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[Spoilers] Cults of the Blood Gods discussion

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  • Originally posted by CTPhipps View Post

    What development is that?

    Edit:

    Ah, Lucita.
    It's rumoured in Chicago by Night 5E that Talley killed her, though I imagine they are leaving their options open on the truth of that for when the Sabbat comes back from the Crusade.
    I do like the nods that the Sabbat are not all gone, there are a few pockets left, could have some interesting Chronicles as the Camarilla have been stated to be giving former Sabbat strongholds a wide berth. So a Chronicle of the few Sabbat packs left in a large city to fend for themselves against the SI could be interesting!

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    • Originally posted by CTPhipps View Post

      Pretty much. It's a Cyclical Gehenna apparently of the kind similar to The Feast of Folly.
      Originally posted by Mithras304 View Post
      Yea I do like the Cyclical Gehenna introduced in BJD, removes that Sword of Damocles feel I always got with Gehenna!
      You could still have the world even if it's a cyclical process rather than a one-time thing. Even if we assume that the 'Wheel of Ages' ends up with the horrible times leading into better times, whose to say the process is 100% efficient? Each cycle could be a little less better than the worse (entropy, chaos, resources used up, call it what you will) so there could be a point where the world - if not reality - just 'wears out.'

      This could be especially true if there are other supernatural or metaphysical variables straining the system as it were, rather than Vampires being the only (or most significant) factor. Or if any sort of apocalyptic scenario could come in one (or more) forms or different sources (even if we DO restrict it to vampires, whose to say that it doesn't vary depending on the particular Ancient and their method of winning? If Ennoia 'wins' because she corrupted the earth and is swallowing vampires like some titanic land-shark, its not going to be like Lasombra or Tzimisce and their preferred endgame approach. Or Malkav. Or even Tremere.)

      I actually like the idea of there still being some uncertainty about 'the end' even if its not guaranteed the end like was originally planned. More open ended but still a touch ominous.

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      • Originally posted by Mister_Dunpeal View Post



        You could still have the world even if it's a cyclical process rather than a one-time thing. Even if we assume that the 'Wheel of Ages' ends up with the horrible times leading into better times, whose to say the process is 100% efficient? Each cycle could be a little less better than the worse (entropy, chaos, resources used up, call it what you will) so there could be a point where the world - if not reality - just 'wears out.'

        This could be especially true if there are other supernatural or metaphysical variables straining the system as it were, rather than Vampires being the only (or most significant) factor. Or if any sort of apocalyptic scenario could come in one (or more) forms or different sources (even if we DO restrict it to vampires, whose to say that it doesn't vary depending on the particular Ancient and their method of winning? If Ennoia 'wins' because she corrupted the earth and is swallowing vampires like some titanic land-shark, its not going to be like Lasombra or Tzimisce and their preferred endgame approach. Or Malkav. Or even Tremere.)

        I actually like the idea of there still being some uncertainty about 'the end' even if its not guaranteed the end like was originally planned. More open ended but still a touch ominous.
        For me personally I prefer the idea that Gehenna isn't the end of existence, just an end of the world as it's known, the change of one into another. Ultimately my draw to Vampire is the Strings of Machiavellian plots drawing up to the mysterious Ancient beings as they play chess with the world. I love the feel of the struggle with the beast and all that stuff. The approaching end of everything just doesn't do anything for me.

        It's totally a preference thing, and I know some folk love the impending end of all storyline, that's the advantage of being able to tell your own stories!

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        • I wonder what the symbol for the Hecata is going to be? Unlike most of the rest of the clans, they don't have have a symbol that can just be modernized. Or they have a lot of them, the Giovanni 'G', the Cappadocian crest with the double scythes, the Samedi tophat, The Harbingers of Skulls mask, and the Lamia gorgon head. But obviously none of these fit the Hecata as a whole. Does anyone have any ideas of what it might end up being?

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          • Originally posted by theghostbat View Post
            I wonder what the symbol for the Hecata is going to be? Unlike most of the rest of the clans, they don't have have a symbol that can just be modernized. Or they have a lot of them, the Giovanni 'G', the Cappadocian crest with the double scythes, the Samedi tophat, The Harbingers of Skulls mask, and the Lamia gorgon head. But obviously none of these fit the Hecata as a whole. Does anyone have any ideas of what it might end up being?
            There's frequent references to the Three Faces of Death, maybe something along those lines? (Or something around Decay, Death, Renewel, another prominent theme in the book)
            Or something related to Hecate the Goddess?

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            • Lucita might well end up running something, but it won't be the traditional Sabbat or Infernalist Sabbat or Shriner Sabbat. I'm not certain what it would be. Maybe a violent Inconnu.

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              • Originally posted by Mithras304 View Post
                There's frequent references to the Three Faces of Death, maybe something along those lines? (Or something around Decay, Death, Renewel, another prominent theme in the book)
                Or something related to Hecate the Goddess?
                Well Hecate is a three-faced goddess, so that is probable. One of the most common symbols associated with her is three crossed torches or keys, and then there's Hecate's Wheel. So maybe something resembling one of them?
                Last edited by theghostbat; 01-05-2020, 06:20 PM.

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                • Originally posted by theghostbat View Post
                  I wonder what the symbol for the Hecata is going to be?
                  A top hat, with a big G on it, sitting on a gorgon skull, and a pair of scythes in the background, all surrounded by a ring of dead puppies.

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                  • Originally posted by Grumpy RPG Reviews View Post
                    Lucita might well end up running something, but it won't be the traditional Sabbat or Infernalist Sabbat or Shriner Sabbat. I'm not certain what it would be. Maybe a violent Inconnu.
                    I find it kind of funny that a character that is defined as, "An elder who hates her sire, her Clan, and is obsessed with the concept of never being controlled" is someone never ever called an Anarch.
                    Last edited by CTPhipps; 01-05-2020, 07:43 PM.


                    Author of Cthulhu Armageddon, I was a Teenage Weredeer, Straight Outta Fangton, Lucifer's Star, and the Supervillainy Saga.

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                    • Originally posted by CTPhipps View Post
                      I find it kind of funny that a character that is defined as, "An elder who hates her sire, her Clan, and is obsessed with the concept of never being controlled" is someone no one ever called an Anarch.
                      That is part of the problem with the classic depiction of the Anarchs - they really did not get enough love, or respect, in the form of interesting NPCs. She was described as autarkis, I think, which seems like it is overly specific.

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                      • In the past editions, being anarch was being a rebel member of the Camarilla, but Camarilla anyway. In the same way that being Black hand or a Inquisitor was a status inside the Sabbat. They were subfactions. Now the Anarchs are a true faction, a new one. And the older wild cards as Lucita or Anatole are not Anarchs probably because they still view them as a Camarilla pawns. Furthermore, Anarch status is not achieved by lineage or pedigree, but fame and compromise with the cause. Lucita could be a free soul, but she was a mercenary, she did not fought for a cause.

                        The question is, who are the true anarch icons and leaders? Marguerite Foccart, Salvador García and Tyler? Jeremy Mcneill, Armando Rodríguez and Dominique? The chicagoans Gengis and Maldavis? None of them was a signature character, any of them fill pages and pages of a dozen books and novels, that is the real reason behind the forced "conversion" of Theo Bell to the Anarchism and the new invention of Rudi and Agatha Starek. They are short of referents for this new faction. Specially, if you take the ancient anarchs (Foccart, Tyler, McNeill) out of the stage.

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                        • Originally posted by Mithras304 View Post
                          He's stated to be an advisor or in collusion with the Capuchin.
                          I understood that he was before the Hecata's change...

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                          • Originally posted by Irad the Strong View Post

                            I understood that he was before the Hecata's change...
                            Nope, before the "regime change" he was some sort of free agent for the anziani (and not a very loyal one as those who played Giovanni chronicles know). Currently he's said (so it's a rumor not a fact) to be an advisor for the Capuchin

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                            • While I appreciate everyone's devotion to protecting people. It's kind of marked SPOILERS in the title of the thread.


                              Author of Cthulhu Armageddon, I was a Teenage Weredeer, Straight Outta Fangton, Lucifer's Star, and the Supervillainy Saga.

                              Forum Terms of Use
                              the Contact Us link.

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                              • Originally posted by CTPhipps View Post

                                I find it kind of funny that a character that is defined as, "An elder who hates her sire, her Clan, and is obsessed with the concept of never being controlled" is someone never ever called an Anarch.
                                From the moment she and Fatima managed to kill Moncanda Lucita lost her hold on her beast. That's quite clearly explained by 2 facts (1) she had already lost her moral compass (Anatole) and she had dealt with her hated sire, when doing so meant losing another constant that had defined her existence through the centuries. That's why she began to slip and consequently why she started to see the appeal of the Sabbat's paths of enlightenment. In BJD (Montreal chapter IIRC) it's made perfectly clear that Lucita was feeling attracted by inhuman rites and in the Mexico City chapter she's put forward as one of the strongest candidates for the regency. The only thing that could potentially contraddict this outcome (imo) is the fact half the Lasombra left the Sabbat which means having a Lasombra as regent would be politically inconvenient for the Sect.

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