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Valeren/Obeah and the Clan Salubri in V5

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  • Valeren/Obeah and the Clan Salubri in V5

    Hey people, I've been wondering, it was kinda interesting how they made Oblivion a Discipline for both Hecata and Lasombra (and basically separated Obtenetration and Necromancy in two branches, adding Ceremonies to the latter), and we all are discussing about Vicissitude and Tzimisce, but how about the other Clans, with the return of the Cappadocians and disintegration of the Tremere Clan, what better time for the Salubri to return (in some way or another, with or without Saulot)?
    And the fun quesiton is, how will their Discipline Valeren/Obeah be brought? Will it be an Amalgam power of Auspex and Fortitude to analyse life force and a second level to cure? Will it be part of a new Discipline in V5? I was even wondering if they would make some sort of hybrid like Oblivion is, but focused on the body and mind. Like Obeah changes the mind and heals the body, Vicissitude changes the body and fu%ks the mind, it's kind of an interesting pair, and given the historic mess with Tremere, Saulot and Tzimisce, it fits nicely.
    So what you think?

  • #2
    One homebrew I've seen gave them the discipline of Orison, shared between all Salubri castes and also the Baali. (So merging Obeah, Valeren, and Daimonion.)

    But if they do come back officially, I doubt there'll be any tie-in with Vicissitude. Chicago by Night implied pretty heavily that Tzimisce fleshcrafting is now Protean.

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    • #3
      For the Salubri in my game I've rolled various Obeah and Valeren powers into one Discipline and called it Valeren.

      I initially looked at making it powers which amalgam Auspex other Disciplines, but I realised that making nine different Valeren & Obeah powers amalgams and then trying to figure out which third Discipline to have made far less sense than just going "they have Auspex, Fortitude and Valeren."

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      • #4
        There are two bloodlines that are Formerly clans, I doubt this is going to be the way things go but it might be an interesting thought experiment to combine Obeah/Valeren and Chimestry a discipline of Truth and Lies.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Lian View Post
          There are two bloodlines that are Formerly clans, I doubt this is going to be the way things go but it might be an interesting thought experiment to combine Obeah/Valeren and Chimestry a discipline of Truth and Lies.
          I'm not entirely convinced we're going to see Chimestry to be fair. The Hecata are stated as the only independent clan, and the Ravnos haven't been mentioned as a member of any of the Sects.
          To me this suggests they have been written out of the game entirely, or they have joined the Sabbat (Which I would raise an eyebrow at frankly!).
          Though there is a possibility they've been demoted to Bloodline status as there are so few left, so they aren't factored in by the other 'Great Clans' anymore. But to be honest I think the current mindset of the creators is to move away from the controversialness of the Ravnos. If we do see them though, I suspect they will fold Chimestry into Obfuscate as Obfuscate messes with the minds of others to make the Vampire 'vanish', so the illusion creating is a similar vein.

          With Valeren/Obeah, I think if it isn't it's own Discipline it could well be put into either Auspex or Fortituide requiring an Amalgam of the other. However if it was an amalgam of those two that leaves them with a third open Discipline. Personally I think it should be a separate power though.

          I do hope we see then come back though, I have a feeling when they cover the Sabbat/Gehenna War they will pop up in that.

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          • #6
            You could have one 'core' Salubri discipline (tied to redemption perhaps) that could amalgam with other powers to reflect the different 'groups' of Salubri (healer, Warrior, etc.)

            I could see the various bloodlines brought together to serve various roles (save mortals like the Warriors do, heal, search for information like the watchers, etc.) Possibly even other factions (baali?)

            I think depending on whether you think Saulot lived or not might shape their motives though. If he's alive their 'beckoning' might be entirely different than how its usually depicted (not necessarily for any conflict, but it would be serving whatever inscrutable ends Saulot has) If he isn't, then they're a bloodline.

            Another possibility is having the Salubri 'reappear' as Golconda missionaries trying to 'save' vampires. Whether this is legit or some secret evil plot could be left open ended. For added grimness, have those who refuse to be 'saved' end up getting destroyed by the warriors.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Mister_Dunpeal View Post
              You could have one 'core' Salubri discipline (tied to redemption perhaps) that could amalgam with other powers to reflect the different 'groups' of Salubri (healer, Warrior, etc.)
              That's a cool idea! I rather like that.

              Originally posted by Mister_Dunpeal View Post
              Another possibility is having the Salubri 'reappear' as Golconda missionaries trying to 'save' vampires. Whether this is legit or some secret evil plot could be left open ended. For added grimness, have those who refuse to be 'saved' end up getting destroyed by the warriors.
              Sounds legit to me!

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              • #8
                In my game I’ve been assuming if they show up they’ll have Auspex, Fortitude, and Presence with specific powers being Auspex/Fortitude, Fortitudes/Presence, or Auspex/Presence Amalgams. The protective aura, for example, is Presence 3 Amalgam requiring Fortitude 2. Anesthetic Touch is Fortitude with either Auspex or Presence (I still haven’t decided). I always thought Presence made sense for them anyways


                "The only consistent wisdom is in knowing you know nothing" ~ Socrates

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                • #9
                  Yeah, I believe in the vein of V5 their power would be Amalgam-like. But I don't know, having Auspex and Presence and Fortitude seem like Toreador with resistance instead of speed, but I guess that's what it is.
                  In all honesty I love the Salubri vibe and vampire-martyrs with dark past (and intentions), but in V5 it might be hard to put them in. And I'm certainly not hoping that TalMaheRa or Inconnu keep popping up again showing off weird bloodlines, clans and crazy plots all over.
                  But yeah, remember that Salubri art in the Build a Better World (For You) chapter of the Anarch V5 book? It gave an itch

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Banu_Saulot View Post
                    But yeah, remember that Salubri art in the Build a Better World (For You) chapter of the Anarch V5 book?
                    I don't, cause there isn't any Salubri art in the section you mentioned.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by GilbyTheFat View Post
                      I don't, cause there isn't any Salubri art in the section you mentioned.
                      It is in page 114 (115/201) with the text Expiration Date right besides it. I would like to post a print but the site says I can't post an attachment God knows why.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Banu_Saulot View Post
                        It is in page 114 (115/201) with the text Expiration Date right besides it. I would like to post a print but the site says I can't post an attachment God knows why.
                        The lady in the art wearing the sun glasses and the watchmen cap doesn't have a third eye.

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                        • #13
                          She does in fact.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by omenseer View Post
                            She does in fact.
                            I literally looked at it. There is literally no third eye.

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                            • #15
                              Just to stop an argument before it starts: Here is a picture from my version of the Original Anarch book for V5 --->



                              As can be clearly seen in the original, she could be seen with a third eye open, but later versions hid/removed it for some reason.

                              And while we are on the subject: Really hope the Salubri gets their own unique Discipline with Amalgams to represent different Castes within the Clan at large, just as stated above. Having the entire Discipline based on Amalgams from base Disciplines makes no sense Lore or Canonwise and would be a very lazy and really bad design choice IMO.

                              Hope that helps!

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