The greatest vampire in WOD

[blackshade]

Who is in your opinion the greatest vampire of all time in the world of darkness and why? To define greatness we need to ask ''greatest in what aspect?" I would imagine everybody looks at greatness in a different way. Is greatness measured by achievements, knowledge, influence, personal power or something else? it's probably a combination of many aspects. So you can decide what criteria's matter to you.

[NuclearSnake]

No doubt the greatest Toreador that ever lived and certainly a candidate for the greatest vampire in WOD. I would put him ahead of the other Methuselah's and pretty much any other vampire as far as achievements are concerned. His accomplishment in Constantinopel was truly remarkable.

Yep. It saying something that his final death and the fall of his city marked the end of the dark ages and the end of the long night, the period of open vampiric control over human society.

[blackshade]

Michael the Patriarch. Most ancient and powerful Toreador Methuselah in the world. In many ways he epitomizes the Toreador as perfection seekers, dreaming artists and creators, but also as vain, delusional and self absorbed.

He was diablarized by his former lover Mary the Black, but he continues to live inside of her soul, sometimes assuming control when he needs to.

No doubt the greatest Toreador that ever lived and certainly a candidate for the greatest vampire in WOD. I would put him ahead of the other Methuselah's and pretty much any other vampire as far as achievements are concerned. His accomplishment in Constantinopel was truly remarkable.

[NuclearSnake]

Michael the Patriarch. Most ancient and powerful Toreador Methuselah in the world. In many ways he epitomizes the Toreador as perfection seekers, dreaming artists and creators, but also as vain, delusional and self absorbed.

He was diablarized by his former lover Mary the Black, but he continues to live inside of her soul, sometimes assuming control when he needs to.

[ChristopherZacher]

I would say the "greatest" concept for NPCs that I have enjoyed by far in canon is the Triumvirate from Constantinople by Night.

[Redwulfe]

FAVORITE CHARACTER: Jacob/Esau

FAVORITE PRINCE: Kevin Jackson

FAVORITE CAMARILLA: Critas

FAVORITE ARCHBISHOP: Ambrosio

FAVORITE SABBAT: Tally

FAVORITE ANARCH: Nines

FAVORITE INDEPENDENT: Diego Giavanni

FAVORITE CLAN: Western Ravnos

FAVORITE BLOODLINE: Eastern Ravnos

FAVORITE DISCIPLINE: Chimerstry

[rickayelm]

Lameth the Dark Messiah, he has been my favorite sense reading The Masquerade of The Red Death. For those of you who haven't read this he was a sorcerer who was embraced by Cappadocius, he mastered thaumaturgic alchemy to such a degree that he was able to counteract God's curse and give anyone Golconda.

[Nosimplehiway]

BEST SIGNATURE CHARACTER: Ramona, for teaching Kindred the importance of comfortable footwear.

BEST PRINCE: Calebros, for knowing when to walk away.

BEST RISE TO PRINCEDOM: Don Sebastion Juan Dominguez, for becoming Prince of LA on the very night of his embrace.

BEST CAMARILLA: Critias, for his work with the Council of Scales.

BEST REDLISTER: Kemintiri, for not just being evil, but for having motivations.

BEST ARCHBISHOP: Ambrosio Luis Monçada held this title until he committed the one sin no Lasombra can expiate: he failed. The title has passed to his successor, Lucita de Aragon.

BEST SABBAT: Elieser de Polanco, for showing that Lasombra work best when they are the finger tapping the first domino.

BEST ANARCH: Christopher Houghton, for turning a bad review into a Revolution.

BEST INDEPENDENT: Walter and Millie Gaspers, of Santa Clarita, CA. They are so independent they're not entirely sure other vampires exist.

BEST ASHIRRA: Tarique, for providing a story-based reason the world of vampires can include the umma.

BEST KUEI-JIN: No such thing.

BEST INCONNU: Guillaume, for finally showing us how civilized an Idealist Brujah can be.

BEST DARK AGES: The one between Rome and DaVinci. Runner-up, the one after the Late Bronze Age collapse.

BEST CLAN: Ventrue, for being the only grown-ups in the room. Runner-up: Toreador, for finding someone else willing to be the only grown-ups in the room.

BEST BLOODLINE: Old Clan Tzimisce, for being the definition of what it is to be a vampire.

BEST PATH: Path of Honorable Accord, for "just doing my job, ma'am".

BEST DISCIPLINE: Dominate, because if you can't beat 'em, make 'em join you.

BEST PROGENITOR: Baron Samedi, for being the one person on the planet who can tell Augustus Giovanni to stfu.

WORTHY MENTION: Sebastian LaCroix, for most obviously padded resume. A soldier under Napoleon would know how to pronounce LaCroix.

[No One of Consequence]

For my money, it is and always will be these guys.

[blackshade]

It depends on what you think is the best.

For me, these are the exemplars of their group and most interesting.

There's no such thing as a "best" vampire because they're evil parasitic monsters but the best at being an Anarch? Showing what makes a Camarilla Prince great? What makes the Camarilla a bunch of incestuous psychos?

Well, there's vampires who can do that.

Sorry I misunderstood.

No need to apologize. I appreciate that you are particpating in this thread. Maybe i didn't clarify my point enough.

You could look at it the same way as we look at the greats in the real world. Who is the greatest person in our history? Is it Jesus or Mohammed because of the influence they have had on multiple generations? Both dead for centuries but their ideas have lived on long after they have passed on. Or is it Napoleon because his code Napoleon influenced many laws the western society is using today? Perhaps it's a scientist that made a great discovery that we are are still benefitting from today? Newton? Einstein? etc. i was hoping for a answer in the same vein from the characters in the world of darkness. But i realize its a very difficult question to answer.

[CTPhipps]

Why? What are the criteria's you are using? A couple of people copied the way you did it but its not quite what i was going for with this thread. It seems to me you are listing your favorite vampires in different categories. I was looking for a objectief view about the greatest vampire in WOD.
I was hoping people would claim a singular vampire as the greatest and explain what criteria's they are using to make that claim.

It depends on what you think is the best.

For me, these are the exemplars of their group and most interesting.

There's no such thing as a "best" vampire because they're evil parasitic monsters but the best at being an Anarch? Showing what makes a Camarilla Prince great? What makes the Camarilla a bunch of incestuous psychos?

Well, there's vampires who can do that.

Sorry I misunderstood.

[blackshade]

Lucita for my all time FAVORITE Vampire in Vampire: The Masquerade.

Lucita again for BEST SIGNATURE CHARACTER

Lodin for BEST PRINCE (Sebastian La Croix was my runner up)

Ayisha Jocastian for BEST REDLISTER

Modius for BEST CAMARILLA (Sebastian La Croix was an almost there)

Anita Wainwright for BEST ANARCH (Maldavis came close)

Dracula for BEST INCONNU

Carolina Valez for BEST SABBAT (Harold Zettler was next)

Malkavians for BEST CLAN

The Sacrifice for BEST CHRONICLE (followed by Baptism by Fire)

Why? What are the criteria's you are using? A couple of people copied the way you did it but its not quite what i was going for with this thread. It seems to me you are listing your favorite vampires in different categories. I was looking for a objectief view about the greatest vampire in WOD.
I was hoping people would claim a singular vampire as the greatest and explain what criteria's they are using to make that claim.

[Rock113]

Ur-Shulgi for BEST TROLL CHARACTER SHEET

To be honest I don’t think he needs stats.

What makes you think that?


DA: Mage talks about those that Hermetics call Hedgemages (p.135). And it's very explicit that what they do it's not the same as what mages do. It's specifically called out that some mortals practice magick outside the Foundation/Pillar system that lacks the mutability of what mages can do, and that mages lose the power to do this kind of magick the moment they get a Foundation.

Well, this may be off the topic. But I always think Awakened and Sorcerer are different things, although some books use Hedge Magic to represent True Magick for convenience.

And, uh, I think True Magick has nothing to do with Spheres or Pillars or anything else, they ‘re just various ways to capture, use and represent Magicks, but not TM itself. You can let prehistoric mages use Spheres system, which likes Dead Magic. But this doesn’t mean mages of this time REALLY have this structure.

[Aleph]

Ur-Shulgi for BEST TROLL CHARACTER SHEET

White Wolf retconned this at one point but as I understand current canon, there's actually not a hard difference between Sorcerers and True Mages prior to the Council of Nine.

What makes you think that?

DA: Mage talks about those that Hermetics call Hedgemages (p.135). And it's very explicit that what they do it's not the same as what mages do. It's specifically called out that some mortals practice magick outside the Foundation/Pillar system that lacks the mutability of what mages can do, and that mages lose the power to do this kind of magick the moment they get a Foundation.

[CTPhipps]

He is a 500-1000 year-old magnus, who is super old even in mages. I also don’t think he is a Sorcerer.

And Tafani... maybe? He was born between 500-1000 BC.

Well, he also planned very well before assamites assaulted him.

White Wolf retconned this at one point but as I understand current canon, there's actually not a hard difference between Sorcerers and True Mages prior to the Council of Nine. It required the Traditions pooling all their resources together to create the flexible Sphere system in the same way that we know more about Physics and Electricity today than we did 1000 years ago. It also fits with the Book of Nod in that Caine WAS an awakened True Mage taught by Lilith but his Spheres manifested as the classic Disciplines.

While it takes away some of the poignancy of the curse, I like the idea that the Order of Hermes obsessive research and scientific experimentation was actually yielding dividends.