;

* A layout that makes sense and flows easily for character creation.
* More emphasis on making the pdf readable and usable (I don't have room for physical books and I am happy to pay for pdfs but the double page spread [on the Camarilla and Anarch book] and unwillingness to create good bookmarks is really frustrating)
* An optional system to replace predator types with a flat exp amount or some other system that doesn't cause exp discrepancies (gaining a 3rd dot of a power is much more efficient than gaining your first dot of a clan discipline for example).
* A summary sheet that isn't the only black sheet in the book so it can be more easily printed out (Yes you can invert it but as a pair of pages they give a great summary I don't understand why they would make it harder to share this information)
* A better explanation for how Shapechange and Metamorphosis work (how do your skills and mental stats work with animal granted stats and skills etc.)
* A better variety of animals that you can turn into (we don't have an official boa form for ministry vampires for example) possibly with standard statlines instead of NPC stat lines to make it easier to use with the above powers (For example using Metamorphosis to turn into a bear makes you more stealthy than if you turned into a wolf [7 dice of physical vs 5 skill])
* An examination of the exp system and a discussion of alternative systems.
* This is more a ST tool but I would love a discussion on making interesting neighbourhoods and the advantages and disadvantages of making your haven in different locations etc.

[adambeyoncelowe]

Yeah, this press release suggests the PG is separate to the Companion: https://www.paradoxinteractive.com/e...tabletop-rpgs/

I can't find anything more recent, though.

[Trippy]

I was left with the impression that the Player's Guide as we knew it was cancelled, and the Companion was what was salvaged from it.

That’s how I read it too. What we know is that it hasn’t been released by Modiphius, that there were some issues behind the scenes regarding how some canon details were to be developed, and that there has been a complete shift over in terms of the game’s management moving forward, with an ‘in house’ development team now taking control. Some of the mooted content was included in the Companion, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the release schedule is entirely different now.

[Banu_Saulot]

Well, I didn't get no info at all about cancellation or production difficulty (perhaps it could be rationalized from the fact of Covid is going on but...), and I do remember hearing about it in the last videos. Something like "oh upcoming products...Sabbat guide book, Player Guide, Werewolf Apocalypse, yada-yada". So I'm assuming yes.
What I would love to see is more useful systems like Response Algorithm (present in the Anarch book) that offers a base net of responses from a big individual or group to the actions of the coterie; Institutions simple attributes and rules for use (present in the Camarilla book) that makes it so that big groups, corporations, agencies and organizations can be represented mechanically. I find these very awesome, expanding the game and giving more tools that fill me up with ideas.

But also, more Background options, more Loresheets (specially ones that are related to events, clans or ideas and can be used at more chronicles), more Merits and Flaws cuz the ones available are awesome but we need more, and the Coterie Merits (in the Companion) is a very cool idea. More Discipline power options would be nice but it could also unbalance the game or some such... so I'm not that interested.

Other than that I think they will surprise us, for there really isn't much the game really needs right now, it's a very complete experience. So, more chronicles, lore or examples (of Touchstones, Convictions, types of coteries and predators) is mostly what I imagine.

[tasti man LH]

I was left with the impression that the Player's Guide as we knew it was cancelled, and the Companion was what was salvaged from it.

[IllithidActivity]

Are they still making it? I had somewhat assumed that because of the delays the Companion was basically the best we were going to get.
If they are though then I imagine consolidating all the clans into one book would be a big draw, introducing new types of Merits and Advantages, more Loresheets, and perhaps most interestingly new Discipline powers.

[Banu_Saulot]

What will be of the Players Guide without adding the Salubri, Ravnos and Tzimisce?
I love me some more options and alternate rules, specially in V5.
But with the Companion out, what would be the big selling points of the Players Guide?

[Grumpy RPG Reviews]

Agreed. No Tzims, no interest. I'll just use my hombrew stuff to recreate them.

When I was a young man, I bought all the books and tried to follow the metaplot and rules closely. Now I buy only a few books and handwave everything else.

Doesn’t ‘rewriting’ imply that they are going to be in the book?

You are more optimistic than I am.

[elmerg]

I imagine they're going to be inside it.

Mind you, I've heard they love the Tzimisce and want them to be perfect while Paradox actively hates the Ravnos for the reasons that they hate the Kuei-Jin. That's reddit hearsay and about as reliable as Twitter (which is to say not at all).

I also don't know what they would want rewritten about the Tzimisce. Too gorey? Not gorey enough?

Most of that is online hearsay, yes. They're extrapolating from some of the devs from OPP talking about problematics with the Ravnos, as well as people who are no longer working for WW.

As far as rewritten? I mean, they said it 'didn't fit WW's vision' in Dawkins' interview where he said Ravnos wouldn't be in and Tzimisce might not be. I would lay money on something being written outside of V5's design space, mechanical and thematic since 'as far as the Sabbat' was mentioned in relation to it. Probably wrote something that was 'really, this is only playable in the Sabbat' or somesuch and had it kicked back.

[Banu_Saulot]

What I most like about Tzimisce, and hope that is shown, is how they are macabre hosts, noble and ruthless, artists, scholars, sorcerers, ruffians, warriors, rebel rousers and delusional psychopaths all in the same clan. In a way it is a wicked brew of Ventrue, Brujah and Malkavian with devil pacts sprinkled into it.

[CTPhipps]

Well, my interest in it has dropped. Most of the rest of the book seem nice enough but not essential. Without the Ravnos and Tzimisce I do not see a need to buy the book.

I imagine they're going to be inside it.

Mind you, I've heard they love the Tzimisce and want them to be perfect while Paradox actively hates the Ravnos for the reasons that they hate the Kuei-Jin. That's reddit hearsay and about as reliable as Twitter (which is to say not at all).

I also don't know what they would want rewritten about the Tzimisce. Too gorey? Not gorey enough?

[Taggie]

Doesn’t ‘rewriting’ imply that they are going to be in the book?

It does, it remains to be seen what that means, but given their insistence that the Convictions system can be used to mimick Paths, and that the sabbat will remain hidden, the interest I have in what exactly the Tzim will be is low, as Convictions cannot mimick paths, at all, the link to (extremely squicky and abusive forced relationships with) humans destroys that idea straight away (mostly because that premise gets a flat nope, it's way to close to the bone, and forcing people to play abusive stalkers is just not on, look at the degenerations linked to the Touchstones to see what I mean)

[Trippy]

Well, my interest in it has dropped. Most of the rest of the book seem nice enough but not essential. Without the Ravnos and Tzimisce I do not see a need to buy the book.

Doesn’t ‘rewriting’ imply that they are going to be in the book?

[CajunKhan]

Well, my interest in it has dropped. Most of the rest of the book seem nice enough but not essential. Without the Ravnos and Tzimisce I do not see a need to buy the book.

Agreed. No Tzims, no interest. I'll just use my hombrew stuff to recreate them.

[Grumpy RPG Reviews]

We do know that the Players Guide is finished....but that they rejected the Ravnos and Tzimisce sections, sending them back for re-writing.

Well, my interest in it has dropped. Most of the rest of the book seem nice enough but not essential. Without the Ravnos and Tzimisce I do not see a need to buy the book.